Is there any help for tenants in these to ugh times?

afis1904

Takmon said:

afis1904 said:

Takmon said:

n1guy said:

Bossypants said:

^ They move on but with a CCJ in tow, which restricts their ability to rent or get a mortgage in the future. Same for well-intentioned tenants who want to pay back the rent owed, but simply can't afford to make up the difference when they're coming off three months (or more) without a paycheck. This idea helps literally no one.

I agree helps no one. The only solution is to help tenants pay their rent. So throw money at it but they don’t seem interested in this idea. 

Hopefully this current situation will make people realise how financially unprepared they actually are and how important it is to manage their money and build up some emergency funds for exactly these kinds of situations. It's been standard advice on here for as long as i have known to have at least 3 months expenses in savings yet so many people seem to have ignored this and now have financially worry to deal with on top of everything else!. 

Hopefully this current situation will make people realise that being a landlord means having a business where you need money to cover any disruptions whilst not every tenant can afford that.

Whether you are a Landlord or a Tenant it makes no difference you should still have 3 months expenses in savings to cover emergencies. But just because a Landlord has money saved up it doesn't give tenants the right to not pay their rent just because they have been poor at managing their finances. If a tenant doesn't have any savings it will be because they have prioritised other spending over saving and have been living beyond their means. 
I know several people who claim they "cannot afford to save" but when asked if they know how much their total essential outgoings are they don't know. So they haven't even carried out the most basic budgeting exercise but claim to not have enough money to save simply because they spend every penny that hits their bank account. 

My point was that being a landlord is a choice whilst having a roof over your head is a necessity.
Your point is anecdotal evidence. 

Bossypants

afis1904 said:

Takmon said:

afis1904 said:

Takmon said:

n1guy said:

Bossypants said:

^ They move on but with a CCJ in tow, which restricts their ability to rent or get a mortgage in the future. Same for well-intentioned tenants who want to pay back the rent owed, but simply can't afford to make up the difference when they're coming off three months (or more) without a paycheck. This idea helps literally no one.

I agree helps no one. The only solution is to help tenants pay their rent. So throw money at it but they don’t seem interested in this idea. 

Hopefully this current situation will make people realise how financially unprepared they actually are and how important it is to manage their money and build up some emergency funds for exactly these kinds of situations. It's been standard advice on here for as long as i have known to have at least 3 months expenses in savings yet so many people seem to have ignored this and now have financially worry to deal with on top of everything else!. 

Hopefully this current situation will make people realise that being a landlord means having a business where you need money to cover any disruptions whilst not every tenant can afford that.

Whether you are a Landlord or a Tenant it makes no difference you should still have 3 months expenses in savings to cover emergencies. But just because a Landlord has money saved up it doesn't give tenants the right to not pay their rent just because they have been poor at managing their finances. If a tenant doesn't have any savings it will be because they have prioritised other spending over saving and have been living beyond their means. 
I know several people who claim they "cannot afford to save" but when asked if they know how much their total essential outgoings are they don't know. So they haven't even carried out the most basic budgeting exercise but claim to not have enough money to save simply because they spend every penny that hits their bank account. 

My point was that being a landlord is a choice whilst having a roof over your head is a necessity.
Your point is anecdotal evidence. 

Being a farmer is a choice but having food is a necessity. When times get tough for everyone, do you expect the farmers to just give their produce away for free?

Takmon

afis1904 said:

Takmon said:

afis1904 said:

Takmon said:

n1guy said:

Bossypants said:

^ They move on but with a CCJ in tow, which restricts their ability to rent or get a mortgage in the future. Same for well-intentioned tenants who want to pay back the rent owed, but simply can't afford to make up the difference when they're coming off three months (or more) without a paycheck. This idea helps literally no one.

I agree helps no one. The only solution is to help tenants pay their rent. So throw money at it but they don’t seem interested in this idea. 

Hopefully this current situation will make people realise how financially unprepared they actually are and how important it is to manage their money and build up some emergency funds for exactly these kinds of situations. It's been standard advice on here for as long as i have known to have at least 3 months expenses in savings yet so many people seem to have ignored this and now have financially worry to deal with on top of everything else!. 

