Borders and fences

Lizzydot

Hi. Looking for a bit of advice. I've done a search and found multiple discussions on the finer points of property borders and responsibilities and know there is no hard and fast legal rules, but currently feeling a bit backed into a corner!
In the recent winds a fence panel between mine and my neighbours house blew down, as I know many people's did! I double  checked my deeds, which stated this border belonged to my neighbour, which I thought was the case following discussions with previous neighbours in that property. This neighbor is now however claiming their deeds state it is a shared fence, they sent me a copy of a piece of paper, but quite frankly they could have typed that themselves for all I know, and so they are wanting me to pay half. I suspect I'm going to end up paying half as don't want to spend the rest of my life with a missing fence panel, and certainly won't go to the expense of seeking legal advice over a fence, but wondering if anyone knows if there's any way to clarify which deeds are correct/ who infact is responsible for that fence? Just wanting to make sure I'm not being taken advantage of!!

Thanks

dimbo61

Wow I have just bought 10 fence panels which are 6 foot by 5 foot and cost £22 each.
How much are you talking about here ?

Davesnave

Lizzydot said:

 I double  checked my deeds, which stated this border belonged to my neighbour,

  I don't think they did. They may have stated who has a responsibility for marking that boundary and maintaining whatever is employed for that purpose, but it would be unusual if they also said what materials would be involved. The neighbour might decide to plant a hedge in the gap, or bang in some road pins and a length of rope.

You haven't quoted either your or your neighbour's deeds, so how are we to judge?

No one owns a boundary; it's a theoretical place which someone may mark with something they own or share, like a fence. Regardless of what the title documents say, you'd be entitled to plug the gap by erecting your own fence panel on your own land just inside the place where the boundary is thought to be. That would be silly, but it's the logical alternative if you feel put-upon for being asked to share a cost from which you will benefit.

Lizzydot

Obviously I'm talking about maintaining the boundary, it was just easier to describe it as above. In my legal pack it states maintenance of this boundary is the responsibility of my neighbour. Their legal pack states shared.  I was simply asking if there is a way to check who the responsibility lies with. The money isn't so much an issue as the fact previous neighbours have always agreed it's their fence, and were adament when I had the rest of my fence replaced and wanted to get that bit done too I couldn't as it was theirs and they didn't want it done! Now I'm a bit aggreaved at having to pay the extra labour costs when I was already paying for them before.

Like I said, I fully accept that I will be paying, just interested if there is a way to check actual responsibilities. That's all I'm asking!!

princeofpounds

As Davesnave says, no-one owns a boundary. It's just a conceptual line that is (normally) defined by a boundary feature on the ground, located (in general terms) through use of the title plan.
One or both of you may own the fence that sits along the boundary. One or both of you may have an obligation to maintain the fence that sits along the boundary. These are two different statements for a reason; ownership of the fence does not imply an obligation to repair. So please be precise about what exactly your deeds say. 

The deeds may explain the situation with the fence, or more often they are silent. Some other historic documentation may exist that explains who owns the fence, or establish an obligation to repair, but it's quite possible that even if the latter contract (or whatever) exists, it may well not be binding. What actually is this piece of paper your neighbour has produced supposed to be, and what does it say?

You can check your own deeds and your neighbour's deeds on the land registry website for a few pounds. This seems to be a cheap way of establishing what both your rights and obligations are.

Davesnave

Lizzydot said:

 just interested if there is a way to check actual responsibilities. That's all I'm asking!!

As I said earlier, no one can  advise if the exact wording of the statements in your neighbour's and your documentation isn't quoted, and as princeofpounds says, the legal force those statements carry also depends on what the documents are.

akwexavante

Download your neighbours title from land registry, £6.

https://www.gov.uk/search-property-information-land-registry

Carrot007

Putting it simply for the most likely option.

The deeds says who maintains the boundry. This is often opne saide but could be both. It is nothing to do with a fence. Sticks and string would be fine. Or indeed nothing and just telling your neighbour when they did something wrong.

The fence is owned by whoever erected it. This does not imply a need to replace it if if fails.

The deeds could specify more than this. But even if they do enforcing it is not going to be cheap unless it is on a new development with houses still being built where the company still care. It is even possible as oinly a nieghbour you cannot enforce the deed.

50/50 is reasonable. My fences have been replaced since I moved here, I am per the deeds responsible for the boundry.

For one nieighhbour I agreed they could replace the fence to gain a slither of an angle for their extention onto what was my land. 9a couple of inches going down to nothing! Sounded good and they paid. On the other side is two neighvbours. For the couple of comparable age I went 50/50 on the costs (I even painted them before putting them in as I wanted that!), on the other which was not many panels and a retired guy I just bore the cost.

So unless the deebs (and you need to look at both) say something out of the ordinary it is whatever you negociate.

millie

We have had to pay for the fencing on both sides of our garden because both the neighbors stated they di not want a fence up at all. We did as at the time we had small children so paid for both sides all 24 panels. If we wanted it we had to pay for it, and we have had to maintain it and replace it for the last 20 years. Still have the same neighbors.

diggingdude

millie said:

We have had to pay for the fencing on both sides of our garden because both the neighbors stated they di not want a fence up at all. We did as at the time we had small children so paid for both sides all 24 panels. If we wanted it we had to pay for it, and we have had to maintain it and replace it for the last 20 years. Still have the same neighbors.

I'm facing this soon with my neighbours who dispute any need to repair a broken fence (good luck if their cute dog gets into my garden as I may keep it hostage). I will end up paying for the fence but may well remove it when I move to be petty