Nissan Dealership gave me the wrong finance agreement...

DevJMD

Hi! I have a slight issue with a Nissan Dealership! Although I highly doubt the salesperson at dealership in question isn't a genuine person, I need some advice about my options regarding a financial agreement.

I recently purchased a vehicle from a Nissan dealership a month ago. My end of the bargain was two options:

Pay £4000 deposit and trade a car in at £1000 value, totalling £5000. 2. Pay £5000 deposit and trade a car in at £1000 value, totalling £6000.

I chose option 1, bringing the total deposit amount to £5000.

The car was delivered to me at my work by the said salesperson, and I signed the documents on the spot. In the papers, I remember seeing the total deposit value was £5000. This to me included the car value too, and was even told the figure on the financial agreement was inclusive of the car value at sale price (£1000)

However, it turns out that figure meant a £5000 cash deposit, excluding the car. I was fully unaware of this and have owned the vehicle for a total of 40 days now. And so, yesterday, I received a phone call from the salesman telling me that they were in a £1000 deficit. I have effectively signed for a car and now the dealership have basically said I have to sign a new agreement with the correct amount and so forth, means paying more per month (considerably more, too, as their APR increases. Mine is currently 6.8% - with their adjusted value, it's 14.9!)

I have already told them I cannot financially oblige to this "correction" even though they have admitted the mistake and taken the blame. They are now saying they will come up with all the possible options on the table.

Two questions:

Should I stand my grounds that this isn't my mistake and I want to continue paying my current agreement (hence the dealership footing the cost and settling it there and then) or;

If I sign a new agreement, does this effectively give me my 14-day cooling off period back? I'm not sure if this is a possible case - and the last thing I want to do is take the car back (I love it!) - but I feel like they're pinning me with the error they've effectively made. What I read and signed seemed to not mention anything about the traded in car for £1000, just that the total deposit was £5000 (which to me, means £4000 cash, £1000 car trade-in value) however, apparently this agreement was for £6000... Baffled. They claim that what I'm currently paying is on the assumption I paid £6000 and the documents I signed were for £6000.

It's a bit weird. I don't want to give the car back, but I cannot financially commit to their adjusted figure (it's over £100 different, which is baffling considering it's £1000 over 3 years. (Works out at about £30 extra + 6.8% APR, but they've increased this as the deposit value is under the threshold or something...)

I also did say I couldn't foot the £1000 as I simply didn't have that to throw at them to fix their mistake. I simply don't have that figure now either, so it's not like I could just pay that off and keep my financial agreement the same.

Personally, they should foot the mistake and be done with it, but I don't know if they'll do it. If they don't, I'm prepared to sign a new agreement on the basis this gives me a 14-day cooling off period, but I just feel like this is a sneaky process and they'll somehow put this down under an adjustment rather than a full-blown new agreement (even though they've said it would be a new agreement.)

A question for Citizens Advice, possibly?

The_Rainmaker

I would get my numbers straight first and then get someone competent to double check them to make sure they all add up.

I suspect for a genuine mistake you will end up having to pay.

Do you have a paper trail?

Is the trade in mentioned at all?

Nobbie1967

Presumably you handed over your old car to them? How do they account for this in their paperwork? Do they regard it as a free gift to them?

Sounds like you had an agreement to pay a £5k deposit which you have done via £4K cash and the trade-in valued at £1k.

Their move now, don't sign a new agreement. If they want to pursue you for the £1k, you can defend at court. Do you have any paperwork re the trade in?

DevJMD

I've added them up from my financial documents. They all sum to a total of £5000. Whether that includes the trade-in value too, I have no idea, as it doesn't say anything about it. The salesperson claims I signed the incorrect documents, but I am refusing outright to foot their mistake. It's not a mistake that should have been made, but mistakes happen. It doesn't mean I'm responsible for that.

I have records of all the text messages from the salesperson and digital documents that point me in the right for paying the correct deposit (£4,000) as agreed, including the financial agreement. What doesn't add up is how Nissan's financial department claim that the dealership is exactly £1000 in deficit, and that deficit lies with my agreement. The dealership has accepted this is their mistake.