Hopefully this current situation will make people realise that being a landlord means having a business where you need money to cover any disruptions whilst not every tenant can afford that.

Whether you are a Landlord or a Tenant it makes no difference you should still have 3 months expenses in savings to cover emergencies. But just because a Landlord has money saved up it doesn't give tenants the right to not pay their rent just because they have been poor at managing their finances. If a tenant doesn't have any savings it will be because they have prioritised other spending over saving and have been living beyond their means. 
I know several people who claim they "cannot afford to save" but when asked if they know how much their total essential outgoings are they don't know. So they haven't even carried out the most basic budgeting exercise but claim to not have enough money to save simply because they spend every penny that hits their bank account. 

My point was that being a landlord is a choice whilst having a roof over your head is a necessity.
Your point is anecdotal evidence. 

Just head over to the Debt Free Wannabee part of this forum and read through the thousands and thousands of threads on there which all follow the similar theme;  a person with no budget in a large amount of debt, they get together an SOA and with advice from others start budgeting, this allows them to considerably cut their spending, pay back their debt and build up some savings.

Like you say Landlords are providing a necessary service by providing housing so tenants should be doing everything they can to make sure they can pay their rent by managing their finances appropriately. If there was a major decrease in rental properties because a lot of landlords chose to sell and the demand for rental properties increased which would mean an increase in the rent that can be charge and more competition for each property i'm sure renters would not be happy with that situation either. 

afis1904

Bossypants said:

afis1904 said:

Takmon said:

afis1904 said:

Takmon said:

n1guy said:

Bossypants said:

^ They move on but with a CCJ in tow, which restricts their ability to rent or get a mortgage in the future. Same for well-intentioned tenants who want to pay back the rent owed, but simply can't afford to make up the difference when they're coming off three months (or more) without a paycheck. This idea helps literally no one.

I agree helps no one. The only solution is to help tenants pay their rent. So throw money at it but they don’t seem interested in this idea. 

Hopefully this current situation will make people realise how financially unprepared they actually are and how important it is to manage their money and build up some emergency funds for exactly these kinds of situations. It's been standard advice on here for as long as i have known to have at least 3 months expenses in savings yet so many people seem to have ignored this and now have financially worry to deal with on top of everything else!. 

Hopefully this current situation will make people realise that being a landlord means having a business where you need money to cover any disruptions whilst not every tenant can afford that.

Whether you are a Landlord or a Tenant it makes no difference you should still have 3 months expenses in savings to cover emergencies. But just because a Landlord has money saved up it doesn't give tenants the right to not pay their rent just because they have been poor at managing their finances. If a tenant doesn't have any savings it will be because they have prioritised other spending over saving and have been living beyond their means. 
I know several people who claim they "cannot afford to save" but when asked if they know how much their total essential outgoings are they don't know. So they haven't even carried out the most basic budgeting exercise but claim to not have enough money to save simply because they spend every penny that hits their bank account. 

My point was that being a landlord is a choice whilst having a roof over your head is a necessity.
Your point is anecdotal evidence. 

Being a farmer is a choice but having food is a necessity. When times get tough for everyone, do you expect the farmers to just give their produce away for free?

No but in any times I'd expect the government  to step to make sure no one stays hungry.

My main point was that any action should be focused on giving people money to pay for necessities instead of giving money to no one else but business and hoping that it trickles down

Thrugelmir

Takmon said:

n1guy said:

Bossypants said:

^ They move on but with a CCJ in tow, which restricts their ability to rent or get a mortgage in the future. Same for well-intentioned tenants who want to pay back the rent owed, but simply can't afford to make up the difference when they're coming off three months (or more) without a paycheck. This idea helps literally no one.

I agree helps no one. The only solution is to help tenants pay their rent. So throw money at it but they don’t seem interested in this idea. 

