Housemate refusing to pay rent

Socajam

Another thought came to mind.
Your current flatmate pay April's rent and moves out.
Your new flatmate decided that she do not want to move in anymore - what happens now?
Do you intend to still ask the old flatmate to pay the rent until you find someone?

aturton0116

Socajam said:

aturton0116 said:

JessJ23425 said:

Wouldn't she only be liable until you'd found someone else to take her place?
Why is it her responsibility that the new tenant can't move in, surely the new person should be paying this, especially as she plans to move in during April?

Yes we've found someone but the contract change hasn't happened yet. The new person has been delayed moving out of their current place. For sure its not a good situation for anyone but if she doesn't pay that just leaves us and the new tenant to pay it which isn't fair.
As soon as the new person is able to move in in April we will refund the old tenant the amount of rent for that time. As in if there's 2 weeks left of the month we'll send her 2 weeks worth of rent.

This does not make sense, if you have in mind to repay her, just pay the rent between the 3 of you and move on.
She gave you 6 weeks notice, you found someone who now cannot move in on the specified date, you now wants the current flatmate to pay rent for a place that she is leaving - and given sufficient notice for.
I would tell you take me to court.

Contractually she is still liable for the rent though, there's 
Our contract says

"- Vacating Tenant must give at least two months notice of their intention to leave to the Agent/Landlord.

- Vacating Tenant must arrange their replacement Tenant reference forms to be completed and authorised at least one month prior to their intention to vacate.

- All remaining Tenants and Landlord/Agent must sign an addendum relinquishing the vacating Tenant of their responsibilities under the tenancy and taking those responsibilities upon themselves.Until signed the vacating Tenant... will continue to be liable under the terms of this agreement."

One of us is freelance and has lost all her work, I'm probably going to be losing my job and one of us is alright. We're not in a good position to cover her rent.

[Deleted User]

aturton0116 said:

Murphybear said:

Bear in mind that in these extraordinary times it could take a long time to go through the small claims court and even if you win getting the money could be tricky.

Have  you spoken to the LL, he may be prepared to wait for some of the rent.  It’s worth a try and if the rest of you can’t cover it then you must speak to him anyway rather than not paying all of it but saying nothing.  

Thanks Murphy, if the court found in our favour and she was able to pay how would she avoid paying and wouldn't the consequences be quite high for her?
Would it weaken our position of going to small claims court if we paid the full amount to stop going in to arrears? We're going to talk to the LL for sure though

Going into arrears won't strengthen your case.  You each have joint and several liability to pay the rent so as far as the landlord is concerned it doesn't matter which of you pays it as long as is gets paid.

If, and it's a big if because I'm not sure which way this would go if it gets to court since a new tenant was found but delayed moving in, you won in court and your former housemate pays up straight away then there wouldn't be any consequences for her other than paying the money.  If you won and she didn't pay then you'd need to then enforce the debt which could eventually lead to a CCJ but that's not a given and it almost certainly won't lead to you getting a full months rent in one go.

[Deleted User]

This is an illegal term:

"Vacating Tenant must give at least two months notice of their intention to leave to the Agent/Landlord."

A departing tenant only has to give one month's notice, whatever a contract may say.   A contract cannot overright the statute. See here:

"If you are planning on vacating on the last day of the tenancy, you do not need to give the same two months’ notice to the landlord, although you should give the landlord enough notice to be able to remarket the property."

https://www.rightmove.co.uk/advice/renter/managing-your-tenancy/ending-extending-tenancy/

There's not a reciprocity here.  The landlord must give two month's notice, but a tenant only has to give one month's.  So yes she's absolutely free to ignore the agreement and has no liability for the rent.   Stop calling it "her rent" because it's not her rent any more.

Chilli6

If I was the old tenant I would not be paying April's rent either.
She gave her notice, she is leaving as stated. You or the new tenant must pay. The fact you will struggle to do that is neither here nor there, you still need to pay.
This is one of the downsides of sharing rent so be prepared for this to potentially happen again when another wants to move out. 

MoneySeeker1

It's the new persons fault this has happened and so they "carry that can". No-one else.

Old flatmate definitely doesnt carry the can, as they've fulfilled their responsibilities.

