Landlord Claiming deposit through TDS and Money Claim Online

Dornoch1

Here's an issue faced by two colleagues (a married couple) who moved out of their rented house four months ago..
The landlord verbally demanded £560 cash from them for repairs and renovations plus the deposit 10 days after the end of the tenancy and keys handed over. (recorded on phone too.) It went to arbitration with TDS. The landlord sent an invoice for £2,800 to the ex tenants over 3 weeks after the keys were handed over as well as sending it to TDS as a "check-out" report.
TDS adjudicated that there was no contemporaneous check-in or check-out report and ruled in favour of the tenant for the refund of the whole deposit.(£400)
During the adjudication process, the landlord submitted a claim for the same amount including the deposit to Money Claim Online, but did not make it clear to MCOL that this included the deposit that was being adjudicated upon by TDS.
TDS when notified of the MCOL case by tenants said it was too late to change as the adjudication was imminent. It came 12 days later.
MCOL when notified by tenants refused to note the TDS adjudication as it came 2 days after their date for submission of evidence.
The tenants are now concerned that the landlord is having two bites at getting their deposit and possibly misleading MCOL to gain money from them (demanding new for old replacements etc)..
Any thoughts about this?
Postscript; I have just seen my colleagues old house up for sale at a local estate agency with fixtures and fittings "as seen" and in the same condition as they left it. They were wise enough to take date stamped videos on the day they moved out. It looks even more like the landlord is misleading MCOL to me now.

anselld

The TDS adjudication does not prevent the L making a claim through the Courts and the T will need to defend it again. However the Courts usually take a fairly dim view of a case being taken to them after adjudication.

The postscript is entirely irrelevant as there is no obligation on the Landlord to implement the repairs they have claimed.

AdrianC

Dornoch1 wrote: »

TDS adjudicated that there was no contemporaneous check-in or check-out report and ruled in favour of the tenant for the refund of the whole deposit.(£400)
During the adjudication process, the landlord submitted a claim for the same amount including the deposit to Money Claim Online, but did not make it clear to MCOL that this included the deposit that was being adjudicated upon by TDS.

The tenants are now concerned that the landlord is having two bites at getting their deposit and possibly misleading MCOL to gain money from them (demanding new for old replacements etc)..
Any thoughts about this?

Simple. When they lodge their defence to the small claim, they include that fact, along with a copy of the TDS adjudication.

They'll win the case.

Postscript; I have just seen my colleagues old house up for sale at a local estate agency with fixtures and fittings "as seen" and in the same condition as they left it.

Completely irrelevant, even if they'd been held liable for failings in the condition.

Dornoch1

I have just noted on the MCOL website that "claims relating to the Tenancy Deposit Scheme should not be issued via MCOL" yet they appear to have let the LL do just that.

G_M

Dornoch1 wrote: »

I have just noted on the MCOL website that "claims relating to the Tenancy Deposit Scheme should not be issued via MCOL" yet they appear to have let the LL do just that.

Link please?

My guess is that this is means that when relying on the scheme, the scheme arbitration proces should be used. But that does not stop either side using MCOL for claims for damages.


So the LL has claimed variously £560 (verbally) and £2,800. What exactly are the claims for?Was the property damaged? In a poor condition compared to at start of tenancy (bearing in mind fair wear & tear)?

Dornoch1

As a new user, I can't post links however, it is bullet point 5 of "You cannot use MCOL to make a claim against" on page 4 of the Money Claim Online (MCOL) – User Guide for Claimants.: Two clicks from a google search for Money claim Online.

G_M

Dornoch1 wrote: »

As a new user, I can't post links however, it is bullet point 5 of "You cannot use MCOL to make a claim against" on page 4 of the Money Claim Online (MCOL) – User Guide for Claimants.: Two clicks from a google search for Money claim Online.

Poorly explained I think.

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/458835/money-claim-online-user-guide.pdf


As I said, I think this is saying if you want to claim via the scheme, you can't use MCOL.


In this case, for example, the LL is claiming outside the scheme. The deposit is only £400 anyway and his claim is for £500 (or £1800 - a bit unclear). I don't see an issue with his claiming this way, though obviously you have grounds to contest and counter-claim.

hb2

From the .gov. intro
"What you can’t claim for on MCOL
You can’t use this service to:

make a claim against a government department or agency, for example HMRC or DVLA
get compensation for an accident or injury
get your tenancy deposit back from your landlord"

and then the bit from the guide
"You cannot use MCOL to make a claim against:
• a child under 18
• someone who lacks 'mental capacity' (someone unable to make their own decisions)
• a government department or agency, for example HMRC or DVLA
• an individual or company as a result of a tribunal award
• claims relating to the Tenancy Deposit Scheme should not be issued via MCOL (more
information is provided at www.gov.uk/tenancy-deposit-protection)"

but I haven't pursued the TDS link.

Sorry, x posted with GM

tom9980

I don't remember MCOL saying that about deposit scheme arbitration, might be a recent change. I was suing tenant for just shy of £1k after taking the full £800 deposit, the judge didn't bat an eyelid. It seems this case is similar as the landlord wants more than the deposit and the only way to enforce that is court action.

This landlord will look a prize idiot when your friends defend with no checkin and checkout inventory plus the arbitration scheme already in their favour. The problem is getting it added to evidence it seems they may be due in court fairly soon if evidence has been sent to court and to the other party?

First thing I would say to the judge is "sir on xyz date the TDS arbitration scheme ruled on this case in our favour because of no inventory at check in or out, because of the deadlines for submitting evidence it was impossible for this to be included in the evidence pack, we have a copy for you if you would like to see it" then hope he allows it.

Dornoch1

The £560 verbal claim and recorded phone voice message said "I've worked it out, you owe me £560" followed by various obscenities.The £2800 invoice was sent after tenants asked for the return of the deposit and includes the deposit. The seperate totals were £250 for cleaning, £1331 for damage and £1202 redecoration plus interest. All were rejected by TDS as there was no contemporaneous check-in or check-out report and the LL was claiming new for old as well as for items not listed anywhere.

tom9980

Dornoch1 wrote: »

The £560 verbal claim and recorded phone voice message said "I've worked it out, you owe me £560" followed by various obscenities.The £2800 invoice was sent after tenants asked for the return of the deposit and includes the deposit. The seperate totals were £250 for cleaning, £1331 for damage and £1202 plus interest. All were rejected by TDS as there was no contemporaneous check-in or check-out report and the LL was claiming new for old as well as for items not listed anywhere.

Betterment should be part of the defence.