Hopefully this current situation will make people realise how financially unprepared they actually are and how important it is to manage their money and build up some emergency funds for exactly these kinds of situations. It's been standard advice on here for as long as i have known to have at least 3 months expenses in savings yet so many people seem to have ignored this and now have financially worry to deal with on top of everything else!. 

After this crisis is finally over. There'll be a once in a lifetime reflection on many aspects of daily life. The rulebook will be totally rewritten. Common sense of generations now passed will be reinstilled. Has become to easy to live for today in the belief that someone will come along and bail you out. 

Bossypants

afis1904 said:

Bossypants said:

afis1904 said:

Takmon said:

afis1904 said:

Takmon said:

n1guy said:

Bossypants said:

^ They move on but with a CCJ in tow, which restricts their ability to rent or get a mortgage in the future. Same for well-intentioned tenants who want to pay back the rent owed, but simply can't afford to make up the difference when they're coming off three months (or more) without a paycheck. This idea helps literally no one.

I agree helps no one. The only solution is to help tenants pay their rent. So throw money at it but they don’t seem interested in this idea. 

Hopefully this current situation will make people realise how financially unprepared they actually are and how important it is to manage their money and build up some emergency funds for exactly these kinds of situations. It's been standard advice on here for as long as i have known to have at least 3 months expenses in savings yet so many people seem to have ignored this and now have financially worry to deal with on top of everything else!. 

Hopefully this current situation will make people realise that being a landlord means having a business where you need money to cover any disruptions whilst not every tenant can afford that.

Whether you are a Landlord or a Tenant it makes no difference you should still have 3 months expenses in savings to cover emergencies. But just because a Landlord has money saved up it doesn't give tenants the right to not pay their rent just because they have been poor at managing their finances. If a tenant doesn't have any savings it will be because they have prioritised other spending over saving and have been living beyond their means. 
I know several people who claim they "cannot afford to save" but when asked if they know how much their total essential outgoings are they don't know. So they haven't even carried out the most basic budgeting exercise but claim to not have enough money to save simply because they spend every penny that hits their bank account. 

My point was that being a landlord is a choice whilst having a roof over your head is a necessity.
Your point is anecdotal evidence. 

Being a farmer is a choice but having food is a necessity. When times get tough for everyone, do you expect the farmers to just give their produce away for free?

No but in any times I'd expect the government  to step to make sure no one stays hungry.

My main point was that any action should be focused on giving people money to pay for necessities instead of giving money to no one else but business and hoping that it trickles down

Absolutely. If there was a shortage of food, I'd expect the government to step in, buy it off the farmers (or whomever) and distribute it to those who needed it. I really don't understand why something along those lines isn't being done here, e.g. by giving tenants money to pay their rent, or by allowing landlords whose tenants can't pay to apply for a grant or something. Their current proposal seems likely to affect everyone negatively with tenants ultimately coming off the worse (because those who can't cover what they owe later, which will be many, will end up with CCJs which can make it very difficult to rent or get a mortgage in future).

Thrugelmir

Bossypants said:

afis1904 said:

Bossypants said:

afis1904 said:

Takmon said:

afis1904 said:

Takmon said:

n1guy said:

Bossypants said:

^ They move on but with a CCJ in tow, which restricts their ability to rent or get a mortgage in the future. Same for well-intentioned tenants who want to pay back the rent owed, but simply can't afford to make up the difference when they're coming off three months (or more) without a paycheck. This idea helps literally no one.

I agree helps no one. The only solution is to help tenants pay their rent. So throw money at it but they don’t seem interested in this idea. 

Hopefully this current situation will make people realise how financially unprepared they actually are and how important it is to manage their money and build up some emergency funds for exactly these kinds of situations. It's been standard advice on here for as long as i have known to have at least 3 months expenses in savings yet so many people seem to have ignored this and now have financially worry to deal with on top of everything else!. 

Hopefully this current situation will make people realise that being a landlord means having a business where you need money to cover any disruptions whilst not every tenant can afford that.

