Why do people discourage investing only in the US markets?

CreditCardChris

Thrugelmir said:

CreditCardChris said:

dunstonh said:

That's quite the assumption.

1) it wasnt stated as a fact of what will happen.  It was stated as what happens when Sterling rises and falls.

2) Sterling has been in the ballpark it is now before.    People thought it wouldn't go up again and guess what? It did.   This country has been written off so many times but keeps coming back.   A lot of it is goes through cycles. 

We have pretty much exhausted our innovation

You are kidding aren't you?   The UK is a breeding ground for innovation.   The problem is implementation on a wide scale.  Bigger fish, usually based in Asia or US tend to come in buy UK innovation and implement in a way that the UK is not very good at doing.

ur land and now we're just floating around simply existing.

Yet, UK equities in the smaller/mid cap perform equally or better than the US historically.

The UK completely failed to go into the tech game and we got left behind. 

We lagged in some areas but led in others.  However, as said above, our potential kept on being bought.    In some areas though we are market leaders.  Just nothing on a large consumer scale.

Well you have a lot more optimism than I do but since the age of around 18 I've watched innovation and subsequently the economy of the country reduced to just another country. Investors don't just wake up one day and decide to start buying the pound and investing in UK equities... We need to create companies that dominate, Google or Amazon style.

I see three new industries opening up in the next 20 years. AI, alternative energy and "space mining". Only time will tell if the UK sits on the sidelines again. 

Unless you invest in the new industries from the outset. They will simply be sold to overseas investors. Short termism is unfortunately a very British trait. Look at major German companies in comparison. Almost without exception they had an influence on the WW2 war effort. 

Why do we always sell the companies though? Again it goes back to the culture shift of the UK, we're happy to just sell our companies to other conglomerates that then absorb them into their parent companies, making them bigger and more dominate while the UK stays stagnant. 

It's weird, maybe the UK ruled for so long now it's time we're unconsciously taking a back seat on the world stage in terms of currency, economy, companies, military prowess (ok we still have nukes). It's a bit of a shame, I guess this is what Roman Empire felt like when it slowly whittled away leaving just Italy, a country that nobody really cares about generally speaking.

Thrugelmir

CreditCardChris said:

Thrugelmir said:

CreditCardChris said:

dunstonh said:

That's quite the assumption.

1) it wasnt stated as a fact of what will happen.  It was stated as what happens when Sterling rises and falls.

2) Sterling has been in the ballpark it is now before.    People thought it wouldn't go up again and guess what? It did.   This country has been written off so many times but keeps coming back.   A lot of it is goes through cycles. 

We have pretty much exhausted our innovation

You are kidding aren't you?   The UK is a breeding ground for innovation.   The problem is implementation on a wide scale.  Bigger fish, usually based in Asia or US tend to come in buy UK innovation and implement in a way that the UK is not very good at doing.

ur land and now we're just floating around simply existing.

Yet, UK equities in the smaller/mid cap perform equally or better than the US historically.

The UK completely failed to go into the tech game and we got left behind. 

We lagged in some areas but led in others.  However, as said above, our potential kept on being bought.    In some areas though we are market leaders.  Just nothing on a large consumer scale.

Well you have a lot more optimism than I do but since the age of around 18 I've watched innovation and subsequently the economy of the country reduced to just another country. Investors don't just wake up one day and decide to start buying the pound and investing in UK equities... We need to create companies that dominate, Google or Amazon style.

I see three new industries opening up in the next 20 years. AI, alternative energy and "space mining". Only time will tell if the UK sits on the sidelines again. 

Unless you invest in the new industries from the outset. They will simply be sold to overseas investors. Short termism is unfortunately a very British trait. Look at major German companies in comparison. Almost without exception they had an influence on the WW2 war effort. 

Why do we always sell the companies though? Again it goes back to the culture shift of the UK, we're happy to just sell our companies to other conglomerates that then absorb them into their parent companies, making them bigger and more dominate while the UK stays stagnant. 

It's weird, maybe the UK ruled for so long now it's time we're unconsciously taking a back seat on the world stage in terms of currency, economy, companies, military prowess (ok we still have nukes). It's a bit of a shame, I guess this is what Roman Empire felt like when it slowly whittled away leaving just Italy, a country that nobody really cares about generally speaking.

Two words. Share ownership. Brits prefer property to wealth creating assets. 

bostonerimus

Thrugelmir said:

CreditCardChris said:

dunstonh when Sterling rises

The UK completely failed to go into the tech game and we got left behind.

You obviously know little of the tech sector in the UK. 

A great example of UK tech innovation is ARM semiconductor, of course it's now owned by Softbank in Japan. 

Prism

Possibly another angle then is not should you invest in the big US companies vs smaller UK ones (I do both) but should you really be looking at China and India for the future and then what comes after that?
Will a consumer staples company in india do better there than Nestle or Mondelez. How about a China tech company that overtakes Apple and Microsoft?

bostonerimus

Thrugelmir said:

CreditCardChris said:

dunstonh said:

That's quite the assumption.

1) it wasnt stated as a fact of what will happen.  It was stated as what happens when Sterling rises and falls.

2) Sterling has been in the ballpark it is now before.    People thought it wouldn't go up again and guess what? It did.   This country has been written off so many times but keeps coming back.   A lot of it is goes through cycles. 

