Amigo loans sold to First Credit (Intrum?) - please help

Bill11

Good afternoon,
Long story short:
1. I took out a loan with Amigo in mid 2015  for a close friend who needed cash. The formal reason given to Amigo was - I wanted to go on holiday (yeah, right, lol). No checks were done on the side of Amigo regarding purpose of the loan and affordability.
2. The loan is in my name and my friend acted as a guarantor as he had property at the time. He was not able to take credit at that time himself due to being already fully loaded.
3. My friend was paying the loan, by giving me the money, which I effectively paid to amigo.
4. In early 2018 my friend's circumstances drastically changed to a degree where he couldn't pay anymore. He does not own anything and has no funds now.
5. I did complain to Amigo, tried to explain that I never was the beneficiary of the funds, etc etc to no avail.
6. Since August 2018 I was stuck with a loan which I couldn't pay either so entered into arrangement with Amigo for a reduced payment. The arrangement didn't even cover the interest and every month the debt would increase even though I was making payments as amigo refused to freeze interest, i.e. I would pay £100 every month instead of £200 (split by ~170 interest and 30 repayment). Therefore, each month regardless of my payment - £97 would be added to the debt as interest. Amigo did not inform me of this at any time.
7. Today I found out that my loan has been sold to first credit (presumably Intrum?). I did not receive any notification or anything, I found out by accident when tried to make a regular payment to Amigo. However, I do note that I did not update my details with Amigo for more than 5 years, so they probably hold old details apart from my mobile. Intrum has not contacted me so far.
8. I note that considering all the payments that were made to Amigo between Mid 2015 - to date, the initial amount of £5,000 borrowed + additional interest was repaid, i..e Amigo definitely made money on their 5,000 loan albeit not as much as they would expect.

Questions:
1. Were they able to sell on my debt without receiving my consent, i.e. shouldn't they be certain that I have received a letter that my debt is sold? The address they have on file would definitely get the letters bounced back. Amigo never informed me over the phone either.
2. The debt that was sold - am I still being charged 50% APR on it or is it now just a fixed amount that will not increase?
3. How would be actual amount of debt owed to Intrum be calculated?
4. Do I have any recourse against Amigo? Or is it now just with Intrum?
5. Is there any way of not paying the full debt e.g. paying only 30% off considering that I have already paid in excess of 5,000 initially borrowed? 
6. Is the guarantor in the picture? Am I able to shift the debt to his name? Or guarantor is now out of the picture?
7. Once the debt was sold - does it stay on my credit rating or it's now not a formal loan anymore? i.e. it's now similar to a PCN that is outstanding and debt collector chases for.
8. Am I charged for any missing payments etc, at the moment? Any interest?

Please let me know what are my options are and whether I have any options to fight this.

Thank you for your time reading this and appreciate any help.

Cheers,
Bill

[Deleted User]

I would be more concerned that I had borrowed money from them without (lets say) telling the truth, they can sell any debt to anyone they chose .

Bill11

Not sure how that is a concern on my end, if anything, borrowing at 50% APR for a holiday surely should raise some concerns on the borrower's side.

I also checked my ClearScore by equifax, and  I can see that the loan is still with Amigo and the amount is 4800. Does it mean that Intrum will try to recover 4800 from me or they will try to recover 4800 + arrears + any interest on top? How does it work?

sourcrates

Bill11 said:

Questions:
1. Were they able to sell on my debt without receiving my consent, i.e. shouldn't they be certain that I have received a letter that my debt is sold? The address they have on file would definitely get the letters bounced back. Amigo never informed me over the phone either.
2. The debt that was sold - am I still being charged 50% APR on it or is it now just a fixed amount that will not increase?
3. How would be actual amount of debt owed to Intrum be calculated?
4. Do I have any recourse against Amigo? Or is it now just with Intrum?
5. Is there any way of not paying the full debt e.g. paying only 30% off considering that I have already paid in excess of 5,000 initially borrowed? 
6. Is the guarantor in the picture? Am I able to shift the debt to his name? Or guarantor is now out of the picture?
7. Once the debt was sold - does it stay on my credit rating or it's now not a formal loan anymore? i.e. it's now similar to a PCN that is outstanding and debt collector chases for.
8. Am I charged for any missing payments etc, at the moment? Any interest?

