legal battle with builder

happypie

sorry in advance for lengthy post.

i am in legal battle with my builder.
i hired him for 3 bed semi renovation last year and we discussed contract verbally and prepared list of tasks in an excel sheet on my laptop which i mailed to him same day.

these were the tasks we initially agreed (price is labour only, i was to pay for materials as and when purchased):

remove paper work, polustrene tiles 0
chimney knock down 850
kitchen sealing knock down 0
electric rewiring 3500
preparing wall for plaster 0
DPC 3500
plaster 0
heating & replumbing 2900
bathroom 1st floor 2600
utility room and shower room 2600
painting 3600
insulation loft 600
insulation under floor 1550
storage below stair 200
carpet & vynl floor 1000
rubbish 1200
temporary kitchen 0
installing door and frames 0
total 24100

some of the items had 0 price because either those items are included in other task (for example remove paper work, polustrene tiles, kitchen sealing knock down, plaster was included in DPC price) and some were adjusted in overall project price (temporary kitchen, installing door and frames).

the project was to be completed in 2 months.

during the project some more additional tasks were discussed at various points and i added price for those in overall cost as per agreed quotation for each task. overall project price become 25980 pounds after adding all additional tasks.

in last phase of project when i had paid 24000 pounds already (bank transfer) and following work was remaining: boiler installation, gas certificate, electric certificate, temporary kitchen, utility room cabinets, downstairs bathroom, storage under stairs, carpet on stairs

he came one day and said he's leaving because i won't pay him last installment after work will be finished. i tried to convince him that i would pay and why he thinks i won't pay when i have been paying him so far but he didn't listen and left with his stuff and tools.

anyway i realized that he's not coming back so i got other tradesmen for remaining work and got each work done. for some i have paid cash, for some bank transfer with receipt.

he kept in touch with me asking things like where would i purchase this and that etc.

out of remaining tasks, i asked him if he would be interested in doing utility room cabinets, downstairs bathroom. we both agreed for 1000 pounds for it.
my main intention was to have good relation with him in end so i can contact him if anything goes wrong down the line (he told me verbally that there will be 1 year guarantee of his work in beginning).

anyway he started again and finished downstairs bathroom about 90% and i paid him 500 pounds and then he broke bathroom mirror and i said you need to cover it. and he got angry and left again and said he'll see me court.

i again got other tradesmen to do remaining bathroom and utility room cabinets.

few weeks later, i got email that he has filed money claim against me for about 8000 pounds saying that i got him to do extra work for free, namely:

Full house rendering ,top to the bottom £2,500
fit new doors and architraves ( 7 doors) £1,200
Knock dow the old exterior door and window and build a wall instead of door and window. £400
I dug a channel so I can put the main water pipe. £450
Fit new blue pipe 25mm for main of water into the house. £150
I fit four aervent tiles on the roof. £350
I close the roof after the chimney was knock down £500
I clean the gather around the house and I fit three internet sockets . £230
I change 50 tiles on the roof. £150
I knock down the exterior part of the chimney (the one on the top of the house roof). £400
sand and cement rendering waterproof with sicka £1,000

i got furious. some of these tasks were part of already agreed tasks like Full house rendering ,top to the bottom was part of plaster, fit new doors and architraves was agreed though with 0 amount as was part of overall project, sand and cement rendering waterproof with sicka was part of DPC, and other tasks were agreed with much less price which i already added in overall price.

anyway i have put defense saying that all additional tasks claimed by him were either part of existing tasks or were paid already. i also put counter claim against him for 10000 pounds for poor quality of work, delayed work, leaving project mid way without finishing so i had to pay others etc.

in terms of proof, i have online bank statement for payment transfer, whatsapp message for payment transfer, google sheet for tasks which we prepared (with entire history when additional tasks were added and with what price).

i don't care much about counter claim and i put that in agony. however what you guys think about defense? do i have good chance to defend?
all he has got is his workers as witness (but they were neither involved in initial price negotiation nor in any additional task/price negotiation) so they would lying if they tell court that i didn't pay him.
he has photos of before and after - but i am not denying that he didn't work at my house. i am saying that he did and i paid.

what do you guys think?

pls feel free to ask if you need more info on anything. all suggestions welcome.

Shaun_of_the_Dead

happypie wrote: »

sorry in advance for lengthy post.

i am in legal battle with my builder.
i hired him for 3 bed semi renovation last year and we discussed contract verbally and prepared list of tasks in an excel sheet on my laptop which i mailed to him same day.

these were the tasks we initially agreed (price is labour only, i was to pay for materials as and when purchased):

remove paper work, polustrene tiles 0
chimney knock down 850
kitchen sealing knock down 0
electric rewiring 3500
preparing wall for plaster 0
DPC 3500
plaster 0
heating & replumbing 2900
bathroom 1st floor 2600
utility room and shower room 2600
painting 3600
insulation loft 600
insulation under floor 1550
storage below stair 200
carpet & vynl floor 1000
rubbish 1200
temporary kitchen 0
installing door and frames 0
total 24100

some of the items had 0 price because either those items are included in other task (for example remove paper work, polustrene tiles, kitchen sealing knock down, plaster was included in DPC price) and some were adjusted in overall project price (temporary kitchen, installing door and frames).

the project was to be completed in 2 months.

during the project some more additional tasks were discussed at various points and i added price for those in overall cost as per agreed quotation for each task. overall project price become 25980 pounds after adding all additional tasks.

in last phase of project when i had paid 24000 pounds already (bank transfer) and following work was remaining: boiler installation, gas certificate, electric certificate, temporary kitchen, utility room cabinets, downstairs bathroom, storage under stairs, carpet on stairs

he came one day and said he's leaving because i won't pay him last installment after work will be finished. i tried to convince him that i would pay and why he thinks i won't pay when i have been paying him so far but he didn't listen and left with his stuff and tools.

