Edf trying to con £1400 for a quarter ??? SORTED THANKS

bimma

Hi guys

first like to wish everyone a merry xmas and a happy new year, another fantastic year of great advice and help so thank you all.

so the issue is this

1) property had a pre pay meter with EDF energy
2) tenant left in Oct 2018 and left the cards for top up
3) property was severly in need of refurb including some underpinnng so remained empty whilst trying to get engineers report find a a decent builder at a fair pric
5) was topping up minimal for lighting and odd power tool whilst starting removing the plaster etc
4) Went abroad for some 6 months due to death in family and during that time electric wasnt being use
5) upon return saw a letter from edf saying contact us urgently
6) the meter went into credit for approx £70 during that time (elec not used so just standing charge
6) called them who said they wanted an engineer to come and look at meter.
7) Engineer came out on aprox 18 Oct 19 this year and said the meter was faulty as when it went into credit it over a certain amount, should have cut out but it didnt and changed it to a normal meter not pre pay. i took meter reading all was ok.
8) the previous tenant had run a wire from the electric fuse box for elec cooker which he said was not right and switched elec off

9) this week i received a bill for £1400 for the QUARTER despite the house still being empty and the builders only using lighting from about a month ago

this is for a £399 RPS investigation charge
and a £1100 charge for THEFT OF ELECTRIC from over a year ago

i called them to ask what was going on .they said the charge was for them to come and look at and change it to a normal meter (even though i did not request that,) and they would speak to the engineer on monday re theft charge

the THEFT OF ELECTRIC IS nonsense because it was a pre pay meter up until Oct 19. and was regularly topped up. the house was empty. the £70 credit ...i topped up the day the engineer came leaving approx £25 in credit so at max from the switch over it should be a £25 credit charge

what do i do please help

matelodave

Did you open your own account with the energy company when the tenant vacated the property or did you just keep using their account/payment cards. If you did the latter then you'll probably still be liable for all the charges.

DawnCrush

bimma wrote: »

Hi guys

first like to wish everyone a merry xmas and a happy new year, another fantastic year of great advice and help so thank you all.

so the issue is this

1) property had a pre pay meter with EDF energy
2) tenant left in Oct 2018 and left the cards for top up
3) property was severly in need of refurb including some underpinnng so remained empty whilst trying to get engineers report find a a decent builder at a fair pric
5) was topping up minimal for lighting and odd power tool whilst starting removing the plaster etc
4) Went abroad for some 6 months due to death in family and during that time electric wasnt being use
5) upon return saw a letter from edf saying contact us urgently
6) the meter went into credit for approx £70 during that time (elec not used so just standing charge
6) called them who said they wanted an engineer to come and look at meter.
7) Engineer came out on aprox 18 Oct 19 this year and said the meter was faulty as when it went into credit it over a certain amount, should have cut out but it didnt and changed it to a normal meter not pre pay. i took meter reading all was ok.
8) the previous tenant had run a wire from the electric fuse box for elec cooker which he said was not right and switched elec off

9) this week i received a bill for £1400 for the QUARTER despite the house still being empty and the builders only using lighting from about a month ago

this is for a £399 RPS investigation charge
and a £1100 charge for THEFT OF ELECTRIC from over a year ago

i called them to ask what was going on .they said the charge was for them to come and look at and change it to a normal meter (even though i did not request that,) and they would speak to the engineer on monday re theft charge

the THEFT OF ELECTRIC IS nonsense because it was a pre pay meter up until Oct 19. and was regularly topped up. the house was empty. the £70 credit ...i topped up the day the engineer came leaving approx £25 in credit so at max from the switch over it should be a £25 credit charge

what do i do please help

I suggest, no urge you to seek independent legal advice as soon as possible.

You are facing a charge which is a serious criminal offence. Upon conviction, you could face up to 5 years imprisonment and up to a £2000 fine.
That's before compensation, costs, statutory victim surcharge, etc

You may want to tip off your former tenant too. On the face of it he's going to cop it too.

When did you return from your 6 months abroad? :huh:

bimma

matelodave i used their cards as it was small amounts of top up. but the meter was topped up up until end may 19. and i can confirm there is no dodgy theft of electric theyre implying.

but surely if it was £75 in debt they came to check it...it was obvious the house was empty...no carpets/furniture, floor boards/plaster ripped up. why not just say top it up and move on. i didnt ask for the new meter to be fitted

there was no activity at all from april to oct 19 due to death in family .

Gerry1

Is the new wiring upstream or downstream of the meter?