Please let me know what are my options are and whether I have any options to fight this.

Thank you for your time reading this and appreciate any help.

Cheers,
Bill

Answers.

(1) Yes, in a nutshell, the agreement you have with them will allow this.

(2) Depends if the loan defaulted, if it did, it would show the date of default on your credit file, and all interest and charges would be frozen permanantly, If it didn`t default, then it was sold as a going concern and Intrum can charge you interest as per the original agreement.

They tend not to default Guarentor loans as they have the fallback of the guarentor to chase, and to keep charging you interest as well.

(3) The same as if the loan had completed as per your agreement.

(4) Debt collectors are always open to making a deal, however you are not in the best of positions as they hold all the cards.

(5) Some people have had complaints for unafordable borrowing upheld, try a written complaint to Amigo and see how you get on.

(6) If you, the debtor, don`t pay, then they will chase the Guarentor for the full amount.

(7) Stays for 6 years from date of default, if not defaulted can be longer.

(8) Depends on answer to question (2).

John_

Bill11 said:

Not sure how that is a concern on my end, if anything, borrowing at 50% APR for a holiday surely should raise some concerns on the borrower's side.

I also checked my ClearScore by equifax, and  I can see that the loan is still with Amigo and the amount is 4800. Does it mean that Intrum will try to recover 4800 from me or they will try to recover 4800 + arrears + any interest on top? How does it work?

This really doesn’t make sense. If your friend had good enough credit to be a guarantor then he had good enough credit to borrow himself, so why did you act as guarantor?
Anyway, you committed fraud on the application, and this isn’t a good reason to try to get out of your obligations.

DCFC79

John_ said:

Bill11 said:

Not sure how that is a concern on my end, if anything, borrowing at 50% APR for a holiday surely should raise some concerns on the borrower's side.

I also checked my ClearScore by equifax, and  I can see that the loan is still with Amigo and the amount is 4800. Does it mean that Intrum will try to recover 4800 from me or they will try to recover 4800 + arrears + any interest on top? How does it work?

This really doesn’t make sense. If your friend had good enough credit to be a guarantor then he had good enough credit to borrow himself, so why did you act as guarantor?
Anyway, you committed fraud on the application, and this isn’t a good reason to try to get out of your obligations.

I understood the friend was the guarantor.

Bill11

sourcrates said:

Bill11 said:

Questions:
1. Were they able to sell on my debt without receiving my consent, i.e. shouldn't they be certain that I have received a letter that my debt is sold? The address they have on file would definitely get the letters bounced back. Amigo never informed me over the phone either.
2. The debt that was sold - am I still being charged 50% APR on it or is it now just a fixed amount that will not increase?
3. How would be actual amount of debt owed to Intrum be calculated?
4. Do I have any recourse against Amigo? Or is it now just with Intrum?
5. Is there any way of not paying the full debt e.g. paying only 30% off considering that I have already paid in excess of 5,000 initially borrowed? 
6. Is the guarantor in the picture? Am I able to shift the debt to his name? Or guarantor is now out of the picture?
7. Once the debt was sold - does it stay on my credit rating or it's now not a formal loan anymore? i.e. it's now similar to a PCN that is outstanding and debt collector chases for.
8. Am I charged for any missing payments etc, at the moment? Any interest?

Please let me know what are my options are and whether I have any options to fight this.

Thank you for your time reading this and appreciate any help.

Cheers,
Bill

Answers.

(1) Yes, in a nutshell, the agreement you have with them will allow this.

(2) Depends if the loan defaulted, if it did, it would show the date of default on your credit file, and all interest and charges would be frozen permanantly, If it didn`t default, then it was sold as a going concern and Intrum can charge you interest as per the original agreement.

They tend not to default Guarentor loans as they have the fallback of the guarentor to chase, and to keep charging you interest as well.

