We'd like to remind Forumites to please avoid political debate on the Forum. This is to keep it a safe and useful space for MoneySaving discussions. Threads that are - or become - political in nature may be removed in line with the Forum’s rules. Thank you for your understanding.
Not sure if building work is safe
Sferguson
Posts: 1 Newbie
So this is a bit of a long winded one.. please bare with me!
We moved into our first house early this year, we decided we wanted an open plan kitchen diner.
The house it’s self had a small extension build prior to us moving in.. the builder we chose contacted a structural engineer who had drawn up some plans.. once given to the builder he said he could carry out the work, to what we would like.
The job was to knock through the pre-external wall (before the extension was built) and then a non load baring wall which ran down the middle ( I really hope this is making sense)
In effect we would end up with a T bar look with the RSJs.
He ordered a huge RSJ to support what was the external wall and then welded on the smaller RSJ were the internal wall was.
Anyway we have just got hold of the structural engineers drawings and they suggest either a photo frame type steal work or a T bar but this includes a post which would run down the centre into the floor (to offer more support)
So my question is where do we stand now??
None of the work seems to have been signed off to the best of our knowledge and now we are extremely worried that it may not be safe or to any building regs and when we come to sell the house it will cause problems.
Help please!
The builder
We moved into our first house early this year, we decided we wanted an open plan kitchen diner.
The house it’s self had a small extension build prior to us moving in.. the builder we chose contacted a structural engineer who had drawn up some plans.. once given to the builder he said he could carry out the work, to what we would like.
The job was to knock through the pre-external wall (before the extension was built) and then a non load baring wall which ran down the middle ( I really hope this is making sense)
In effect we would end up with a T bar look with the RSJs.
He ordered a huge RSJ to support what was the external wall and then welded on the smaller RSJ were the internal wall was.
Anyway we have just got hold of the structural engineers drawings and they suggest either a photo frame type steal work or a T bar but this includes a post which would run down the centre into the floor (to offer more support)
So my question is where do we stand now??
None of the work seems to have been signed off to the best of our knowledge and now we are extremely worried that it may not be safe or to any building regs and when we come to sell the house it will cause problems.
Help please!
The builder
0
Comments
-
Call the structural engineer back, urgently.
If there is a steel above what you thought was a non-load bearing wall, it was load bearing. If it has been designed with a post then it needs to be reassessed as it's potentially incredibly dangerous, especially considering that you've a junction to be supported which is not.
Please, please learn about Building Control. They are there to help and protect you by upholding some sort of standard.Everything that is supposed to be in heaven is already here on earth.
0 -
Doozergirl wrote: »If there is a steel above what you thought was a non-load bearing wall, it was load bearing. If it has been designed with a post then it needs to be reassessed as it's potentially incredibly dangerous, especially considering that you've a junction to be supported which is not.
A couple more questions (points) to add. Was the welder "coded" and qualified to weld structural steel supports ?
Has the weld been X-ray tested or checked for cracks ?
Welding weakens and changes the structure of the steel at the microscopic level. Unless the guy who did the welding knows exactly what he is doing, it is all too easy to end up with a joint that is incredibly weak and liable to fail. [ I used to work for a company that did structural steelwork, and the required welding standards were incredibly high]Her courage will change the world.
Treasure the moments that you have. Savour them for as long as you can for they will never come back again.0 -
A couple more questions (points) to add. Was the welder "coded" and qualified to weld structural steel supports ?
Has the weld been X-ray tested or checked for cracks ?
Welding weakens and changes the structure of the steel at the microscopic level. Unless the guy who did the welding knows exactly what he is doing, it is all too easy to end up with a joint that is incredibly weak and liable to fail. [ I used to work for a company that did structural steelwork, and the required welding standards were incredibly high]
It's normal for the steels to have been designed by the SE so that they bolt together. No specialist work required.
It's pretty unusual to have a welder on site in a domestic setting, so you're right that it's a concern in itself. It sounds odd.Everything that is supposed to be in heaven is already here on earth.