So it's down to that new person and, if they are irresponsible and refuse to deal with THEIR issue, then it's down to whoever chose them as new person. Might be the landlord chose her and so they lose the money. Might be yourselves that chose her and so you all lose the money.

[Deleted User]

Poster_586329 said:

This is an illegal term:

"Vacating Tenant must give at least two months notice of their intention to leave to the Agent/Landlord."

A departing tenant only has to give one month's notice, whatever a contract may say.   A contract cannot overright the statute. See here:

"If you are planning on vacating on the last day of the tenancy, you do not need to give the same two months’ notice to the landlord, although you should give the landlord enough notice to be able to remarket the property."

https://www.rightmove.co.uk/advice/renter/managing-your-tenancy/ending-extending-tenancy/

There's not a reciprocity here.  The landlord must give two month's notice, but a tenant only has to give one month's.  So yes she's absolutely free to ignore the agreement and has no liability for the rent.   Stop calling it "her rent" because it's not her rent any more.

I'm not sure you are correct as it's possible to have a Contractual Periodic Tenancy that, for example, requires both the tenant and the landlord to give two months notice.  What a contract can't do is allow a landlord to give less notice that the statutory requirement so for example a week.

We don't even know that this is a periodic tenancy, it could well be in its fixed term.  Furthermore, this is a clause allowing on tenant to assign the tenancy to someone else rather than giving notice to end the tenancy.  If the outgoing tenant had actually served notice to end the tenancy it would end it for all the joint tenants, not just the one leaving.

greatcrested

It is a joint and several tenancy. All 4 tenants, including the 'departing' tenant, remain liable (jointly and independantly) for the full rent until either

1) the tenancy is ended or

2) an assignment is executed substituting one name for another.

Neither of the above has happened.

The departing tenang tenant remains liable for rent.

If the full rent is not paid to the landlord, he can take all 4, or any one of them he chooses, to court either for the arrears and/or to evict (subject to the current changes + whether the courts are actually sitting).

If the remaining 3 tenants pay the ful rent themselves, they could take the 'departing' tenant tocourt for his/her share (subject also to the above)

aturton0116

greatcrested said:

It is a joint and several tenancy. All 4 tenants, including the 'departing' tenant, remain liable (jointly and independantly) for the full rent until either

1) the tenancy is ended or

2) an assignment is executed substituting one name for another.

Neither of the above has happened.

The departing tenang tenant remains liable for rent.

If the full rent is not paid to the landlord, he can take all 4, or any one of them he chooses, to court either for the arrears and/or to evict (subject to the current changes + whether the courts are actually sitting).

If the remaining 3 tenants pay the ful rent themselves, they could take the 'departing' tenant tocourt for his/her share (subject also to the above)

How is the "share" determine, is it just on the basis of what rent she previously paid (as it isn't written in the contract itself)?
And in terms of the rent amounts being an agreement between the 4 of us, does she have any defence in court if she's saying that we had agreed for us to leave at the end of March? Or does that not really matter for much in this.

aturton0116

Lover_of_Lycra said:

Poster_586329 said:

This is an illegal term:

"Vacating Tenant must give at least two months notice of their intention to leave to the Agent/Landlord."

A departing tenant only has to give one month's notice, whatever a contract may say.   A contract cannot overright the statute. See here:

"If you are planning on vacating on the last day of the tenancy, you do not need to give the same two months’ notice to the landlord, although you should give the landlord enough notice to be able to remarket the property."

There's not a reciprocity here.  The landlord must give two month's notice, but a tenant only has to give one month's.  So yes she's absolutely free to ignore the agreement and has no liability for the rent.   Stop calling it "her rent" because it's not her rent any more.

I'm not sure you are correct as it's possible to have a Contractual Periodic Tenancy that, for example, requires both the tenant and the landlord to give two months notice.  What a contract can't do is allow a landlord to give less notice that the statutory requirement so for example a week.

We don't even know that this is a periodic tenancy, it could well be in its fixed term.  Furthermore, this is a clause allowing on tenant to assign the tenancy to someone else rather than giving notice to end the tenancy.  If the outgoing tenant had actually served notice to end the tenancy it would end it for all the joint tenants, not just the one leaving.

I think it is a fixed term tenancy. We signed it at the end of August and it lasts for 2 years with the option of extending it if we and the LL agrees.