EA Lies & Completion Date

akorn77

Hi All, 

The flat I'm buying currently has tenants in it. The EA told me that the Seller had negotiated a 1 month notice with the tenants and that the Seller would give notice 1-2 weeks prior to exchange. Note - the EA told me on 5 separate occasions that the notice was 1 month. Also, the EA lied about length of the lease (he said it was 99 but transpired to be 95). 

EA called me today, to tell me that the Seller gave the tenants notice last week on Thursday 27th February and that the notice period is 2 months (not 1 month like he originally said). Therefore Seller wants Completion on 27th April, which is 2 weeks later than what I originally requested. 

In this situation: 
1) Do I have to accept the tenants 2 month notice period? Can I push back and demand an earlier date? 
2) Should I request that exchange of contracts occur AFTER the tenants have left, in order to assess any potential damage & fixtures/fittings etc.? 

Feel like the EA is taking me for a total mug, and I need to stamp my foot down...argh. I have emailed my solicitor in the meantime, but wanted to gain insight from others here. 

Thanks. 

[Deleted User]

akorn77 said:

In this situation: 
1) Do I have to accept the tenants 2 month notice period? Can I push back and demand an earlier date? 
2) Should I request that exchange of contracts occur AFTER the tenants have left, in order to assess any potential damage & fixtures/fittings etc.? 

1. Yes you have to accept this.  The landlord cant evict tenants before the minimum legal time.   Even at 2 months there is no legal requirement for them to leave.  
2. You would never exchange contracts before the property is empty.  If the tenants move out you will be unable to complete as your lender will require vacant possession.  

So you need to wait at least 2 months before even thinking about exchange of contracts.  Nothing you can do about this

eddddy

When the seller discusses this with their solicitor, their solicitor will strongly advise them not to exchange contracts until the tenants have left and the property is vacant.

The reason being that there is no guarantee that the tenants will leave at the end of their 2 months notice, which could put the seller in breach of contract with you, and you could sue the seller for damages.

The seller might be able to negotiate with the tenants to persuade them to leave earlier (maybe by offering them a 'sweetener') so that  you can exchange and complete earlier. I guess it depends on the tenants circumstances.

Conversely, the tenants may decide they don't want to leave - so the seller has to get a court order, followed by bailiffs etc, which could take up to 6 months.

akorn77

Deleted_User said:

akorn77 said:

In this situation: 
1) Do I have to accept the tenants 2 month notice period? Can I push back and demand an earlier date? 
2) Should I request that exchange of contracts occur AFTER the tenants have left, in order to assess any potential damage & fixtures/fittings etc.? 

1. Yes you have to accept this.  The landlord cant evict tenants before the minimum legal time.   Even at 2 months there is no legal requirement for them to leave.  
2. You would never exchange contracts before the property is empty.  If the tenants move out you will be unable to complete as your lender will require vacant possession.  

So you need to wait at least 2 months before even thinking about exchange of contracts.  Nothing you can do about this

eddddy said:

When the seller discusses this with their solicitor, their solicitor will strongly advise them not to exchange contracts until the tenants have left and the property is vacant.

The reason being that there is no guarantee that the tenants will leave at the end of their 2 months notice, which could put the seller in breach of contract with you, and you could sue the seller for damages.

The seller might be able to negotiate with the tenants to persuade them to leave earlier (maybe by offering them a 'sweetener') so that  you can exchange and complete earlier. I guess it depends on the tenants circumstances.

Conversely, the tenants may decide they don't want to leave - so the seller has to get a court order, followed by bailiffs etc, which could take up to 6 months.

Thanks both. I didnt consider that the property would need to be empty anyway. Needless to say, totally hacked off by the EA's continuous lies - I'm not the first, and probably wont be the last. Will just have to suck it up, no point ruffling feathers for the sake of 2 weeks. 

Tiglet2

Your EA doesn't have any idea how it works, he is acting for the seller and just wants the sale to complete so he can collect his commission.  They invent possible solutions to keep you from pulling out.  Your solicitor is the person you should be talking to, he is acting on your behalf and is the person conducting the legal transfer of the property from the seller to you.  As above, there are processes in place, i.e. tenants should be given two months notice and you must not exchange until the tenants have left and you have inspected the property, i.e. in case of any damage.

