Marriage Allowance Transfer and Self Assessment

Dazed_and_confused

Have seen a post bu "dazed an confused" saying submit, then call HMRC to get them to force the allowance transfer through.

You have taken that post completely out of context. It was in reply to someone who had posted this,

However, after 3 attempts the form now declares:
"Error: As you have already made three attempts to match your Recipient details, you cannot select to transfer your Marriage allowance on this return".

I have no idea why you don't just file your return? Phoning HMRC would be a waste of time. I would expect them to just tell you to file the return.

DavidC12

I have come across this same problem when trying to prepare the self-assessment returns of a married couple for 2018/19 using HMRC’s platform. One spouse made the election to transfer in 2015/16 and the transferred value has been deducted from that transferor spouse’s personal allowance and added to recipient spouse’s personal allowance in both subsequent tax years.

Has anyone any experience of how resolve this problem of no addition being shown in 2018/19 preliminary tax liability calculation for recipient even though the reduction is shown in that calculation for transferor?

My current feeling is simply to submit both returns now and send separate letter to HMRC asking for a reduction of tax liability of the recipient by £1190 * 20% = £238. If that reduction is not made by HMRC by 31 Jan then pay the higher uncorrected tax and write another letter asking for a refund of £238 overpaid.

Dazed_and_confused

and added to recipient spouse’s personal allowance in both subsequent tax years

Not in way you put it hasn't. The recipient of Marriage Allowance is not entitled to any additional Personal Allowance, they get a tax credit off their income tax liability. Which does make a difference for some people.

Has anyone any experience of how resolve this problem of no addition being shown in 2018/19 preliminary tax liability calculation for recipient even though the reduction is shown in that calculation for transferor?

It really isn't a problem. You just file both returns (with the application on the transferrors) and HMRC will automatically adjust the recipients figures a few days later.

My current feeling is simply to submit both returns now and send separate letter to HMRC asking for a reduction of tax liability of the recipient by £1190 * 20% = £238. If that reduction is not made by HMRC by 31 Jan then pay the higher uncorrected tax and write another letter asking for a refund of £238 overpaid.

Don't waste yours (or HMRC's) time sending a letter. File the returns. Wait a week and check the recipients position. If not resolved then think about a letter. Or a call to the agents helpline may be quicker. But you are right to say pay the correct amount (which may well be £238 less than currently calculated).

DavidC12

Thanks to Dazed and... for such a quick response.
Yes, my apologies for my sloppy wording about recipient’s personal allowance being increased by £1190 rather than his tax liability being reduced by £238.

I will proceed as you suggest.

polymaff

DavidC12 wrote: »

Thanks to Dazed and... for such a quick response.
Yes, my apologies for my sloppy wording about recipient’s personal allowance being increased by £1190 rather than his tax liability being reduced by £238

No need to apologise!


GOV.UK still has statements such as:


"Your partner transferred £1,250 to your Personal Allowance, making their allowance £11,250 and yours £13,750."


on their website. Complete and utter nonsense - still there as HMRC is still in denial about how they've completely misunderstood both the legislation and their various, bogus, incompetent attempts at implementation.


And that's putting it mildly...:rotfl:

noh

noh wrote: »

Its not just you. Mine is the same.
No MAT in the calculation.

Submitted mine and a week or so later a new calculation arrived by post with the MAT included.
Online in my account the amount of tax to be paid is correct.
The calculation online is unchanged so still does not include MAT.

polymaff

noh wrote: »

Submitted mine and a week or so later a new calculation arrived by post with the MAT included.
Online in my account the amount of tax to be paid is correct.

So will everyone wound up by this issue wait for the MAT credit - which is no part of the SA100 liability computation - to turn up as a credit on their Statement of Account?

Heedtheadvice

There have been posts too in the general large thread about marriage allowance on this matter (MAT).
I does seem as if the MAT is no longer included in the return or czlculation thus showing an erroneous position and SA302 Calculation.
It has been taken into account afterwards resulting in a paper copy of an updated calc then being sent out to taxpayers within about 14 days.


It does seem to be then calculated correctly but is not reflected in online calculation Sa302 however it is taken into account in the online current position.


I cannot see why HMRC have changed methodology from previous years and they obviously still have issues with internal digital communications. Does not PAYE coding still show MAT as an allowance? So, the return should too and several problems would be solved!



I agree with those comments posted critical of HMRC. Dazed's posts are very helpfull on tax matters but I do not agree that it is a waste of time contacting HMRC. If we respond there could be more chance of issues being corrected? On the other hand I have no confidence in HMRC getting thing digital done correctly.


Final note. Do keep your paper copies of the amended calcs secure. It might be the only evidence available!!

Dazed_and_confused

Does not PAYE coding still show MAT as an allowance? So, the return should too and several problems would be solved!

It does but strictly speaking it is the tax code that is wrong, not the SA302.

Receipt of Marriage Allowance doesn't entitle you to any additional Personal Allowance, it is a tax credit off your tax liability. But that cannot be shown easily in a tax code hence the use of an additional allowance. In a similar fashion to how Married Couple's Allowance is shown.

And I don't mean never contact HMRC but I personally wouldn't bother until you have let a few days pass and Marriage Allowance can be taken into account (for the recipient).

polymaff

Heedtheadvice wrote: »

I cannot see why HMRC have changed methodology from previous years and they obviously still have issues with internal digital communications. Does not PAYE coding still show MAT as an allowance? So, the return should too and several problems would be solved!

I do not agree that it is a waste of time contacting HMRC. If we respond there could be more chance of issues being corrected?

Who knows for sure - but HMRC got MAT wrong from the start. I have an email in which HMRC stated that they were going to implement MAT as a simple transfer of Personal Allowances from one to the other. Then you'd expect MAT to be dealt with at SA302 level. HMRC is now implementing something nearer to the legislation though some hangover inconsistencies have arisen, e.g. their current statement:

"Your income is £8,000 and you transferred £1,250 of your allowance to your partner. This made your allowance £11,250 and their allowance £13,750."

On top of that is HMRC's gross misunderstanding of the differences in MAT regarding UK and non-UK-based tax payers.

HMRC's internal rigour regarding internal training creaks when the policy-forming staff of HMRC do understand the issues - but when the higher levels don't understand either the legislative demands or the consequences of their naive attempts at implementation, then the training doesn't just buckle, it disintegrates.


Your input to the level of staff in HMRC that is "outward facing" has little effect on such a car-crash system, I'm afraid.