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Parked longer than the maximum period allowed

edited 2 October 2019 at 8:28AM in Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking
67 replies 3.1K views
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  • Coupon-madCoupon-mad Forumite
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    This is so bad that people do need to complain to the Ombudsman Services about POPLA now, they are misinterpreting really clearly stated timelines, set out in the ONLY darn applicable law they need to understand!

    Not only that, they used to get it right and now have gone backwards.
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  • BrucellaBrucella Forumite
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    I have just phoned the BPA and spoke to a very sympathetic person who confirmed that the operator was out of time in sending the PCN to the Keeper. I gave them the dates of the incident and the date of issue of the PCN but no other details of the case.

    She asked me to fill in the complaints form on the BPA website and upload my PCN.

    Before I do this, is there any danger in doing so? I know that Newbies like me can be too trusting and naive, so advice please before I do this.

    On the other hand, it might sort the problem for other people?

    Thanks
  • UmkomaasUmkomaas Forumite
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    I think the door is slightly open for you to push. I wouldn't read anything suspicious in their seeming willingness to help.

    Why not PM MinnieSox and keep them abreast of your progress, and maybe they'll pile in and complain to the bpa about the double error by POPLA?
    Please note, we are not a legal advice forum. I personally don't get involved in critiquing court case Defences/Witness Statements, so unable to help on that front. Please don't ask.
    Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.
  • BrucellaBrucella Forumite
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    Thanks. I was going to contact MinnieSox9 to coordinate. I'll let you know how I get on.

    I think that if successful, we need to go after POPLA through other routes. They have shown a breathtaking arrogance in not listening to critics and then refusing to engage.
  • UmkomaasUmkomaas Forumite
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    a breathtaking arrogance in not listening to critics and then refusing to engage.
    ..... or a frightening poverty of intellectual capacity.
    Please note, we are not a legal advice forum. I personally don't get involved in critiquing court case Defences/Witness Statements, so unable to help on that front. Please don't ask.
    Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.
  • Important update! We have recently reviewed and updated our Forum Rules and FAQs. Please take the time to familiarise yourself with the latest version.
  • UmkomaasUmkomaas Forumite
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    @Brucella, please look at the POPLA Decisions sticky, post #3759 and following ...., they may be of interest. :)
    Please note, we are not a legal advice forum. I personally don't get involved in critiquing court case Defences/Witness Statements, so unable to help on that front. Please don't ask.
    Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.
  • edited 26 December 2019 at 12:50PM
    BrucellaBrucella Forumite
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    edited 26 December 2019 at 12:50PM
    I have an update that may give some hope to those of you arguing the 14d time limit for the issue of a NtK under PoFA. I also hope that it may explain the change in interpretation by POPLA as evidenced by POPLA Decisions sticky, post #3759 and following.

    You will see from the above that my appeal came down to the fact that the operator had issued the PCN on the 14th day following the parking event and therefore under PoFA the notice could not have been 'given' within the statutory time limit.

    The problem was that POPLA refused my appeal because they completely misinterpreted the law - this is the law mind you which is central to their sole business and which led to their establishment!

    After getting over my surprise, I emailed a complaint under the POPLA complaints procedure. Amazingly the complaints handler agreed with the adjudicator in completely misinterpreted PoFA. They showed an amazing ignorance of this important Act and a breathtaking arrogance in assuming that they were right and for which they should hang their head in shame.

    I was not going to take this lying down, so I emailed the POPLA Lead Adjudicator, Mr John Gallagher. He passed my complaint to a POPLA 'Sector Expert' (!) who agreed that they had got it wrong.

    What is really amazing is that despite agreeing that the Refused adjudication was wrong: "While I appreciate that you are looking for your appeal to be overturned, that isn’t something that we can do. POPLA has been appointed to deliver a free, single-stage, determinative appeals process. In practice this means that once we have decided an appeal, our involvement in whether the charge is valid or not ends. Even in cases where we have made an incorrect decision, we cannot issue new or revised decisions."

    In other words, they refused to overturn their incorrect adjudication, despite agreeing that it was wrong. However, I think that they quickly retrained their amateurish adjudicators so that subsequent Keepers won't suffer this miscarriage. I would advise motorists who have suffered this in the past to get back to POPLA and the BPA (see bekow).

    Ploughing on, I complained to the BPA who raised the issue with the operator. The BPA then told me that there had been an 'IT error' by the operator and they would retract the PCN!

    I asked the BPA to get the operator to issue me an apology and a full explanation. I also asked them what sanction would be issued to the operator, but they refused on all counts.

    I realise that I am not necessarily out of the woods with the operator, but what do you think - should I pursue the operator for the apology and explanation, or let sleeping dogs lie?

    I would also like to take it further with POPLA to help protect motorists in the future - any ideas?
  • BrucellaBrucella Forumite
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    I forgot to say, I complained to BPA using their online complaint form:

    https://portal.britishparking.co.uk/compliance/LogComplaint

    and uploaded my PCN. My complaint was on the basis that the operator had not adhered to their code.

    Another tip is that if you want to email individuals at POPLA, their email addresses are in the form: [email protected]. In other words, single initial and surname with no dots.

    Please keep any contact businesslike and respectful. They dealt with me in that manner.
  • fisherjimfisherjim Forumite
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    PPC's always hide behind the "admin error" excuse and the BPA always side with that and let it go, just par for the course I'm afraid in this sorry scammers industry.
  • UmkomaasUmkomaas Forumite
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    Well done Brucella for your polite tenacity in stopping this nonsense coming out of POPLA.
    Amazingly the complaints handler agreed with the adjudicator in completely misinterpreted PoFA. They showed an amazing ignorance of this important Act and a breathtaking arrogance in assuming that they were right and for which they should hang their head in shame.
    Absolutely nail on the head. They have to learn that they just can't interpret the law to meet their own lack of understanding of it (or their intellectual capacity to be able to do so).
    Ploughing on, I complained to the BPA who raised the issue with the operator. The BPA then told me that there had been an 'IT error' by the operator and they would retract the PCN!
    With just a few days left of the year, this seems to me to be the most feeble excuse trotted out by the BPA in defence of their paymasters in 2019 (although there are still 4 days to go!).

    But this was never about anything the PPC might or might not have done incorrectly, it was about the unprofessional lack of understanding of the law of this country by poorly trained POPLA assessors, and even more fundamentally about the management structure at POPLA where incorrect decisions were not even understood or acted upon, with ostrich-like responses to very legitimate, well researched and articulated complaints.

    I hope MinnieSox9 will make a similar complaint to the BPA - lets see what excuse the BPA can throw at their case!
    Please note, we are not a legal advice forum. I personally don't get involved in critiquing court case Defences/Witness Statements, so unable to help on that front. Please don't ask.
    Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.
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