Thrugelmir

akorn77 said:

Deleted_User said:

akorn77 said:

In this situation: 
1) Do I have to accept the tenants 2 month notice period? Can I push back and demand an earlier date? 
2) Should I request that exchange of contracts occur AFTER the tenants have left, in order to assess any potential damage & fixtures/fittings etc.? 

1. Yes you have to accept this.  The landlord cant evict tenants before the minimum legal time.   Even at 2 months there is no legal requirement for them to leave.  
2. You would never exchange contracts before the property is empty.  If the tenants move out you will be unable to complete as your lender will require vacant possession.  

So you need to wait at least 2 months before even thinking about exchange of contracts.  Nothing you can do about this

eddddy said:

When the seller discusses this with their solicitor, their solicitor will strongly advise them not to exchange contracts until the tenants have left and the property is vacant.

The reason being that there is no guarantee that the tenants will leave at the end of their 2 months notice, which could put the seller in breach of contract with you, and you could sue the seller for damages.

The seller might be able to negotiate with the tenants to persuade them to leave earlier (maybe by offering them a 'sweetener') so that  you can exchange and complete earlier. I guess it depends on the tenants circumstances.

Conversely, the tenants may decide they don't want to leave - so the seller has to get a court order, followed by bailiffs etc, which could take up to 6 months.

 Needless to say, totally hacked off by the EA's continuous lies 

Your vendor is the source of the information. 

steampowered

I think you are being unfair on the EA here. The EA was probably just passing on what they were told by the vendor. The EA is not a solicitor and is not responsible for doing due diligence on the property. The reason why you instruct a solicitor is to get things like the duration of the lease checked.

You don't have a guaranteed completion date until contracts are exchanged with a date written in. A delay of 2 weeks is actually very short. Lots of people are faced with delays lasting months and months.

The general advice is to make sure that the property is vacant before exchanging contracts. Until the tenants have actually left the property you don't know for sure that it will be vacant on completion.

akorn77

What happens if lets say hypothetically, the tenants leave and there is some damage to the property or any fixtures/fittings are missing? You need to go back and haggle a discount to account for it or ask the Seller to repair it prior to exchange? 

Lokolo

steampowered said:

I think you are being unfair on the EA here. The EA was probably just passing on what they were told by the vendor. The EA is not a solicitor and is not responsible for doing due diligence on the property. The reason why you instruct a solicitor is to get things like the duration of the lease checked.

You don't have a guaranteed completion date until contracts are exchanged with a date written in. A delay of 2 weeks is actually very short. Lots of people are faced with delays lasting months and months.

The general advice is to make sure that the property is vacant before exchanging contracts. Until the tenants have actually left the property you don't know for sure that it will be vacant on completion.

I disagree. Any EA with a little knowledge will know tenants cannot be evicted within a couple of weeks. 

Fosterdog

Lokolo said:I disagree. Any EA with a little knowledge will know tenants cannot be evicted within a couple of weeks. 

I agree that an EA should know basic legalities of things like this, however in this case the vendor had told the EA that there was an agreement in place with the tenant for just one months notice, the tenant and landlord can agree to any terms they want, if the tenant was happy to accept it and prepared to leave they could accept just a single day notice. It's not the EAs fault that for whatever reason the one month notice is no longer happening, it could be that the vendor lied, or that the tenants changed their mind. These tenants don't have to be evicted, that only happens if they don't choose to leave when their notice is up, if they choose to go down the eviction route then it will be several months.

steampowered

akorn77 said:

What happens if lets say hypothetically, the tenants leave and there is some damage to the property or any fixtures/fittings are missing? You need to go back and haggle a discount to account for it or ask the Seller to repair it prior to exchange? 

Yes - that's exactly right.

You should have some idea of the state of the property from your viewings but you always face the risk of something changing since you viewed. If you feel strongly about it you can insist on a final inspection once the tenants have left before exchanging contracts.

You also have this risk when buying from owner occupiers - some owner occupiers do silly things like taking curtain rails and lightbulbs with them when they move out.

Remember the tenants being given 2 months notice does not necessarily mean they will leave on that date. If the tenants refuse to leave, it would be necessary for the landlord to apply to court for possession of the property which could take months. Hopefully that's an unlikely scenario but it could happen if the tenants don't find another property.