After 2 years, just as we were planning our first event, CV19 hit - where is our support!?

Robvanwilder

Hi all, so this is a really frustrating situation. We have 2 years sweat equity in a laser-tag and team building business, (we designed and built all our own targeting systems etc.) We're also 4 figures in costs wise. We had finally got to a point where we could launch and had started putting together our first team building event for 20 people, the local newspaper and business contacts etc. Then the virus hit and we obviously decided against it, then lockdown happened and we appear to have lost everything. The landscape for such a business seems uncertain at the least for us after restrictions are lifted, and in order for us to really survive it, we are going to need more equipment so we can focus on the laser-tag side. We were going to start "small" without our own venue, focus on the team-building, and build the business up "the hard way." But - the idea now of coming out of this and just traveling around to other people's events and venues, and trying to get team-building bookings that require groups of 15/20 people to band together, with zero control over the situation from a health safety point of view, is obviously not a good idea, especially for the first few months after lockdown.

Couple that with the fact that it's abundantly clear that life isn't just going to go back to "normal" as soon as the restrictions are lifted, and people are going to be uneasy about going to events and random venues, fairs and "days out" etc, and I'm sure you can see where we feel we are with the business now. Basically, the only real way we can see any chance of surviving, (without having to wait on universal credit being forced to find other work for the next 8 months which is obviously going to be hard to find given how many people are going to be in the same boat,) is to get our own venue and more equipment and try to start with a bigger laser-tag offering, (we only have a small number of pistols at this stage, and were going to focus more on the team building and small-scale target shooting until we could afford more "weapons" for the proper laser-tag.)

Buuuuut - the only possible way to do that would be with the bounce back loans, but they are based on last year's turnover, not projected turn over for the period that is ACTUALLY being disrupted, so we're not even entitled to that! We're not entitled to anything as far as we can tell, and certainly not any personal credit, and yes we might not have actually started trading, but we have 2 years sweat equity in it, and 4 figures of cash, and were literally in the middle of organising our first event so by our standards, we 110% have been royalled screwed by the virus! But that's it isn't it? No one cares, we're not elligible for anything and we just have to accept we've just wasted 2 years of hard work and all that money!?

Why is there no support for start-ups that don't have a year's worth of trading or turnover? Are we just "too small" to be worth support? What are we missing? If anyone could please give me some advice, even if it is just to confirm our fears, because then at least we will know to shelf everything we've done and accept defeat, at least for the rest of the year, it would be greatly appreciated thanks?

[Deleted User]

Robvanwilder said:

Hi all, so this is a really frustrating situation. We have 2 years sweat equity in a laser-tag and team building business, (we designed and built all our own targeting systems etc.) We're also 4 figures in costs wise. We had finally got to a point where we could launch and had started putting together our first team building event for 20 people, the local newspaper and business contacts etc. Then the virus hit and we obviously decided against it, then lockdown happened and we appear to have lost everything. The landscape for such a business seems uncertain at the least for us after restrictions are lifted, and in order for us to really survive it, we are going to need more equipment so we can focus on the laser-tag side. We were going to start "small" without our own venue, focus on the team-building, and build the business up "the hard way." But - the idea now of coming out of this and just traveling around to other people's events and venues, and trying to get team-building bookings that require groups of 15/20 people to band together, with zero control over the situation from a health safety point of view, is obviously not a good idea, especially for the first few months after lockdown.

Couple that with the fact that it's abundantly clear that life isn't just going to go back to "normal" as soon as the restrictions are lifted, and people are going to be uneasy about going to events and random venues, fairs and "days out" etc, and I'm sure you can see where we feel we are with the business now. Basically, the only real way we can see any chance of surviving, (without having to wait on universal credit being forced to find other work for the next 8 months which is obviously going to be hard to find given how many people are going to be in the same boat,) is to get our own venue and more equipment and try to start with a bigger laser-tag offering, (we only have a small number of pistols at this stage, and were going to focus more on the team building and small-scale target shooting until we could afford more "weapons" for the proper laser-tag.)

Buuuuut - the only possible way to do that would be with the bounce back loans, but they are based on last year's turnover, not projected turn over for the period that is ACTUALLY being disrupted, so we're not even entitled to that! We're not entitled to anything as far as we can tell, and certainly not any personal credit, and yes we might not have actually started trading, but we have 2 years sweat equity in it, and 4 figures of cash, and were literally in the middle of organising our first event so by our standards, we 110% have been royalled screwed by the virus! But that's it isn't it? No one cares, we're not elligible for anything and we just have to accept we've just wasted 2 years of hard work and all that money!?

