TFL Tube Inspection Failed

katty28

i was asked by a plain clothes tube inspector to tap my contactler wireless thingy card on the reader. she said the card was showing as never existed on tfl before. it was new plastic thing that i start using today but tapped in and working all green light. she take my home and me info and said i will get a letter. this isn't me blame to how do i fight it?

T-G-C

When using a new card on the TFL Network, it can take up-to 30 minutes for the central server to request authorization from the card issuer. This process will either flag the card as valid and allow continued travel or add it to the blacklist, where all readers across the network will decline it upon presentation.

However, even if a card fails the card issuer check, it is still valid for travel for the remainder of the original fare, as long as it was tapped at the start. Therefore, it seems TFL's central server, which is what the inspection device relies on, had not downloaded the data from the original station's gate, hence the reason it was showing as Error 91 Card not yet valid Contactless payment Card not yet valid

The good news however, is that now the data has been uploaded to the central server, TFL are now aware that it was tapped in originally and can see the intention to pay the fare. There is also no risk to them either, as the funds will be retrieved through an offline transaction, whereby the card issuer must honor the money, even if it places your card balance into negative.

Wait for the letter and contact them on the provided number. Explain the circumstances based on how I have explained it and one simple check on their system will verify this. As that card would have been marked as fare evasion, it would be blacklisted across all TFL readers. Once you speak with them, the penalty fare should be cancelled and you can continue travelling with the card going forward.

Mr_Singleton

T-G-C wrote: »

When using a new card on the TFL Network, it can take up-to 30 minutes for the central server to request authorization from the card issuer.

Wait for the letter and contact them on the provided number. Explain the circumstances based on how I have explained it and one simple check on their system will verify this. As that card would have been marked as fare evasion, it would be blacklisted across all TFL readers. Once you speak with them, the penalty fare should be cancelled and you can continue travelling with the card going forward.

Do you think that TFL’s response is reasonable?

Would it not be more reasonable for TFL to wait as it knows of this potential problem then recheck after an appropriate amount of time?

Currently the OP is being accused of fare evasion which is a criminal offence. The card is blocked which could cause severe inconvenience. TFL require them to wait for a letter then explain/beg in the hope they don’t get fined or worse all at the whim of TFL.

“The penalty fare SHOULD be cancelled” my emphasis..... but the OP did absolutely nothing wrong. They tapped got a green light and the barrier opened. This is 100% a TFL issue that no doubt they make money out of when people pay up on receiving a threatening penalty fare letter especially somebody like the OP who appears to be possibly be foreign.

And people wonder why I HATE TFL!!!

T-G-C

Mr_Singleton wrote: »

Do you think that TFL’s response is reasonable?

Would it not be more reasonable for TFL to wait as it knows of this potential problem then recheck after an appropriate amount of time?

Currently the OP is being accused of fare evasion which is a criminal offence. The card is blocked which could cause severe inconvenience. TFL require them to wait for a letter then explain/beg in the hope they don’t get fined or worse all at the whim of TFL.

“The penalty fare SHOULD be cancelled” my emphasis..... but the OP did absolutely nothing wrong. They tapped got a green light and the barrier opened. This is 100% a TFL issue that no doubt they make money out of when people pay up on receiving a threatening penalty fare letter especially somebody like the OP who appears to be possibly be foreign.

And people wonder why I HATE TFL!!!

It would be more inconvenient for them to refuse all new cards that are not known to the TFL CSAN database already. As such, the reader assumes entry and the card is later checked to be valid and registered, within 30 minutes but is usually within 10 outside of busier periods.

It is highly unfortunate that the OP was inspected within the time-frame between tapping in and the card + tap-in being registered on the central server. The likelihood of being inspected on the tube is quite low, but to be in that situation is even rarer.

Whilst it might come across as intimidating, TFL will not charge anyone who had a valid travel authority for the whole of their journey. Once contact is made, the reversal will be processed and card re-activated. For the time being, an Oyster can be obtained from a local store or an alternative Contactless-enabled card with at-least £1 on it for the authorization check can be used instead.

Where an inspection device does not have an internet connection to the CSAN database, for example on the underground, it will accept any Contactless-enabled card at the time as valid, unless there was residue data on the device from the previous download, indicating whether the card had been tapped-in or blacklisted. If no previous record exists and it cannot check for a new update, then that card will be scheduled for a review the following day. If no tap-in entry was registered, an automated penalty fare of "maximum fare" will be charged. As the OP was presumably above-ground, the device was able to contact the central server and could not detect a tap-in nor any previous history associated with the card. The inspector would have had to assume that the cardholder did not tap-in and has no history of doing so in the past. Inspectors are told that Contactless customers with a history of usage are to be warned of fare evasion and the incident recorded, but not necessarily fined on a first occasion - only the maximum fare charged to them at midnight instead which the system will do automatically after it receives the inspection data and no tap-in was made.

Chino

T-G-C wrote: »

It would be more inconvenient for them to refuse all new cards that are not known to the TFL CSAN database already.

And what exactly is a "TFL CSAN database"? Or have you just made this up? Your signature suggests that you neither work for nor have any knowledge of TfL.

T-G-C

Chino wrote: »

And what exactly is a "TFL CSAN database"? Or have you just made this up? Your signature suggests that you neither work for nor have any knowledge of TfL.

What motivated you to post that rather than help the OP is beyond me. I have not stated nor otherwise claimed that I am speaking on behalf of TFL. You assume because I have knowledge in this area. Where I work does not concern you - I am here as a personal poster, as per the signature is implying.

Thank you for stopping by to ask me that though. Since you made the effort, I will expand on the area you highlighted...

The database you are asking about is used at Oyster terminals to determine whether or not a presented card or device is valid for travel, based on the card number and the associated specific account number received from the last authorization check. If the card being presented is new and therefore unknown, the terminal will assume authorized access until it can contact the card issuer for approval, where it is then stored on the database. If this system was not in place, there would be a queue of people at the tube gate or bus stop, since the terminal would need to contact the card issuer and/or central server live. The database is essentially a semi-offline list, updated on a 30-minute cycle (hence why the OP had this problem) to process cards without the aforementioned delay to commuters.