0 -
A couple more questions (points) to add. Was the welder "coded" and qualified to weld structural steel supports ?
Has the weld been X-ray tested or checked for cracks ?
Welding weakens and changes the structure of the steel at the microscopic level. Unless the guy who did the welding knows exactly what he is doing, it is all too easy to end up with a joint that is incredibly weak and liable to fail. [ I used to work for a company that did structural steelwork, and the required welding standards were incredibly high]
X ray would not be a standard practice for a structural steel, the whole idea of coding (which actually falls under CE marking Ex 1 or 2 of EN 1090) is that a weld can be reproduced with self certification and without the need for testing.
There are areas when macro etch and X rays may be used, Aircraft high stress area on and tall buildings conforming to EN 1090 Ex 4 , Nuclear ex.... None of these are Domestic!!0 -
Doozergirl wrote: »It's normal for the steels to have been designed by the SE so that they bolt together. No specialist work required.
It's pretty unusual to have a welder on site in a domestic setting, so you're right that it's a concern in itself. It sounds odd.
Its not usual but likewise iv done a good few domestic jobs myself, Its now always possible to design every connection to be bolted and sometimes easier to work on site...…
Structural steel made off site should conform to EN-1090 builders should ask for all the relevant paperwork (iv yet to know a single one that has) On sitework doesn't fall under 1090 as the conditions are not controlled but there should be a standard the fabricator adheres to Again never been asked, Building inspectors should be requesting 1090 paperwork again Iv never know it...
Its yet another example where the building trade is somewhat sloppy.0 -
Doozergirl wrote: »It's normal for the steels to have been designed by the SE so that they bolt together. No specialist work required.
True, steelwork is often designed to be bolted together. Flanges would still need to be welded on, and this would be done in a factory where (hopefully) quality could be assured.X ray would not be a standard practice for a structural steel, the whole idea of coding (which actually falls under CE marking Ex 1 or 2 of EN 1090) is that a weld can be reproduced with self certification and without the need for testing.
There are areas when macro etch and X rays may be used, Aircraft high stress area on and tall buildings conforming to EN 1090 Ex 4 , Nuclear ex.... None of these are Domestic!!
Whilst the majority of what "we" did didn't require any testing beyond the odd dye penetration, some did - For example, a high pressure reaction vessel for a chemicals work, 100% X-ray check. Assorted storage tanks, 10% to 25% X-ray checks.... Then there was a huge chunk of RSJ that a customer wanted welding together - He was trying to save money - The weld was X-rayed, and failed. The RSJ had to be scrapped.
Suffice to say, none of the above was domestic, and it wasn't an area we got involved in. Most of the work was MOD or major construction contracts. Even so, I would still expect structural steelwork for a domestic contract to be dye-pen tested. It is a cheap and effective test.Her courage will change the world.
Treasure the moments that you have. Savour them for as long as you can for they will never come back again.0 -
The OP might be a bit confused by everyone comparing the size of their balls here... :rotfl:
We may have gone off topic somewhat. Get a room!Everything that is supposed to be in heaven is already here on earth.
0 -
-
Doozergirl wrote: »The OP might be a bit confused by everyone comparing the size of their balls here... :rotfl:
We may have gone off topic somewhat. Get a room!
Not really, builders should be asking for structural steel work to be done to EN 1090 ex2, and home owners should be asking for the CE mark from the builder, this is LEGAL legislation that's now 5 years old.0
This discussion has been closed.
Categories
- All Categories
- 345.8K Banking & Borrowing
- 251K Reduce Debt & Boost Income
- 450.9K Spending & Discounts
- 237.8K Work, Benefits & Business
- 612.7K Mortgages, Homes & Bills
- 174.3K Life & Family
- 250.9K Travel & Transport
- 1.5M Hobbies & Leisure
- 16K Discuss & Feedback
- 15.1K Coronavirus Support Boards