Whether you are a Landlord or a Tenant it makes no difference you should still have 3 months expenses in savings to cover emergencies. But just because a Landlord has money saved up it doesn't give tenants the right to not pay their rent just because they have been poor at managing their finances. If a tenant doesn't have any savings it will be because they have prioritised other spending over saving and have been living beyond their means. 
I know several people who claim they "cannot afford to save" but when asked if they know how much their total essential outgoings are they don't know. So they haven't even carried out the most basic budgeting exercise but claim to not have enough money to save simply because they spend every penny that hits their bank account. 

My point was that being a landlord is a choice whilst having a roof over your head is a necessity.
Your point is anecdotal evidence. 

Being a farmer is a choice but having food is a necessity. When times get tough for everyone, do you expect the farmers to just give their produce away for free?

No but in any times I'd expect the government  to step to make sure no one stays hungry.

My main point was that any action should be focused on giving people money to pay for necessities instead of giving money to no one else but business and hoping that it trickles down

Absolutely. If there was a shortage of food, I'd expect the government to step in, buy it off the farmers (or whomever) and distribute it to those who needed it. I really don't understand why something along those lines isn't being done here, e.g. by giving tenants money to pay their rent, or by allowing landlords whose tenants can't pay to apply for a grant or something. Their current proposal seems likely to affect everyone negatively with tenants ultimately coming off the worse (because those who can't cover what they owe later, which will be many, will end up with CCJs which can make it very difficult to rent or get a mortgage in future).

Given the circumstances you'd expect Judges to be dismissive of aggressive LL's.  Arrears can be repaid over an extended period of time if neccessary. 

Bossypants

Thrugelmir said:

Bossypants said:

afis1904 said:

Bossypants said:

afis1904 said:

Takmon said:

afis1904 said:

Takmon said:

n1guy said:

Bossypants said:

^ They move on but with a CCJ in tow, which restricts their ability to rent or get a mortgage in the future. Same for well-intentioned tenants who want to pay back the rent owed, but simply can't afford to make up the difference when they're coming off three months (or more) without a paycheck. This idea helps literally no one.

I agree helps no one. The only solution is to help tenants pay their rent. So throw money at it but they don’t seem interested in this idea. 

Hopefully this current situation will make people realise how financially unprepared they actually are and how important it is to manage their money and build up some emergency funds for exactly these kinds of situations. It's been standard advice on here for as long as i have known to have at least 3 months expenses in savings yet so many people seem to have ignored this and now have financially worry to deal with on top of everything else!. 

Hopefully this current situation will make people realise that being a landlord means having a business where you need money to cover any disruptions whilst not every tenant can afford that.

Whether you are a Landlord or a Tenant it makes no difference you should still have 3 months expenses in savings to cover emergencies. But just because a Landlord has money saved up it doesn't give tenants the right to not pay their rent just because they have been poor at managing their finances. If a tenant doesn't have any savings it will be because they have prioritised other spending over saving and have been living beyond their means. 
I know several people who claim they "cannot afford to save" but when asked if they know how much their total essential outgoings are they don't know. So they haven't even carried out the most basic budgeting exercise but claim to not have enough money to save simply because they spend every penny that hits their bank account. 

My point was that being a landlord is a choice whilst having a roof over your head is a necessity.
Your point is anecdotal evidence. 

Being a farmer is a choice but having food is a necessity. When times get tough for everyone, do you expect the farmers to just give their produce away for free?

No but in any times I'd expect the government  to step to make sure no one stays hungry.

My main point was that any action should be focused on giving people money to pay for necessities instead of giving money to no one else but business and hoping that it trickles down

Absolutely. If there was a shortage of food, I'd expect the government to step in, buy it off the farmers (or whomever) and distribute it to those who needed it. I really don't understand why something along those lines isn't being done here, e.g. by giving tenants money to pay their rent, or by allowing landlords whose tenants can't pay to apply for a grant or something. Their current proposal seems likely to affect everyone negatively with tenants ultimately coming off the worse (because those who can't cover what they owe later, which will be many, will end up with CCJs which can make it very difficult to rent or get a mortgage in future).