We have pretty much exhausted our innovation

You are kidding aren't you?   The UK is a breeding ground for innovation.   The problem is implementation on a wide scale.  Bigger fish, usually based in Asia or US tend to come in buy UK innovation and implement in a way that the UK is not very good at doing.

ur land and now we're just floating around simply existing.

Yet, UK equities in the smaller/mid cap perform equally or better than the US historically.

The UK completely failed to go into the tech game and we got left behind. 

We lagged in some areas but led in others.  However, as said above, our potential kept on being bought.    In some areas though we are market leaders.  Just nothing on a large consumer scale.

Well you have a lot more optimism than I do but since the age of around 18 I've watched innovation and subsequently the economy of the country reduced to just another country. Investors don't just wake up one day and decide to start buying the pound and investing in UK equities... We need to create companies that dominate, Google or Amazon style.

I see three new industries opening up in the next 20 years. AI, alternative energy and "space mining". Only time will tell if the UK sits on the sidelines again. 

Unless you invest in the new industries from the outset. They will simply be sold to overseas investors. Short termism is unfortunately a very British trait. Look at major German companies in comparison. Almost without exception they had an influence on the WW2 war effort. 

I wouldn't say that "short termism" is necessarily a British trait. I think it's more a product of a particular thread in capitalism that has taken root in the US and the UK that only values immediate shareholder returns and minimizes the influence of government over commercial enterprises.

JustAnotherSaver

I sit in watching this from the outside really as a load of people who know what they're talking about disagreeing with each other.

Well not totally, but some disagreeing with some others.

Unless you're only planning on dipping in and out within 5 or 10 years or whatever, if you're going considerably longer than that (i didn't see a time frame posted in OP though i may have missed it) would it not be better to be fairly spread across the board so that while you'll never have the best of any world, you should average out respectable returns?

Or no?

Linton

CreditCardChris said:

Thrugelmir said:

CreditCardChris said:

dunstonh said:

That's quite the assumption.

1) it wasnt stated as a fact of what will happen.  It was stated as what happens when Sterling rises and falls.

2) Sterling has been in the ballpark it is now before.    People thought it wouldn't go up again and guess what? It did.   This country has been written off so many times but keeps coming back.   A lot of it is goes through cycles. 

We have pretty much exhausted our innovation

You are kidding aren't you?   The UK is a breeding ground for innovation.   The problem is implementation on a wide scale.  Bigger fish, usually based in Asia or US tend to come in buy UK innovation and implement in a way that the UK is not very good at doing.

ur land and now we're just floating around simply existing.

Yet, UK equities in the smaller/mid cap perform equally or better than the US historically.

The UK completely failed to go into the tech game and we got left behind. 

We lagged in some areas but led in others.  However, as said above, our potential kept on being bought.    In some areas though we are market leaders.  Just nothing on a large consumer scale.

Well you have a lot more optimism than I do but since the age of around 18 I've watched innovation and subsequently the economy of the country reduced to just another country. Investors don't just wake up one day and decide to start buying the pound and investing in UK equities... We need to create companies that dominate, Google or Amazon style.

I see three new industries opening up in the next 20 years. AI, alternative energy and "space mining". Only time will tell if the UK sits on the sidelines again. 

Unless you invest in the new industries from the outset. They will simply be sold to overseas investors. Short termism is unfortunately a very British trait. Look at major German companies in comparison. Almost without exception they had an influence on the WW2 war effort. 

Why do we always sell the companies though? Again it goes back to the culture shift of the UK, we're happy to just sell our companies to other conglomerates that then absorb them into their parent companies, making them bigger and more dominate while the UK stays stagnant. 

"We" dont sell the small companies.  The owners do.  In fact many small companies are set up with the intention of being sold off once they have developed a competitive product. That is the only way the founders are ever going to realise their investment in a world dominated by global oligopolies.

CreditCardChris

bostonerimus said:

Thrugelmir said:

CreditCardChris said:

dunstonh when Sterling rises

The UK completely failed to go into the tech game and we got left behind.

You obviously know little of the tech sector in the UK. 

A great example of UK tech innovation is ARM semiconductor, of course it's now owned by Softbank in Japan. 

Yeah I know about ARM but that company was created 30 years ago... What have we done since? I read an article a few weeks ago, not sure if it's entirely true but in the last 5 years the US has created a $1billion startup roughly every 3.7 days. The UK on the other hand has created just 18 unicorns since 2001. That is embarrassing!

Thrugelmir

JustAnotherSaver said:

I sit in watching this from the outside really as a load of people who know what they're talking about disagreeing with each other.

Well not totally, but some disagreeing with some others.

Unless you're only planning on dipping in and out within 5 or 10 years or whatever, if you're going considerably longer than that (i didn't see a time frame posted in OP though i may have missed it) would it not be better to be fairly spread across the board so that while you'll never have the best of any world, you should average out respectable returns?

Or no?

This is an amicable grown up debate. We all never stop learning as investors. Just when you think you've experienced it all in your lifetime. You realise you haven't. 

bostonerimus

I don't like to predict markets as I believe it's a fool's game. But I am disposed to believe that the World's economies will contract in 2020 as cash strapped businesses fail, people are unemployed and have less money to spend and governments go into debt. There will be emotional ups and downs in the markets, but basic economic realities will also assert themselves.