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Prism

ZingPowZing wrote: »

That is interesting, bowlhead. I'll take your word for that.
You work in the industry and have posted 9000 times - please bring up one where you have endorsed sharesave as an investment.

Come on, you know how to use Google.

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=6048566#2

bowlhead99

ZingPowZing wrote: »

That is interesting, bowlhead. I'll take your word for that.
You work in the industry and have posted 9000 times - please bring up one where you have endorsed sharesave as an investment.

Sure.

Here is a thread where I explained why the Sainsbury's sharesave was a great deal, noting that, "If markets are flat you make a massive gain. If markets are up you make a massiver gain. It's a very limited-risk, one way bet, with the risk just being missing out on what other things you could have done with the money, none of which are as potentially lucrative for the same level of risk." I went on to conclude:

bowlhead99 wrote: »

They are letting you play a game where heads you win, tails you can't lose much. So, when offered these things, take them, if your finances allow.

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/75040307#Comment_75040307


Here is a thread where I explained the practical aspects of buying shares at 'a nice discount to market value' and how to efficiently transfer or dispose of them.
https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showpost.php?p=75613709&postcount=41

Here is a thread today where I assisted someone with the CGT implications and ISA rules surrounding the matured shares from a scheme which they were looking to exit as swiftly and efficiently as possible. No anti-sharesave vibes from me.
https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/76658055#Comment_76658055

Here is a thread where I explained in some detail why sharesave schemes were the safest versions of the different types of scheme towards which an employer might let you contribute, and rubbished the shortsighted fearmongering of someone who had given an example of a scheme that didn't work out as succesfully as hoped. I noted: "It is nearly always correct to join a scheme that offers a potential good upside return and very minimal downside risk."
https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/75650619#Comment_75650619

Here is a thread where I explained how to efficiently handle the gains from the scheme; the post was not for or against participation in the scheme, but I wasn't at all negative towards participation in it, and the OP said "thanks for the VERY detailed response"
https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/76307644#Comment_76307644

Here is a thread where I discussed the interplay between a sharesave and CSOP, for which the OP thanked me with "Wow that is brilliant"
https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/75600947#Comment_75600947

Here is a thread where I explored options for hedging a potential sharesave gain to lock it in using spreadbets, options or other financial instruments, for which the OP thanked me with "Great post". There was no discouragement from participation in the scheme.
https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/76658055#Comment_76658055

Here is an older thread unconnected to sharesaves where I noted that a reason to participate in individual company shares and expose yourself to the extreme risk and volatility of doing that would be, "if you are getting a sweetener to compensate you for the extreme high risk. Such as, for example, being able to buy the shares below market price and with tax breaks using a sharesave scheme or other incentive plan from your employer."
https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/72142663#Comment_72142663

My attitude towards sharesaves is not a recent phenomenon, despite never having had access to one myself.

Going back five years, here is a thread discussing a couple of share scheme options where I opened with, "The sharesave would be a no-brainer then..." and noted "This can be a great way for someone who might not have an awful lot of free cash to start building themselves a little nest egg for the future. Saving / investing rather than spending is a good thing. But if money is tight, I would max out the first one as a priority (because it's risk free) and then put less than the maximum on the second one, and only if I was willing to take a bit of a chance.
https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/66529083#Comment_66529083
https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/66535799#Comment_66535799

Another?
https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/76277652#Comment_76277652

bowlhead99 wrote: »

There isn't really another 'real world, outside the company' investment option that offers a chance to make lots of money with the downside of losing no money. I would be committing as much money per month as the company would allow me - although, granted, I probably have more spare income than you.

What I would perhaps do in your shoes is spread your options about:
- Keep going with the scheme you have which matures in 4 years
- Start a new scheme in the new deal which matures in 5 years
- Start a new scheme in the new deal which matures in 3 years

(You didn't mention a 3-year scheme as an option but there nearly always is one offered).

£75 a month might seem like a lot but saving is a very good discipline to get into, and you will presumably get pay rises over the next 3,4,5 years which will make it easier.

You tend to find on here that most sharesave threads are about how to handle the proceeds rather than whether to participate in the first place, because participation is generally a no-brainer if one's financial capacity allows, and there is rarely any need for me to get involved in those threads because others get there first and give an adequate reply.

You could search my posting history for the word 'sharesave' or 'one-way bet' and find many examples of me endorsing them though some posts would not be easily found because I will have endorsed them on many threads without explicitly using the word 'sharesave' within the body of my reply, to be caught by the search tool. There is no real point me digging them all up for you, but feel free to 'DIY' if you are interested.

As an aside, my involvement in the financial services industry is not in retail savings, investment or insurance products, so I am not motivated by greed or commission in my posts here.

