Saba Railway Penalty Notice Help please

anonymous19

Hi
I have received 2 PNs from Saba, from a railway station (I won't waste time giving details as it doesnt make a difference right?). These were letters sent by post to the owner within 14 days. I assume this is a NtK and the letter said the data has been released by the DVLA.
I have read all the threads, including this one "Indigo Railway PCN - clarifying the process", and followed the advice, and have complained to my local MP (I received a standard reply which wasnt very helpful).

The advice says for a windscreen notice, wait for the first letter and then appeal, but there were no instructions for a ANPR, so I waited until the 28 day mark and sent via email the standard template letter, refusing to name the driver. But i have received a reply which isn't mentioned anywhere, or that I can't find, and don't know what to do next. Here is the reply:

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Good afternoon
Thank you for your email, your comments have been noted accordingly.

Please note this is a Penalty Notice not Parking Charge Notice. All photographic evidence is available online at ipaymypcn.net.

The ticket has been issued due to 'Failing to obtain a valid ticket or voucher'.

As your attachment has no outline of an appeal please send through your appeal so we can investigate this for you.

I have placed your account on hold for 7 days to allow this to be sent over.

Kind regards
Sasha

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I thought the letter was my appeal, and was expecting a rejection letter.
1. What do I do now, just ignore this or go back with another letter?
2. What's the difference between a Penalty Notice and a Parking Charge Notice? (I think the title of my letter says PCN).
3. The letter says they could clamp the vehicle in future - how likely is this to hapen?

Many thanks in advance

waamo

1. Just search here for Saba. There have been at least 3 threads in the last 2 days asking exactly this question.

2. A penalty is just that. If this goes to court it would be a magistrates court and a fine imposed. A parking charge notice is an invoice and would be a civil matter.

3. Not going to happen.

Fruitcake

If the car park is a railway asset (owned by the train operating company or Network Rail) then railway byelaws apply. You need to read more threads about byelaws if that applies.

If that is the case then the driver can and the owner may be liable, but the keeper cannot. The fact the term penalty has been used implies that byelaws do apply. It is important therefore that the driver's identity is not revealed. I hope you didn't put that in your initial appeal.

Where ANPR is used there is normally no advantage in waiting 26 days, but where byelaws apply you want to run the clock down to six months, so you did the right thing.

Your options now are ignore for six months, or play inane Q & A pingpong for six months. After that it becomes statute barred.

Do not do an AS appeal to SABA!

anonymous19

Thank you both for your replies.

@Fruitcake
Yes it says its subject to Railway Byelaws, and an offence committed by breaching byelaw 14.

No I did not disclose the drivers identity. I have already read a bit but will read more threads specifically about these byelaws.

By AS appeal, do you mean this? AoS = Acknowledgement of Service (of a claim form). See the second post for the link showing how to acknowledge a claim.

waamo

No. This has not gone to court so you can't acknowledge service of court papers.

AS appeal refers to Sabas own in house appeal "service" which is called ASparking.

Fruitcake

anonymous19 wrote: »

Thank you both for your replies.

@Fruitcake
Yes it says its subject to Railway Byelaws, and an offence committed by breaching byelaw 14.

No I did not disclose the drivers identity. I have already read a bit but will read more threads specifically about these byelaws.

By AS appeal, do you mean this? AoS = Acknowledgement of Service (of a claim form). See the second post for the link showing how to acknowledge a claim.

All of that is good. Well done.

No offence has been committed so no penalty can be applied unless a magistrate says so. In other words, the scammers are lying. Imagine my surprise.

I do not believe that, 'Failing to obtain a valid ticket or voucher' is a byelaws 14 offence.

You now have to decide whether to ignore for six months or play Q & A for six months.

anonymous19

Thanks again. I feel as if in some way it's better to play along for six months, maybe due to naivety i think I won't get all the ZZPS or solicitors letters. Again I know these are just scare tactics and nothing happens, but I'd still rather not get all the letters, but I'm sure you get them anyway no matter what.

So I think last question for now...
Does it ultimately make any difference which tactic i choose - ignore or reply?

waamo

The tactics don't seem to make any difference. No matter what you do you will get production line letters. It's an automated process so nothing will stop it.

Having to answer questions may slow it down though. It also means they have to answer them which takes time and effort.

anonymous19

I have just noticed the email i quoted in my initial question above has come from ZZPS, so it has started already! I thought it was from SABA. OK, so I see how the production line works. i'll try and slow it down a little.
Thanks again.

BrownTrout

personally i would just ignore

Coupon-mad

Me too, I would ignore SABA and ZZPS.