Strangely enough, I've literally just come off the phone to them again and they've put the option in there that I'm in my right to cancel the agreement once a new agreement is signed, but this is last resort... and I don't like the idea of signing a new agreement without legal advice. Kind of answers one of my questions, but it's honestly the last resort. If I want to hand it back I will and take my custom elsewhere, but this feels like a ransom for a mistake they made and I have little choice.

tacpot12

So you paid a cash deposit of £4000 and gave them a car that they valued at £1000, bringing the deposit you paid to £5000. But the finance agreement you signed assumed that you were paying a cash deposit of £5000 and giving them you old car (this was their mistake), so the current agreement (if you want it) still needs you to pay £1000. Only this will secure the lower interest rate. You haven't met the terms of the agreement you signed, so they can repossess the car.

If they can't really offer you the other agreement because you can't afford it and they would be had for Irresponsible lending. They also shouldn't have offered you the old deal, because you can't afford that either. Basically you can't afford this car, and you never could. Their made a second mistake in pushing you beyond your financial capability.

Having said all that, I think the best way out of this is for you to find the £1000 needed to secure the deal you can afford the monthly repayments on. Could you borrow this off a family member? You might need to take in a lodger or take a second job to pay them back, but basically you can't afford this car and giving it back is going to cost you a lot! The dealer is entitled to his losses on the sale which (worst case) could be £5000. You might be able to hand the car back, cancel the finance deal and get a couple of quid of your deposit back, but I wouldn't hold out any hope.

DevJMD

tacpot12 wrote: »

So you paid a cash deposit of £4000 and gave them a car that they valued at £1000, bringing the deposit you paid to £5000. But the finance agreement you signed assumed that you were paying a cash deposit of £5000 and giving them you old car (this was their mistake), so the current agreement (if you want it) still needs you to pay £1000. Only this will secure the lower interest rate. You haven't met the terms of the agreement you signed, so they can repossess the car.

If they can't really offer you the other agreement because you can't afford it and they would be had for Irresponsible lending. They also shouldn't have offered you the old deal, because you can't afford that either. Basically you can't afford this car, and you never could. Their made a second mistake in pushing you beyond your financial capability.

Having said all that, I think the best way out of this is for you to find the £1000 needed to secure the deal you can afford the monthly repayments on. Could you borrow this off a family member? You might need to take in a lodger or take a second job to pay them back, but basically you can't afford this car and giving it back is going to cost you a lot! The dealer is entitled to his losses on the sale which (worst case) could be £5000. You might be able to hand the car back, cancel the finance deal and get a couple of quid of your deposit back, but I wouldn't hold out any hope.

Interestingly, the phone call I've just had with them - the agreement I've signed is actually correct except the amount I should be paying. So, what is wrong is the amount I'm paying (at the end of it, I would owe £1000 if I kept paying the current agreement). So I've legally agreed and bound myself to the terms the dealership have made. The deposit agreement figure actually includes the traded-in car too. The problem is the amount I'm paying is less than what it should be. This figure was set by the sales person.

Here's me thinking "maybe it said £6,000 and I'm an idiot!" It's not all alarm bells ringing as much now as the they seem to have agreed to let me return the vehicle and return the £5000 to me. However, I cannot renegotiate the terms of a new agreement and would have to comply with the adjustment figure in order to keep the car, but I have an option to not keep the car and jump the ship now. I'd prefer to find the 1K and keep the vehicle, but again, worst case scenario... I'd hand it back in a heartbeat as I've been incredibly loyal to Nissan for almost 10 years and never missed a single payment and now because of a mistake unbeknown to me, it's me having to pay for it.

Sorry, but as others (personally) have said - you wouldn't financially agree to something you can't afford and I didn't. I agreed to something in black and white that I could afford. The second option was too much and that's exactly why I didn't take it. The wording and communication both in person and legal has always been the figure I'm paying now so it isn't like I signed something I couldn't afford - their price simply appealed to me with a deposit of 5K total and I agreed to that. That simple.