anyway i realized that he's not coming back so i got other tradesmen for remaining work and got each work done. for some i have paid cash, for some bank transfer with receipt.

he kept in touch with me asking things like where would i purchase this and that etc.

out of remaining tasks, i asked him if he would be interested in doing utility room cabinets, downstairs bathroom. we both agreed for 1000 pounds for it.
my main intention was to have good relation with him in end so i can contact him if anything goes wrong down the line (he told me verbally that there will be 1 year guarantee of his work in beginning).

anyway he started again and finished downstairs bathroom about 90% and i paid him 500 pounds and then he broke bathroom mirror and i said you need to cover it. and he got angry and left again and said he'll see me court.

i again got other tradesmen to do remaining bathroom and utility room cabinets.

few weeks later, i got email that he has filed money claim against me for about 8000 pounds saying that i got him to do extra work for free, namely:

Full house rendering ,top to the bottom £2,500
fit new doors and architraves ( 7 doors) £1,200
Knock dow the old exterior door and window and build a wall instead of door and window. £400
I dug a channel so I can put the main water pipe. £450
Fit new blue pipe 25mm for main of water into the house. £150
I fit four aervent tiles on the roof. £350
I close the roof after the chimney was knock down £500
I clean the gather around the house and I fit three internet sockets . £230
I change 50 tiles on the roof. £150
I knock down the exterior part of the chimney (the one on the top of the house roof). £400
sand and cement rendering waterproof with sicka £1,000

i got furious. some of these tasks were part of already agreed tasks like Full house rendering ,top to the bottom was part of plaster, fit new doors and architraves was agreed though with 0 amount as was part of overall project, sand and cement rendering waterproof with sicka was part of DPC, and other tasks were agreed with much less price which i already added in overall price.

anyway i have put defense saying that all additional tasks claimed by him were either part of existing tasks or were paid already. i also put counter claim against him for 10000 pounds for poor quality of work, delayed work, leaving project mid way without finishing so i had to pay others etc.

in terms of proof, i have online bank statement for payment transfer, whatsapp message for payment transfer, google sheet for tasks which we prepared (with entire history when additional tasks were added and with what price).

i don't care much about counter claim and i put that in agony. however what you guys think about defense? do i have good chance to defend?
all he has got is his workers as witness (but they were neither involved in initial price negotiation nor in any additional task/price negotiation) so they would lying if they tell court that i didn't pay him.
he has photos of before and after - but i am not denying that he didn't work at my house. i am saying that he did and i paid.

what do you guys think?

pls feel free to ask if you need more info on anything. all suggestions welcome.

I think the fact you had him back weakens your case for substandard work and I do hope you made him fully aware of any problems and gave him the chance to come back and rectify before instructing someone else to do the work.

happypie

Yeah I agree but as i mentioned I wanted to keep good relation and had no intention of claim/counter claim.

No I didn't speak to him about quality issues. He left work which he was supposed to finish. Didn't think he would come back to resolve quality issue.

Doozergirl

I don't see any of those extras on the original list at all and I don't understand how those free items are included in other work at all.

I feel sorry for the guy if buying and fitting doors comes under 'included elsewhere'. Ditto to 'plastering' and 'whole house rendering'.

This was always going to be a matter of who came off worse. Looking at the prices, it is him.

No excuse for unprofessionalism, but so many trades people just aren't capable of pricing, just doing the work. If you are happy with the work, you've found someone who relies on trust to get paid. Trades usually learn how to spot a trustworthy client quite quickly.

Mistral001

It looks like this builder is serious about taking you to court so no point in trying to be friendly with him. If you have not contacted your solicitor, I would contact them now. Have you been served with a writ yet?

happypie

Doozergirl wrote: »

I don't see any of those extras on the original list at all and I don't understand how those free items are included in other work at all.

I feel sorry for the guy if buying and fitting doors comes under 'included elsewhere'. Ditto to 'plastering' and 'whole house rendering'.

This was always going to be a matter of who came off worse. Looking at the prices, it is him.

No excuse for unprofessionalism, but so many trades people just aren't capable of pricing, just doing the work. If you are happy with the work, you've found someone who relies on trust to get paid. Trades usually learn how to spot a trustworthy client quite quickly.

ok. let me provide list of additional tasks we agreed during the project.

roof ventilation tile 100
blue pipe 130
ceiling 1100
loft floor board 550

as i said some items have 0 price because we discussed overall project price. plaster was part of DPC, who would pay 3500 for DPC treatment alone? even professional company like Rentokil gave me quotation of 1100 for DPC with 30 years guarantee.
also full house rendering is not from outside if you are thinking that. it's internal so is it different than plaster?

regarding door and frames, we did discuss it and he agreed and thats why its there in initial list of tasks. also its not buying, as i said, these quotations are just for labour work.

also as additional information, i got another competitive quotation from another builder before him.

happypie

Doozergirl wrote: »

No excuse for unprofessionalism, but so many trades people just aren't capable of pricing, just doing the work. If you are happy with the work, you've found someone who relies on trust to get paid. Trades usually learn how to spot a trustworthy client quite quickly.

this was first for me.
he's builder since many years.
so if prices are not good for him then can it be considered my fault?

happypie

Mistral001 wrote: »

It looks like this builder is serious about taking you to court so no point in trying to be friendly with him. If you have not contacted your solicitor, I would contact them now. Have you been served with a writ yet?

yes, he's serious.
no, i am not trying to be friendly with him now. it was before.

i don't have solicitor. do you mean my insurance?

regarding court proceedings, yes, i have received court order.