(3) The same as if the loan had completed as per your agreement.

(4) Debt collectors are always open to making a deal, however you are not in the best of positions as they hold all the cards.

(5) Some people have had complaints for unafordable borrowing upheld, try a written complaint to Amigo and see how you get on.

(6) If you, the debtor, don`t pay, then they will chase the Guarentor for the full amount.

(7) Stays for 6 years from date of default, if not defaulted can be longer.

(8) Depends on answer to question (2).

Hi, thank you for your response. 

Regarding point (2) - I don't think that the loan has defaulted as I have been making monthly payments of £100 as per arrangement with Amigo. If I default on the loan - would they seek to recover it from me regardless or go to the guarantor? I am asking because at the time I had a dispute with Amigo they told me that they will go after both of us to SCC.

Regarding point (3) - so does it mean 5,000 initially borrowed + 5 years of 50% APR? And that's regardless of what I have paid so far? This is crazy.

Regarding point (4) - I assume if I refuse to pay they will just go after the guarantor? What happens in case of court proceedings?

Regarding point (5) - am I still able to do that even though the debt was passed on?

Regarding point (6) - how this will be reflected on my credit score? If i just default do I get a CCJ?

Bill11

DCFC79 said:

John_ said:

Bill11 said:

Not sure how that is a concern on my end, if anything, borrowing at 50% APR for a holiday surely should raise some concerns on the borrower's side.

I also checked my ClearScore by equifax, and  I can see that the loan is still with Amigo and the amount is 4800. Does it mean that Intrum will try to recover 4800 from me or they will try to recover 4800 + arrears + any interest on top? How does it work?

This really doesn’t make sense. If your friend had good enough credit to be a guarantor then he had good enough credit to borrow himself, so why did you act as guarantor?
Anyway, you committed fraud on the application, and this isn’t a good reason to try to get out of your obligations.

I understood the friend was the guarantor.

That's correct, the friend was a guarantor.

Regardless of what John_ said, I could say that I want to borrow money to build a rocket and fly to the moon, it's for the lender to assess whether the reason given is credible and appropriate. I doubt that you understand that legal concept of fraud John, therefore I would ask you to refrain from any further comments, cheers pal.

I didn't act as a guarantor. My friend at that time was fully loaded on credit already, therefore he couldn't borrow any more money. Considering how Amigo performed their checks, i.e. "no checks" at all, it's no surprise he qualified to be a guarantor. 

[Deleted User]

Bill11 said:

DCFC79 said:

John_ said:

Bill11 said:

Not sure how that is a concern on my end, if anything, borrowing at 50% APR for a holiday surely should raise some concerns on the borrower's side.

I also checked my ClearScore by equifax, and  I can see that the loan is still with Amigo and the amount is 4800. Does it mean that Intrum will try to recover 4800 from me or they will try to recover 4800 + arrears + any interest on top? How does it work?

This really doesn’t make sense. If your friend had good enough credit to be a guarantor then he had good enough credit to borrow himself, so why did you act as guarantor?
Anyway, you committed fraud on the application, and this isn’t a good reason to try to get out of your obligations.

I understood the friend was the guarantor.

That's correct, the friend was a guarantor.

Regardless of what John_ said, I could say that I want to borrow money to build a rocket and fly to the moon, it's for the lender to assess whether the reason given is credible and appropriate. I doubt that you understand that legal concept of fraud John, therefore I would ask you to refrain from any further comments, cheers pal.

I didn't act as a guarantor. My friend at that time was fully loaded on credit already, therefore he couldn't borrow any more money. Considering how Amigo performed their checks, i.e. "no checks" at all, it's no surprise he qualified to be a guarantor. 