Why is there no support for start-ups that don't have a year's worth of trading or turnover? Are we just "too small" to be worth support? What are we missing? If anyone could please give me some advice, even if it is just to confirm our fears, because then at least we will know to shelf everything we've done and accept defeat, at least for the rest of the year, it would be greatly appreciated thanks?

 No, because if they helped startups there would be every Tom, D**k & Harry claiming to be a startup to get the money. 

Jeremy535897

The bounce back loans cannot only be for established traders who have a track record of turnover, because they allow claims by businesses that were only set up as recently as February 2020. I think if you were organising your first event in January, you might be able to argue you were trading, although that can be the date of your first sale for some purposes. See this from the FAQs about the loans:

"Businesses who were trading prior to 1 March 2020, are less than two years old and have been negatively impacted by COVID-19 can, subject to full Scheme eligibility, consider applying for both a Bounce Back Loan and a Start Up Loan. Borrower protection differs under the schemes and businesses should consider carefully the type of finance they require.

Existing Start Up Loans customers are also able to apply to borrow under the Bounce Back Loan Scheme."

From https://www.british-business-bank.co.uk/ourpartners/coronavirus-business-interruption-loan-schemes/bounce-back-loans/faqs-for-small-businesses/

Robvanwilder

To _shel - as stated by the nice Jeremy above, no that makes no sense because it states that you have to be set up before 1st March 2020, and we've been incorporated for 2 years.

To Jeremy - thank you very much, we hadn't seen that in the FAQs but again, it does seem to state what we thought, we are definitely entitled, but most instances of the wording says that's down to your turnover from 2019, which makes no sense. I guess we should go with what the BBB say, and that is that we are eligible, and just see what happens! Thanks.

Grumpy_chap

There is another thread where people have commented that for a start up, the projected turnover for this year can be used if no proven past turnover:
https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/6138528/bounce-back-loans#latest

Given all you have said in the OP, your business plan will have a clearly evidenced projected turnover you can use as a basis of BBLS application.  It is still a loan, though, and still a need to be paid back.

warby68

OP, how have you been supporting yourselves over the 2 years to build the business?

LilElvis

Do you realistically have a viable business as we head into a recession? Will companies really be willing to spend money on unnecessary things such as "team building" when they will be struggling just to keep their teams employed? 

sharpe106

LilElvis said:

Do you realistically have a viable business as we head into a recession? Will companies really be willing to spend money on unnecessary things such as "team building" when they will be struggling just to keep their teams employed? 

Yes some companies always seem to have money for pointless exercises. No money to hire the right amount of staff or pay staff properly but things that make managers look good always money in the kitty for that. 

[Deleted User]

I remember laser tag being quite big in the early 90s and remember going to a couple of events but this really died down late 90s and nearly all closed. The few laser tags I've seen emerge in recent years have all closed down. It is a really difficult business to operate and now made even more difficult due to the virus so wish you all the best. Have you ever thought about possibly finding an indoor venue but also included space outside for outdoor events and focus on an outdoor laser tag for the short term especially with summer on the way, and which possibly might well work better during this pandemic. You can market yourself as being a safer alternative to paintball where people obviously have to wear plastic masks which aren't overly hygienic. I assume you don't wear specific masks for your laser tag game?

becky3343

I'm sorry for your situation. After all that work, it must be gutting to be going through this. As with any recession though, not everyone loses out and there are lots of people who make it work in their favour as long as they're willing to adapt. Have you thought about changing your plans? Even after lockdown ends, it looks like a lot of people are still going to be encouraged to work from home. I'd imagine companies at some point will be open to virtual team building exercises for employees who are no longer having or are reducing face to face meetings etc. Zoom has obviously soared during these times so I wonder if you could think of a fun way to keep your business going through coach led games/meetings or something like an app. My physical business has been closed for 2 months but in that time, I've diversified into more virtual sales and started a new small business which is now bringing in 30+ orders a week in just a few weeks and will continue to grow post-covid. I wouldn't have thought of this if I didn't have to take a break from my physical business. I would take this time to really explore your options, diversify and keep your startup spirit going. You could end up stronger and in a better position than before