As you note, I have over 9000 posts, thanked in over 70% of them. Either I'm talking crap, as a shill for the industry that pays my wages, or alternatively perhaps I know what I am talking about and have given thousands of hours for free to help others because I'm a nice guy. I'm not the only one in the industry who gives their independent opinion and guidance for free, but you could imagine it rankles when people assume anyone who does not at all times support the common man against the corporations must be on the payroll of the bad guys.

SlaveToMyCats

Sometimes it's hard to accept the truth. We'd all love to be able to trade or invest our way to financial freedom. I used to dream of sitting on a beach in Thailand placing orders and making a living. It's intuitive to believe that if we work hard enough at something we can be a success of it and make money from it.



But the stark reality is that markets are very efficient and you have virtually no chance of outperforming them. The majority of fund managers can't consistently outperform the market, despite being supported by analysts, market information etc.



The good news though is that over the longer term, equities markets have a positive bias and thus if you buy and hold, and you are adequately diversified (to avoid wipe out) you should make money.

SlaveToMyCats

Sorry hit post too soon! My conclusion would be that since even 'the experts' can't reliably stock pick you should avoid trying to buy individual shares and instead have a diversified equities fund which you are willing to buy and hold for the long term.

[Deleted User]

SlaveToMyCats - Not to overlook your post(s), I agree with some of your points but not the conclusion.

bowlhead - I'm happy to see your reply and acknowledge your repeated endorsements for sharesave. Back in the summer I did mention sharesave as a good way of investing and there were a couple of dissenters; bowlhead supports the idea much more eloquently.
As stated, it is one of the few investment/saving vessels that is copper-bottomed, and bowlhead's recommendations count for a lot on here.

Bravepants

ZingPowZing wrote: »

What you do then is very important: Like having two children, when you have two investments, the easier strategy is to imagine the weaker will "catch up". Don't succumb to that notion. Back the winner.

Wow! I sincerely hope that you never have children! Poor kid!

bowlhead99

ZingPowZing wrote: »

bowlhead - I'm happy to see your reply and acknowledge your repeated endorsements for sharesave. Back in the summer I did mention sharesave as a good way of investing and there were a couple of dissenters

Not really. Nobody with a background in financial services dissented from the view that sharesaves could be useful where available, but the vast majority of people do not work for the few hundred employers where they are broadly offered; they work for the million others where they are not.

What you were remembering as 'back in the summer' was the first week of November, where your recommendations on the [URL="https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/6064952for the next 3-5 years[/URL] and '[URL="https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/6066910it insane to invest in the stock market now?[/URL]' threads were that the person should invest in a sharesave scheme. In neither case did the thread starter actually have access to such a scheme.

Prior to that week, your contributions to the forum had largely centred around criticism of Hargreaves Lansdown and DB transfer matters; fears of a depreciating pound causing a desire to keep your money outside the UK to avoid Brexit issues; and your distrust of financial services businesses and their employees generally.

But as we went into November, you had a new 'flavour of the month' which was telling people at random that they should invest in sharesave schemes despite over 90% of people not having access to such schemes. The second time you brought it up, somebody called you out and enquired why you were repeatedly promoting the schemes to people who hadn't said they had access to one and were merely curious about whether it was a good time to invest in shares generally.

You've now misremembered this as the forum being negative towards sharesave schemes in general, and then leapt to blaming this imagined negativity on the fact that the schemes do not generate commission for financial services workers, whom you dislike.

ZingPowZing wrote: »

Await the origin of Malthusian's baguettes with interest, if he is travelling to France to buy them then his assertion makes sense.

Does he work in the financial services industry?

ZingPowZing wrote: »

Watching your investments reduce in price is a good thing
Have you considered a career in financial services ?

ZingPowZing wrote: »

... help out kinger101

Does he work in the financial services industry?

As someone who works in the financial service industry using my spare time to help others achieve better outcomes without financial gain to myself, your bigotry and selective amnesia is depressing.

MaxiRobriguez

Notepad_Phil

bowlhead99 wrote: »

As someone who works in the financial service industry using my spare time to help others achieve better outcomes without financial gain to myself, your bigotry and selective amnesia is depressing.

I'm sure that I'm not the only one on this board who appreciates the time and effort you and others spend on this board. Please do not get depressed when what I believe must be a very small minority have such a distorted view on the motives of others.

The regular readers of this forum can see what's happening, whilst I'm sure that even new readers soon pick up the vibe too.

MaxiRobriguez

More than anything Bowlhead I appreciate the great length of responses you often go to. There's a lot of knowledgeable people here that give succinct answers to questions but your one of a few that goes the whole hog. Thank you!