Think the garage broke my car - update

Burnsie1983

Hi all.
Posted previously about my car in another thread with a different username (due to forum change etc).
So, an update. KwiKFit say my car has a misfire, probably due to damage to the timing belt. This might mean the valves in the engine need replacing....

Now, backstory. 

I took my car to them in mid Jan due to a broken Aux belt. This was fixed and I test drove the car approx 20 miles that night (also got a new battery at their suggestion). The next morning the car made it 5 meters before breaking down completely.

Got it towed back to them to fix. 

They could not work out why the new Aux belt broke again and have had the car since trying to work it out (they only have a few people trained in the region and they were all on holiday). 

They have provided me a free car to get to work, which is nice of them.

They suggested speaking to other garages now who might be able to take the car to fix it. Speaking to one today they said that if I had a misfire prior to the car breaking, I would have noticed/felt it. As I did not, the misfire must have been caused since the first aux belt was replaced...ie KwikFit broke it?? KwikFit say my timing belt is overdue for change. It is. However, it wasn't due on my last service. Ironically it would have been changed in this service in March! The "new" garage says its doesn't matter if the timing belt was overdue, its only a problem that its damaged due to the Aux belt hitting it. 

The new garage suggest I get a full written report from KwikFit about what they have done etc.
I am now thinking about what to do next, and whether KwiKfit should be responsible for any repair bill, and if so, how to proceed. Obviously, I cannot prove the car was working fine between their first fix and it breaking the next day, and that it didn't have a misfire before i brought it in. 

Any advice?
Thanks

foxy-stoat

What car is it and engine type?  Cambelts are normally sealing in their own plastic covers.

Burnsie1983

foxy-stoat said:

What car is it and engine type?  Cambelts are normally sealing in their own plastic covers.

Volvo s60. That's what the Kwit-fit man said (the untrained guy), saying he can almost guarantee it wouldn't cause damage to the timing belt..... and yet here we are (some threads on the Volvo forum about this too...but im not great with engines n stuff ) 

dogshome

When an Auxiliary belt fails it's not uncommon for a loose end/s, to become entangled in the Cam belt which results in it jumping teeth, destroying the engines timing, which is usually fatal for the engine.

The fact that you drove into KF with a failed Aux belt shows that at the that point the Cam belt was OK, it's the new belt that has failed and done the damage

Burnsie1983

dogshome said:

When an Auxiliary belt fails it's not uncommon for a loose end/s, to become entangled in the Cam belt which results in it jumping teeth, destroying the engines timing, which is usually fatal for the engine.

The fact that you drove into KF with a failed Aux belt shows that at the that point the Cam belt was OK, it's the new belt that has failed and done the damage

But I did drive with the new belt for about 20 miles too... surely if that broke and damaged the timing belt I would have know then... unless it only broke then next morning when the car just stopped.  

Jumblebumble

Burnsie1983 said:

Hi all.
Posted previously about my car in another thread with a different username (due to forum change etc).
So, an update. KwiKFit say my car has a misfire, probably due to damage to the timing belt. This might mean the valves in the engine need replacing....

Now, backstory. 

I took my car to them in mid Jan due to a broken Aux belt. This was fixed and I test drove the car approx 20 miles that night (also got a new battery at their suggestion). The next morning the car made it 5 meters before breaking down completely.

Got it towed back to them to fix. 

They could not work out why the new Aux belt broke again and have had the car since trying to work it out (they only have a few people trained in the region and they were all on holiday). 

They have provided me a free car to get to work, which is nice of them.

They suggested speaking to other garages now who might be able to take the car to fix it. Speaking to one today they said that if I had a misfire prior to the car breaking, I would have noticed/felt it. As I did not, the misfire must have been caused since the first aux belt was replaced...ie KwikFit broke it?? KwikFit say my timing belt is overdue for change. It is. However, it wasn't due on my last service. Ironically it would have been changed in this service in March! The "new" garage says its doesn't matter if the timing belt was overdue, its only a problem that its damaged due to the Aux belt hitting it. 

The new garage suggest I get a full written report from KwikFit about what they have done etc.
I am now thinking about what to do next, and whether KwiKfit should be responsible for any repair bill, and if so, how to proceed. Obviously, I cannot prove the car was working fine between their first fix and it breaking the next day, and that it didn't have a misfire before i brought it in. 

Any advice?
Thanks

You should argue that when they changed the first belt and tested it by running the engine they should have been able to detect the misfire if it was present at that point
Is there any evidence of the belt having damaged the cam belt shown by damage to the cam covers if they exist
It is also possible that they are correct and the cambelt has by coincidence let go at the sale time as the aux belt snapped 
I would be focusing on determining why the second aux belt snapped

EdGasketTheSecond

Maybe aux belt wasn't tensioned properly or if a stretch type, maybe damaged in fitting. When they fail it is possible for them to get caught around the pulley and quickly wear through the timing belt cover throwing the timing belt off. Were the timing belt covers damaged? If not I can't see how the aux belt can have affected the timing belt.

Burnsie1983

EdGasketTheSecond said:

Maybe aux belt wasn't tensioned properly or if a stretch type, maybe damaged in fitting. When they fail it is possible for them to get caught around the pulley and quickly wear through the timing belt cover throwing the timing belt off. Were the timing belt covers damaged? If not I can't see how the aux belt can have affected the timing belt.

Not a clue. Not seen the car since mid Jan. Whilst ever they are paying for my hire car, they can take as long as they need. Obviously, now it coming to a head.

EdGasketTheSecond

Well then I suggest you go and have a look at your car; otherwise you and everyone here can only guess at what happened to your car.