No choice but to pay?

Wilfthe

Hi

I’ve read the Newbies thread but I think having grounds to not pay or appeal relies on the parking firm being in error in some way?

I parked on double yellow lines in a small housing estate for 5 mins or so.

As I got out of my car I saw the sign saying no parking before 4pm with some additional blurb. I ignored it as I was only there for a short time.

Sure enough I returned to find a parking attendant taking a picture of my car and the sign. As no ticket was issued at the time I assumed I was being given a grace period.

Got a letter from CPM with a parking charge this morning via my Contract Hire supplier.

I have to pay, right? I don’t seem to have any grounds for appeal.

Thanks

Coupon-mad

Got a letter from CPM with a parking charge this morning via my Contract Hire supplier.

I have to pay, right?

Wrong.

But you will need to appeal to UKCPM (is it UKCPM?) with your name and address as hirer/lessee, to hook this matter firmly away from the lease/hire firm paying it like stupid numpties!

There is a hirer/lessee appeal or two in the NEWBIES thread in the lower section of the first post especially for this sort of case.

Did UKCPM send you a PCN in your own name, having got your name from the hire firm, or do you mean the letter is from your hire firm attaching a copy of their PCN they received addressed to them, and telling you that you can appeal?

Wilfthe

The PCN has been addressed to my hire company. They have forwarded a copy to me saying that they have passed my name and address to UKCPM so they can contact me to pay. They’ve sent me a copy so I can appeal/pay before the time limit for increase in charge from £60 to £100.

Coupon-mad

Right so you do none of that and you wait for your own PCN then you do what the NEWBIES thread tells you to do, using the special appeal wording for hirer/lessee and company cars, in that thread (there are three links to that wording).

You DO NOT look at the £60 discount and think that you have a short time to pay that bargain!

Wilfthe

Thanks for the advice.

Sorry I see what mean on the third link where the person didn’t hear back from the PCN issuer within 21 days. This one is also similar to my situation as it relates to double yellows.

I’ll sit tight and see when they write to me.

Coupon-mad

OK but if it gets to the end of August and you haven't had a PCN, then you will have to email an appeal anyway to tell them you are the hirer/lessee and that the lease firm has named you as hirer (NOT DRIVER!) and you are appealing.

Again it's to hook the PPC in your direction so they don't write again to the hire firm who will pay it then bill you. Don't sit and wait more then 2 weeks, if your own PCN does not arrive.

Are you certain the hire firm gave the correct address for you? We've seen that end in tears before now, when the person sits & waits then never gets their PCN, and meanwhile the lease firm who held an old address for the lessee, then paid on the next letter a moth later then billed the person.

Wilfthe

I think I’m still a bit confused as I don’t understand the grounds for my appeal. I parked on double yellows and there was a sign that I read and ignored.

So I can’t say the signs weren’t clear as my defence. If I don’t wait for the letter and appeal before it arrives, I don’t think I can use the “you didn’t write to me within 21 days as required” tactic either.

Is the purpose of the appeal just to state what they must comply with to make the PCN valid? Then wait to see if they take me to court and hope they don’t?

The_Deep

I’ve read the Newbies thread but I think having grounds to not pay or
Indeed appeal relies on the parking firm being in error in some way?

Indeed, and there are many ways in which the can and do err, inter alia landowner contracts, signs, timings, consistency of signage, LA permissions, to name a few.

You have many more options than you think, as they only need to fall over on one.

Nine times out of ten these tickets are scams so consider complaining to your MP.

Parliament is well aware of the MO of these private parking companies, and on 15th March 2019 a Bill was enacted to curb the excesses of these shysters. Codes of Practice are being drawn up, an independent appeals service will be set up, and access to the DVLA's date base more rigorously policed, persistent offenders denied access to the DVLA database and unable to operate.

Hopefully life will become impossible for the worst of these scammers, but until this is done you should still complain to your MP, citing the new legislation.

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2019/8/contents/enacted

Just as the clampers were finally closed down, so hopefully will many of these Private Parking Companies.



ahesr b

MistyZ

I reckon the first thing to do is to check with the hire company that they gave the PPC the hirer's correct address, as per Coupon-mad's post above.

Hire car PCNs are usually won on technicalities relating to POFA schedule 4, paragraphs 13 / 14. You could google that and have a good read, though the Newbies thread should put you in the picture as will searching for other hire car appeals on here.