Surely this isn't obligable to me... Must be missing something. But I do now know that I'm a much better position than the dealership right now.

AdrianC

So, hold on... The total payable for the car, including the deposit/PX/financed amount/interest, was somewhere north of a grand more than you were expecting? But you didn't notice that?

DevJMD

I didn't pull my calculator out and check what the total value divided by 36 equals including interest - no. To be perfectly honest, it sounded right. It isn't my job to check if they have incorrectly/correctly submitted financial documents and Nissan have literally just admitted they have done exactly that. The guy turned up at my work and I sat and read word-by-word the papers he gave me. The numbers sounded absolutely right. The ball is not in their court at the moment, thankfully. Lucky, but thankful. Nissan have given me a grace of options but I'm reluctant to stay with them...

Edit: In all fairness, they have totally been transparent about it and we have both agreed the last resort really is last resort. Neither of us want to get to the point where I drive the car back to them but they have also accepted the responsibility. I'm still torn on agreeing to a new agreement, they're due to ring me back about the APR. If I did find the £1000, I'd probably keep it, but right now, this isn't an option and I certainly aren't agreeing to a monthly cost increase (it's ludicrously more based on a different APR figure - I'm not even sure how they've calculated this yet)

Mercdriver

Are you seriously saying that it isn't your responsibility to check your paperwork before you sign it?

DevJMD

Mercdriver wrote: »

Are you seriously saying that it isn't your responsibility to check your paperwork before you sign it?

Could probably re-word what I said (I absolutely know it's my responsibility to check the paper work), but this is reasonable doubt, and the dealership have clarified since I wrote this post that they accept this is their fault for not checking the figure set. The "figure" I'm talking about was a number that is in my quotes from the dealership, text messages directly from the salesperson and a Direct Debit agreement prior to even getting legally binding papers. All of this in a space fo four days. And yes, whilst I could have absolutely clarified it with for my own sanity, it's still a believable number. It didn't seem arbitrary of any kind. This was their promise to me that the figure set was the figure I would pay.

The dealership could have outright refused responsibility and put me in a difficult situation, but after much discussion in the last hour or so, they've been reasonable and allowed me to return the car or agree to a new financial agreement.

I mean, I could sit here all day and talk about my not-so-cleverness in math to determine the monthly sum was incorrect, but let's face it, I'm not paid to push numbers. I simply see a plausible number that's attractive. If the bill fits, then it fits. You could say that's irresponsible, but of course, I fully check what I'm signing up to and what I signed is what I fully believed is right. If you can sit there and tell me you calculate the sum at the point of receiving legal papers to sign, then bravo to you I don't decide if that number is correct, the Nissan dealership have already said they are 100% responsible and again, have given me a lucky run. I'm sorry, it's not my job to push numbers in to a legal document and get it right/wrong. That's what I was getting at.

PS, I wasn't expecting legal advice, but the full story doesn't quite paint the picture that some appear to be getting at here...

Nissan have agreed they are 100% responsible. This is now clarified in an email as I have asked the salesperson to email the exact explanation of the error. They have outright agreed the fault is with them and that I, the customer, can do the following:

- Take the car back with a full deposit refund. - Sign a new agreement, but have to pay the adjusted credit agreement. - Pay the £1000 and continue.

I still stand my ground as this email is my leg to stand on right now. So my question still stands... I want to keep the car. Should I stand by the principle they've accepted the responsibility and try get them to agree continuing the current monthly agreement? This isn't about the legal perspective anymore although I'm inclined to still get advice... So I appreciate being judged for the obvious but it's clear this isn't in my remit. It's just I have to be sensible in the lending department...

AdrianC

Can you give us a bit more detail on the numbers involved, and what figures were given on the documentation you signed?

No, it's not your job to put them there - but human error does occur, and it's a damn sight easier to correct it before signing!