Cancelling Course of Professional Interest

Ryan_Henderson

Hi,
Any help/advice would be greatly appreciated. Brief details are as follows:

 - Signed up for a Close Protection Course on 20/02/20 via online e-sign form following telephone discussions with company.
 - Did NOT tick the box to say I had read, nor agree to the externally linked T&C's (only place any cancellation fees are mentioned).
- Cancelled 02/03/20 (11 days later) having paid no deposit and received no goods/services.
- Received email from course provider saying as per their T&C's I owe £995 (25% of the entire course value)
 - I'm told I have no consumer rights as the course is of professional interest (I'm in the security industry already)
- Cancelled within 14 days, and the course start date is 06/06/20 so well outside of their 30-day limit.

Those are the basic points of discussion, however I'll add I had multiple telephone conversations with the company prior to signing the form, no cancellation fees were ever mentioned, and I was definitely rushed into signing up for the course. I was told I needed to book on ASAP as they only had 2/3 spaces left and they were inundated with interest. Also asked to pay up front, when I asked about a deposit and payment plan method, this had to be approved as it was not standard practice, but I was told I needed to hurry up and pay a deposit because until such a point my deposit was paid, my place on the course would be prioritised to someone who could pay up.

On the day I signed the form, I had been contacted 3/4 times chasing me up, and I was rushed for time, so I filled out the basic information (Name, address, phone number, signed dated). On the form there were 4 "tick boxes" 2 of which were simple and I agreed to, so I ticked them. The other 2 were:

  - Tick to confirm receipt of booking confirmation email with full course information (I had not received this)
 - Tick to confirm you have read and agree to these Terms and Conditions (external URL link)

As I was rushed, I did not have time to sit and read through T&C's so I did not tick the box, assuming I would have to do this later on or the following day when I had time to do so, before they would allow me to proceed.

The company argues that simply returning the form is implied acceptance of the terms, but my argument is that the box represents an answer to a "Yes/No" question. Tick to confirm "Yes", don't tick to confirm "No". If this is not the case, what is the point in having the tick boxes, or even asking for my acceptance at all? Had I not filled in my surname, would it be implied that my surname is "Smith"?

I'm sure there are some small costs incurred by the company in sending out my email and a letter in the post, so I am more than happy to reimburse them for the costs they have incurred there. But, I do not understand how they can justifiably charge me almost £1000 for an email and a letter.

I have had a couple of back and forward emails with this company, me saying I didn't agree to those cancellation fees, them saying I owe them £995 etc, and we seem to be going around in circles.

Any advice on the matter would be greatly appreciated.

Many Thanks,
Ryan

DoaM

You haven't paid anything? Then tell them to "do one", which means they'll have to pursue court action to try and make you pay. (I doubt they'd "send round the heavies" as you're probably one yourself). Chances of them taking this to court? Minimal. Small claims are judged on the "balance of probabilities" ... the fact they have tick boxes for certain items means that they have a significance - as you didn't tick them then their argument about implied consent/agreement is very weak. (You did keep a copy of them form, yes)?

Ryan_Henderson

Hi DoaM,

Thanks for your reply. I have a copy of the form and there is clearly no indication of returning the form being classed as implied consent. I have repeatedly told them I do not believe I am obligated to pay this fee, they just keep coming back with "yes you are".

I've attached a copy of the form I signed, the green markers indicating where I have ticked and the red ones marking where I did not.

Cheers,
Ryan

powerful_Rogue

Could they say that they have provided all the information, it's your choice whether you read it or not. Bit like contracts in store, many people sign without reading. You have agreed to the payment agreement by making a payment.

Hermione_Granger

Ryan_Henderson said:

 (I'm in the security industry already)

In the security industry but don't see anything wrong in giving your real name as well as a copy of your signature on a public forum?
With the info you've already given, it probably wouldn't be too difficult to find out far more information about you by using Facebook, linkedin etc. 

Ryan_Henderson

Hermione_Granger said:

Ryan_Henderson said:

 (I'm in the security industry already)

In the security industry but don't see anything wrong in giving your real name as well as a copy of your signature on a public forum?
With the info you've already given, it probably wouldn't be too difficult to find out far more information about you by using Facebook, linkedin etc. 

Hi,

Thanks so much for your message, I thought I'd mentioned in the original post that it's an e-signature... so you press a button which says "Click here to sign" and it basically just creates an image of your full name in a handwriting-style font, so believe it or not, that's not my real signature. 

With regards to my real name being on a public forum, I work in an industry where my name is displayed on my security badge, to the public, all shift, every shift.

Given that my facebook page is completely private, and I am not registered with LinkedIn, there is an SIA website, where all security operatives names and badge details are public record. You're more than welcome to search my name and tell me which of the results I am.

Thank you though, for your input. I'll definitely take your security advice on board in future.

powerful_Rogue said:

Could they say that they have provided all the information, it's your choice whether you read it or not. Bit like contracts in store, many people sign without reading. You have agreed to the payment agreement by making a payment.

Hi,

Thanks for this, I completely understand where you're coming from. There's no dispute that they provided the information, the dispute is that it wasn't accepted. I was under the impression both parties had to agree to the terms for the contract to become binding? I wonder how enforceable the contract is given that I specifically did not accept the terms? Also, in this instance no payment was made? So my understanding is that my signature represented my confirmation that all of the above information on the form was correct and provided by me? If that makes sense?

Thanks again for your help.

davidmcn

Just because you didn't explicitly say you had read the terms doesn't imply that you were rejecting any of them. I don't think it's all that clear from what you've posted, they had obviously signposted where the terms were.

Ryan_Henderson

Hi David,

Thanks for your reply. I'm wondering then, what's the point in the tick boxes? What makes that click of the mouse any less relevant or important than another click?

In this instance, I purposely did not click a box, which would have triggered an "x" to appear next to the word "Yes".
Had I instead not clicked the "Tick here to sign" box, the page would not have triggered the "signature".

Would it be implied that I had signed if I refused to click THAT box?

Where are the limitations? Are companies really allowed to say, "sign this form, we hope you agree to our terms, but if not, we'll hold you to them anyway"?

Thanks,
Ryan

davidmcn

Forming a contract doesn't necessarily require any tickyboxes or "signatures", they just help a bit where there's a grey area about what terms the parties agreed to. And they did tell you there were terms and conditions, and you could have read them. So still a grey area. Though if I were them, I probably won't fancy my chances in court. Maybe just wait and see whether they both pursuing it (or even hold the course - doubt they can sue you for their losses if they would have had to cancel the course anyway).