Given the circumstances you'd expect Judges to be dismissive of aggressive LL's.  Arrears can be repaid over an extended period of time if neccessary. 

I'm not suggesting that they're going to be handed out willy-nilly, or that landlords are going to pursue immediately. My concern is that the people who are likely to be affected worst are those at the bottom of the financial heap, those without sick pay or job security. They are the people who were already living month to month before this, and theirs are the jobs most likely to go and not come back in an ailing economy. The fact is that this is not going to be three months and then it all goes back to normal, this is going to result in serious longterm repercussions, and the people struggling the most already are the ones who are going to feel it hardest (as usual). Asking them to come up with an additional three months rent on top of everything else, even over the course of a year or two, is both harsh and unrealistic IMO.

Thrugelmir

Bossypants said:

Thrugelmir said:

Bossypants said:

afis1904 said:

Bossypants said:

afis1904 said:

Takmon said:

afis1904 said:

Takmon said:

n1guy said:

Bossypants said:

^ They move on but with a CCJ in tow, which restricts their ability to rent or get a mortgage in the future. Same for well-intentioned tenants who want to pay back the rent owed, but simply can't afford to make up the difference when they're coming off three months (or more) without a paycheck. This idea helps literally no one.

I agree helps no one. The only solution is to help tenants pay their rent. So throw money at it but they don’t seem interested in this idea. 

Hopefully this current situation will make people realise how financially unprepared they actually are and how important it is to manage their money and build up some emergency funds for exactly these kinds of situations. It's been standard advice on here for as long as i have known to have at least 3 months expenses in savings yet so many people seem to have ignored this and now have financially worry to deal with on top of everything else!. 

Hopefully this current situation will make people realise that being a landlord means having a business where you need money to cover any disruptions whilst not every tenant can afford that.

Whether you are a Landlord or a Tenant it makes no difference you should still have 3 months expenses in savings to cover emergencies. But just because a Landlord has money saved up it doesn't give tenants the right to not pay their rent just because they have been poor at managing their finances. If a tenant doesn't have any savings it will be because they have prioritised other spending over saving and have been living beyond their means. 
I know several people who claim they "cannot afford to save" but when asked if they know how much their total essential outgoings are they don't know. So they haven't even carried out the most basic budgeting exercise but claim to not have enough money to save simply because they spend every penny that hits their bank account. 

My point was that being a landlord is a choice whilst having a roof over your head is a necessity.
Your point is anecdotal evidence. 

Being a farmer is a choice but having food is a necessity. When times get tough for everyone, do you expect the farmers to just give their produce away for free?

No but in any times I'd expect the government  to step to make sure no one stays hungry.

My main point was that any action should be focused on giving people money to pay for necessities instead of giving money to no one else but business and hoping that it trickles down

Absolutely. If there was a shortage of food, I'd expect the government to step in, buy it off the farmers (or whomever) and distribute it to those who needed it. I really don't understand why something along those lines isn't being done here, e.g. by giving tenants money to pay their rent, or by allowing landlords whose tenants can't pay to apply for a grant or something. Their current proposal seems likely to affect everyone negatively with tenants ultimately coming off the worse (because those who can't cover what they owe later, which will be many, will end up with CCJs which can make it very difficult to rent or get a mortgage in future).

Given the circumstances you'd expect Judges to be dismissive of aggressive LL's.  Arrears can be repaid over an extended period of time if neccessary. 

I'm not suggesting that they're going to be handed out willy-nilly, or that landlords are going to pursue immediately. My concern is that the people who are likely to be affected worst are those at the bottom of the financial heap, those without sick pay or job security. They are the people who were already living month to month before this, and theirs are the jobs most likely to go and not come back in an ailing economy. The fact is that this is not going to be three months and then it all goes back to normal, this is going to result in serious longterm repercussions, and the people struggling the most already are the ones who are going to feel it hardest (as usual). Asking them to come up with an additional three months rent on top of everything else, even over the course of a year or two, is both harsh and unrealistic IMO.