[Deleted User]

I work for EDF as a meter reader. The electric prepay meter is the most bypassed meter I see .
A lay person would not know if a prepayment meter was bypassed just by a looking at it.
You would have to unscrew the lower cover and examine it carefully which the engineer would have done..They photograph the meter tamper as evidence , plus EDF would have a payment history of the property ..All bypassed meters are replaced with a new one and it s charged to the account holder .A new meter after a bypass is around £250
.EDF would replace the old one with a new smart meter which can be used in either credit or prepayment mode.
EDF would have historic records of the normal usage of the meter plus their "engineer " (one of out meter readers actually who worked for either G4S or MDS ) would not have been claiming that the there had been theft of electric without concrete evidence.
A bypassed electric meter can still be topped up as it can pay for the standing charges which would otherwise build up.
These charges EDF are applying are probably for your former tenant.
You could ask EDF what proof they have that the meter was bypassed and that theft of electricity had occurred.
Suppliers would not be escalating any theft of electric or gas to a prosecution. In my experience I have never known anyone I have caught meter tampering face a criminal charge.
Suppliers prefer to try and reclaim lost revenue rather than escalate it to an expensive litigation in court.
Are you sure that the meter was showing £75 in credit on screen "A " ? Prepay meters can show an obscure minus sign or the word "owed " which is hard to see, so it could have been £75 in debt .
Once EDF have offered an explanation of the £1400 debt justifying the theft of electric claim , then you should be asking EDF to transfer this debt to your former tenant who you can name , with a possible forwarding address..
Landlords are not responsible for any theft of electricity or any debts at all from their tenants, but it was a mistake by you not to close the outgoing account once the tenant vacated and replace it under your name and only use a top up card in your name.

DawnCrush

Houbara wrote: »

....
Suppliers would not be escalating any theft of electric or gas to a prosecution. In my experience I have never known anyone I have caught meter tampering face a criminal charge.
Suppliers prefer to try and reclaim lost revenue rather than escalate it to an expensive litigation in court.
...

I'm sure I'm misunderstanding what you are saying.

Surely you are not suggesting that prosecutions do not result from the illegal abstraction of electricity? If there was no sanction, save for paying what is used if caught, I'm sure many more people would take their chances.

If you are simply saying it is not the supplier themselves that pursue the prosecution, I would tend to agree with you. Whilst private prosecutions are possible, they are not common and can lead to critisism from the courts; it's the CPS who usually take on prosecutions. Even if a private prosecution were commenced, the CPS have the right to take them over.

Just a few facts to assist:
In Northern Ireland alone, over the period 2014-2016 there were over 350 convictions for electricity theft.
Almost 50 of those resulted in immediate imprisonment of the offenders, whilst another 90 received suspended sentences.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-43318845


And here are the number of prosections for various other regions of the UK for the 2014-2015 period:

bimma

gerry1 no idea what that means lol.

Houbara thanks for this. At the time the engineer came out he did not mention anything about tampering. just replaced the meter as he said it was faulty.

he changed the meter. he said the £76 was strange as it should not have gone to that..it should have just cut out after so much in "debt". The former tenant had fitted a electric cooker (original gas) and therefore there was wire going from the kitchen along the wall to the fuse box. he said this should have been put through the ceiling. and said it needed sorting properly.


there was no mention of tampering at all.


Yes they will have payment history for the property. and I accept that it was a silly oversight not to change it over but as it was a card system and the property was empty it wasn't a priority of mine. I mentioned this to the lady on the phone when arranging the appointment for engineer to come out.


spoke to edf and they said call back Monday as they will speak to the 2 engineers who came out.

There was very little topped up from Oct 18 to now as the property was empty needed major top to bottom refurb. plaster, joists, underpinning, bath, kitchen. and from april 19-oct 19 there was the build up of the £76 on the meter due to no activity whatsoever due to family bereavement .


I will add a pic of the bill in a second

DawnCrush

bimma wrote: »

...there was no mention of tampering at all.....

As it's that time of year:

Oh yes there was!!!

bimma wrote: »

...
this is for a £399 RPS investigation charge
and a £1100 charge for THEFT OF ELECTRIC from over a year ago...

Gerry1

bimma wrote: »

gerry1 no idea what that means lol.

If the new wiring is downstream of the meter (after the meter) it means the electricity for the cooker is being metered and paid for.

If the new wiring is upstream of the meter (before the meter) it means the meter has been bypassed and that electricity for the cooker is being stolen.

bimma

Gerry1 the wire for the cooker was going from the fuse box so after the meter

the operator on the phone said they couldn't see an explanation on the account hence call back monday