Thats not how it works it is for you to tell them honestly why you want to borrow the money, they can and sometimes do check this out but they don't have to. So literally your friend couldn't borrow any more money so you borrowed some for him, didn't that set alarm bells ringing before today? preferably before you did it?   Would you like to explain what you think the legal concept of fraud is?

sourcrates

Bill11 said:

sourcrates said:

Bill11 said:

Questions:
1. Were they able to sell on my debt without receiving my consent, i.e. shouldn't they be certain that I have received a letter that my debt is sold? The address they have on file would definitely get the letters bounced back. Amigo never informed me over the phone either.
2. The debt that was sold - am I still being charged 50% APR on it or is it now just a fixed amount that will not increase?
3. How would be actual amount of debt owed to Intrum be calculated?
4. Do I have any recourse against Amigo? Or is it now just with Intrum?
5. Is there any way of not paying the full debt e.g. paying only 30% off considering that I have already paid in excess of 5,000 initially borrowed? 
6. Is the guarantor in the picture? Am I able to shift the debt to his name? Or guarantor is now out of the picture?
7. Once the debt was sold - does it stay on my credit rating or it's now not a formal loan anymore? i.e. it's now similar to a PCN that is outstanding and debt collector chases for.
8. Am I charged for any missing payments etc, at the moment? Any interest?

Please let me know what are my options are and whether I have any options to fight this.

Thank you for your time reading this and appreciate any help.

Cheers,
Bill

Answers.

(1) Yes, in a nutshell, the agreement you have with them will allow this.

(2) Depends if the loan defaulted, if it did, it would show the date of default on your credit file, and all interest and charges would be frozen permanantly, If it didn`t default, then it was sold as a going concern and Intrum can charge you interest as per the original agreement.

They tend not to default Guarentor loans as they have the fallback of the guarentor to chase, and to keep charging you interest as well.

(3) The same as if the loan had completed as per your agreement.

(4) Debt collectors are always open to making a deal, however you are not in the best of positions as they hold all the cards.

(5) Some people have had complaints for unafordable borrowing upheld, try a written complaint to Amigo and see how you get on.

(6) If you, the debtor, don`t pay, then they will chase the Guarentor for the full amount.

(7) Stays for 6 years from date of default, if not defaulted can be longer.

(8) Depends on answer to question (2).

Hi, thank you for your response. 

Regarding point (2) - I don't think that the loan has defaulted as I have been making monthly payments of £100 as per arrangement with Amigo. If I default on the loan - would they seek to recover it from me regardless or go to the guarantor? I am asking because at the time I had a dispute with Amigo they told me that they will go after both of us to SCC.

Regarding point (3) - so does it mean 5,000 initially borrowed + 5 years of 50% APR? And that's regardless of what I have paid so far? This is crazy.

Regarding point (4) - I assume if I refuse to pay they will just go after the guarantor? What happens in case of court proceedings?

Regarding point (5) - am I still able to do that even though the debt was passed on?

Regarding point (6) - how this will be reflected on my credit score? If i just default do I get a CCJ?

As i said, guarentor loans rarely get defaulted, this allows the loan to be sold on, (if applicable), and the full amount of interest can still be charged, and they will pursue you both, yes, thats the cost of high interest borrowing unfortunatly.

Your credit file will show the missed payments, and how much in arrears you are.

As for legal action, that is a good question, I don`t know the answer to that one, the normal rules do not apply as there is a guarentor for the loan, all i would say is its a possibility either one, or both of you may be faced with, but normally if an arrangement is made, the threat deminishes.

Bill11

You can read Fraud Act 2006 for that. 

Yes, this is exactly how it works, the lender has to make himself comfortable that the loan that it gives out is affordable for the person taking the loan and that the nature and purpose of the loan makes sense, considering the onerous conditions AND refuse the loan in cases where the product is not suitable to customer's circumstances.

 I am sorry, but going on holiday on a 50% APR is not reasonable and should have been raised as a concern by the agent, but because those shark loan companies prey on people like us without any punishment, people like you think this is our fault for asking the money for a wrong reason. You should read some guidance from FCA on principles of business, conduct and consumer lending.

Honestly dude, you have not answered any of the questions raised in my starting topic, have not provided a single valuable input to my issues, yet you have 4.6k posts in threads ranging from housing to lending. I would appreciate that you go and rant in other threads. Dismissed.