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Martyn1981

France is supporting the conversion of ICEV's to BEV's, quite a cool move.

France’s Recent Order Liberalizing Retrofits Of Old ICE Vehicles Supercharges Phoenix Mobility’s Ambitions For Mass EV Conversions

We just love hearing about EV conversions. This is an industry that promises to play a major role in accelerating the transition to electromobility. At the right scale and when applied to the right segments best fit for the target markets, what was once a niche product for collectors’ items such as restored classic cars and a badge of honor for a merry band of hobbyists could be a game changer. EV conversions will allow a broader consumer base to afford decent electric vehicles.

The transition to electromotility is happening much faster than we thought. Affordable mass EV conversions will put this transition into Ludicrous mode. A French EV conversion firm, Phoenix Mobility, is looking to scale up its B2B fleet conversion business. Focusing on fleets on the B2B side makes a lot of sense for several reasons: 

On savings (excluding the public subsidy) Phoenix Mobility says it has developed case studies showing just how EV conversions can be financially interesting for their clients. The goal was to bring to light a payback period, which is the period necessary to have a positive ROI on your investment in electric vehicles. Typical examples of the paybacks based on Phoenix Mobility’s studies are:

1. Renault Kangoo: payback period is ~6 years vs 10 years if you buy a new EV
2. Renault Master: payback is ~4 years vs ~8.4 years if you buy a new EV
3. Renault Traffic: payback period is ~2.8 years 

“These calculations are based on the current actual cost. With time, research and volume, we’ll divide our cost by ~2 so payoff time will be even shorter in the future.”
The French government has issued a subsidy for the conversion of fuel vehicles to electric through retrofit (€5,000/vehicle). Local governments are taking more and more action to lower CO2 emissions inside the cities.

Martyn1981

VW still struggling with software, which is a shame as they seem to be taking BEV's really seriously, not just halfhearted nor compliance. But they'll get there, sooner more likely than later.

Volkswagen’s Top Software Guy Is Dropped

It is no secret that Volkswagen Group has been struggling with what is truly an enormous challenge. The giant auto corporation has been watching the shifting winds and realizes that the future of automobiles isn’t diesel, isn’t gasoline, isn’t hydrogen, and isn’t even electricity — it’s software. The problem for traditional automakers is that their expertise is mostly in physical things, like engines, vehicle bodies, and steering wheels. Volkswagen, not wanting to be left behind as the industry evolved, decided a year or so ago that having 90% of its software outsourced wasn’t acceptable and it was time to become more like a certain Silicon Valley automaker. It was time to take control of its software to a much greater extent, and to unify it under a new Car.Software division. The future of Volkswagen was dependent on VW.OS. Unfortunately, the first year hasn’t gone swimmingly.

And a strange move (to me) to prevent TMY's having too little range, in Elon's opinion, though this may just be a tactic to drop the lowest priced model.

Tesla Won’t Produce Model Y Standard Range, But Will Add Model Y RWD

Perhaps the most notable tweet was one stating that Tesla had decided to not produce the Tesla Model Y Standard Range (or Standard Range Plus), as Elon Musk considered the range to be “unacceptably low” if they did (fewer than 250 miles according to the EPA testing system). Note that the Tesla Model 3 Standard Range Plus is an even 250 miles at the moment — but was lower when it launched.

Sort of in place of offering that lower-priced Model Y, however, Tesla will offer a Model Y Long Range with a single motor instead of two motors “in a few months,” and the company just lowered the price of the Model Y Long Range AWD that’s on the market right now, as we reported last night.

michaels

Martyn1981 said:

VW still struggling with software, which is a shame as they seem to be taking BEV's really seriously, not just halfhearted nor compliance. But they'll get there, sooner more likely than later.

Volkswagen’s Top Software Guy Is Dropped

It is no secret that Volkswagen Group has been struggling with what is truly an enormous challenge. The giant auto corporation has been watching the shifting winds and realizes that the future of automobiles isn’t diesel, isn’t gasoline, isn’t hydrogen, and isn’t even electricity — it’s software. The problem for traditional automakers is that their expertise is mostly in physical things, like engines, vehicle bodies, and steering wheels. Volkswagen, not wanting to be left behind as the industry evolved, decided a year or so ago that having 90% of its software outsourced wasn’t acceptable and it was time to become more like a certain Silicon Valley automaker. It was time to take control of its software to a much greater extent, and to unify it under a new Car.Software division. The future of Volkswagen was dependent on VW.OS. Unfortunately, the first year hasn’t gone swimmingly.

And a strange move (to me) to prevent TMY's having too little range, in Elon's opinion, though this may just be a tactic to drop the lowest priced model.

Tesla Won’t Produce Model Y Standard Range, But Will Add Model Y RWD

Perhaps the most notable tweet was one stating that Tesla had decided to not produce the Tesla Model Y Standard Range (or Standard Range Plus), as Elon Musk considered the range to be “unacceptably low” if they did (fewer than 250 miles according to the EPA testing system). Note that the Tesla Model 3 Standard Range Plus is an even 250 miles at the moment — but was lower when it launched.

Sort of in place of offering that lower-priced Model Y, however, Tesla will offer a Model Y Long Range with a single motor instead of two motors “in a few months,” and the company just lowered the price of the Model Y Long Range AWD that’s on the market right now, as we reported last night.