Where are LL's going to find new tenants? The whole situation needs a long term approach and be worked through. Everyone is going to suffer financial pain. Like any business. If your letting model isn't built on firm foundations it's going to fail. That's the reality of recessions. Priority will be to housing people. This is as close as a war scenario as we'll ever get without being in one. People need to work together than have a me first approach. 

Bossypants

Thrugelmir said:

Bossypants said:

Thrugelmir said:

Bossypants said:

afis1904 said:

Bossypants said:

afis1904 said:

Takmon said:

afis1904 said:

Takmon said:

n1guy said:

Bossypants said:

^ They move on but with a CCJ in tow, which restricts their ability to rent or get a mortgage in the future. Same for well-intentioned tenants who want to pay back the rent owed, but simply can't afford to make up the difference when they're coming off three months (or more) without a paycheck. This idea helps literally no one.

I agree helps no one. The only solution is to help tenants pay their rent. So throw money at it but they don’t seem interested in this idea. 

Hopefully this current situation will make people realise how financially unprepared they actually are and how important it is to manage their money and build up some emergency funds for exactly these kinds of situations. It's been standard advice on here for as long as i have known to have at least 3 months expenses in savings yet so many people seem to have ignored this and now have financially worry to deal with on top of everything else!. 

Hopefully this current situation will make people realise that being a landlord means having a business where you need money to cover any disruptions whilst not every tenant can afford that.

Whether you are a Landlord or a Tenant it makes no difference you should still have 3 months expenses in savings to cover emergencies. But just because a Landlord has money saved up it doesn't give tenants the right to not pay their rent just because they have been poor at managing their finances. If a tenant doesn't have any savings it will be because they have prioritised other spending over saving and have been living beyond their means. 
I know several people who claim they "cannot afford to save" but when asked if they know how much their total essential outgoings are they don't know. So they haven't even carried out the most basic budgeting exercise but claim to not have enough money to save simply because they spend every penny that hits their bank account. 

My point was that being a landlord is a choice whilst having a roof over your head is a necessity.
Your point is anecdotal evidence. 

Being a farmer is a choice but having food is a necessity. When times get tough for everyone, do you expect the farmers to just give their produce away for free?

No but in any times I'd expect the government  to step to make sure no one stays hungry.

My main point was that any action should be focused on giving people money to pay for necessities instead of giving money to no one else but business and hoping that it trickles down

Absolutely. If there was a shortage of food, I'd expect the government to step in, buy it off the farmers (or whomever) and distribute it to those who needed it. I really don't understand why something along those lines isn't being done here, e.g. by giving tenants money to pay their rent, or by allowing landlords whose tenants can't pay to apply for a grant or something. Their current proposal seems likely to affect everyone negatively with tenants ultimately coming off the worse (because those who can't cover what they owe later, which will be many, will end up with CCJs which can make it very difficult to rent or get a mortgage in future).

Given the circumstances you'd expect Judges to be dismissive of aggressive LL's.  Arrears can be repaid over an extended period of time if neccessary. 

I'm not suggesting that they're going to be handed out willy-nilly, or that landlords are going to pursue immediately. My concern is that the people who are likely to be affected worst are those at the bottom of the financial heap, those without sick pay or job security. They are the people who were already living month to month before this, and theirs are the jobs most likely to go and not come back in an ailing economy. The fact is that this is not going to be three months and then it all goes back to normal, this is going to result in serious longterm repercussions, and the people struggling the most already are the ones who are going to feel it hardest (as usual). Asking them to come up with an additional three months rent on top of everything else, even over the course of a year or two, is both harsh and unrealistic IMO.

Where are LL's going to find new tenants? The whole situation needs a long term approach and be worked through. Everyone is going to suffer financial pain. Like any business. If your letting model isn't built on firm foundations it's going to fail. That's the reality of recessions. Priority will be to housing people. This is as close as a war scenario as we'll ever get without being in one. People need to work together than have a me first approach. 

I don't disagree with any of that, all I said is that I think the government's current approach is the wrong one for the long term. It's perhaps a necessary stopgap for now, but something a lot more robust needs to be thought up in the near future.