I did a market research which was a group of EV owners a few years answering questions about potential EV products and I suggested that the existing manufactures would never own the software space because it wasn't their field of expertise and that people would always choose to use android auto/apple carplay - I'll never know if it was for VW (we weren't told) but it looks like I was right.

The Tesla thing, I wonder if they think model Y demand is being held back by people waiting for an expected cheaper version - plus it leaves a niche for the M3 to have a lower priced version that is not a direct competitor for an equivalent more practical Y (the performance Y is less of a competitor for the performance 3 because an SUV is never going to be a drivers car)

Martyn1981

Bit of a BEV push in Italy on its way (and smaller subsidies for new ICEV's too):

Italy Set To Increase EV Incentives To €10,000 — Are Carmakers Ready?

The Italian government is preparing new fiscal measures to sustain the economic recovery, following months of lockdown at the peak of the coronavirus pandemic. Like in many other countries, particularly in Europe, economic stimulus is being directed preferentially to a sustainable recovery, especially in the transport and construction industries. As part of proposed new measures, current incentives for low-emission vehicles are set to be increased by at least 50% from August for the rest of the year, to levels aligned to similar policies recently adopted in countries like France and Germany.

Under the bill, full electric vehicles (technically, vehicles with CO2 emissions between 0 and 20 grams/km) will now be eligible for a €10,000 discount when scrapping your old car, or €6,000 without doing so. This compares to €6,000 and €4,000, respectively, under the current “ecobonus” legislation that started last year. Also included in the scheme are hybrids with CO2 emissions between 21 and 60 grams/km, which will see their existing incentives boosted to €6,500 if scrapping an old car or €3,500 otherwise (current incentives are €2,500 and €1,500, respectively). These enhanced incentives will be funded in part by government and in part by carmakers, and will be available for cars up to €61,000, including VAT (which means most Tesla Model 3 trims will also benefit from it).

Martyn1981

Comparison of BEV v's ICEV costs within the VW family:

Volkswagen ID.3 vs. Volkswagen Golf — 5 Year Cost of Ownership Comparisons

Martyn1981

Absolute monster month for the Renault Zoe in France. These are the sort of sales figures we need to see, but for a whole host of lovely BEV's.

Renault Zoe Shines In New Record Month In France

The Dog Days Are Over in the French EV market, with the pandemic’s disruption now behind it, and a new stimulus package from the local government that can go up to €12,000. (Now imagine if the €16,000 Dacia Spring EV lands in time for this kind of incentive — it will be yours for peanuts!) Plugin vehicle sales surged 359% year over year (YoY) in June, to a record 21,000 units, with PHEVs faring better than BEVs (up 5-fold versus “only” 205%). Plugin hybrids thus rose to 35% of the plugin market last month, above this year’s average of 31%.

But because the overall French market was also positive (+1%), the market share gains weren’t as spectacular as in the lockdown months, with the plugin market share ending June at 9% (5.9% for BEVs alone), dropping slightly the 2020 PEV share to 9.1% (6.3% BEV) — still well above the 2.8% of 2019.

JKenH

The European EV incentives are really working to the advantage of the cheaper EVs. That should be a worry for the likes of VW Audi (E-tron) and especially Tesla which have traditionally done well in Europe. Not in overall numbers perhaps but their market share is falling which is one of the metrics they tend to be judged on.

joefizz

michaels said:

I think there are a couple of issues at play:
1) The UK currently has a massively generous EV incentive in place for company cars (I think I saw one calc suggesting that an 80 Tesla S or X would be about 80-k cheaper than an equivalent ice car over 5 years - which means an 80k hit to the exchequer) and so demand for EVs may be sufficient without additional incentives
2) In other countries there was a definite bounce back of car sales 'pent up demand' from the lockdown period so no need for additional incentives yet - wait till the recession really starts to bite once the impact of the current and post furlough layoffs becomes real then bring in the incentive.

I now have 3 mates who own Model 3s. They all get free charging at work, or at least they did when they were working from the office. Not so much of a perk now they are all mostly working from home.
At the minute in their companies thats not even BIK, just free. Cant see it lasting.

Martyn1981

The new Nissan SUV looks to stack up very well against the TMY. Hopefully more choice means more sales of BEV's.

Comparison: Nissan Ariya vs. Tesla Model Y

Nissan just unveiled its new Ariya, and already some are saying it’s the “Model Y’s worst nightmare,” or that Nissan is going after Tesla. According to CNET, Nissan’s intentions with the new Ariya are to go after the Tesla Model Y. Sure, Nissan was the first to establish the global EV market in decent volumes with the Leaf, and paved the way for other legacy automakers to follow, and this is an exciting new EV, but the Ariya is not a threat to Tesla and it shouldn’t be viewed that way. The coming electric SUV is not the “true competition” of Tesla. Rather, it is a refreshing addition to the EV movement that can push more gasoline SUVs off the road.

Martyn1981

Good video from the Tesla Time News / Now You Know team on the Osborne effect and the problem this raises for big auto. I think they've pitched the explanation at the right technical level. And how can you trust they are giving good info, because a certain 'alternative' individual likes to attack them a lot, which kinda proves they must be OK.

The Osborne Effect: Why Big Auto Is Lying To You | In Depth