Minster Baywatch parking across 2 bays PCN

UnleaseTheCraggle

Hello,

I was hoping for advice on whether it is worth defending my PCN in court. I have read the Newbies thread and case examples but couldn’t see a successful one like mine.

I parked in a Minster Baywatch car park with one of my front wheels in the neighbouring bay by mistake. They have a photo. They issued a PCN for £100 which has now gone up to £155.

I appealed to POPLA and lost (although it looks like they sent a standard rejection as it didn’t seem that relevant to my points). I am now receiving letters from a debt collector which I have ignored. I haven’t said that I was the driver.

I am going to send a SAR to Minster Baywatch.

Do you think it is worth me trying to defend this in court? The amount seems unreasonable given that it was £3 to park for a day but I am aware that this cannot be used as a defence.

I believe that the signs weren’t particularly clear from the car (and I have photos). Also, there was no lighting in the car park and it was early morning in winter. I am not sure what other defence I could use.

I am usually willing to fight these things (and have successfully done so in the past against a supermarket and council ticket), however, due to personal reasons I don’t have much time and energy at the moment so wondered if it would be easier just to pay.

Many thanks for reading. Any advice would be very much appreciated.

Le_Kirk

It is always worth fighting so long as you bear in mind the cost to you if you lose in court. The PPCs are not allowed to add on fake costs so the invoice (not fine) should be £100 plus allowable court fees. Have you actually received a Letter Before Claim or a formal court claim from Northampton CCBC yet? Submitting a SAR is exactly the right thing to do at this stage. In preparation for your defence (should it arise - PPCs have six years to start a court claim), go to the NEWBIE sticky and read post # 2, in particular the 17 or so pre-written defence examples by Bargepole and others.

The_Deep

I am not sure what other defence I could use.

Timing, wording of the paperwork, (are they compliant?), forbidding signage, contract, landlord permission, planning and advertising consents, costs and amounts claimed, (to name a few). There are thousands of example of defence on the internet, read some.

Of course it is easier to pay, but have you read Pastor Neilmoller's famous poem?

Nine times out of ten these tickets are scams so consider complaining to your MP.

Parliament is well aware of the MO of these private parking companies, and on 15th March 2019 a Bill was enacted to curb the excesses of these shysters. Codes of Practice are being drawn up, an independent appeals service will be set up, and access to the DVLA's date base more rigorously policed, persistent offenders denied access to the DVLA database and unable to operate.

Hopefully life will become impossible for the worst of these scammers, but until this is done you should still complain to your MP, citing the new legislation.

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2019/8/contents/enacted

Just as the clampers were finally closed down, so hopefully will many of these Private Parking Companies.

Redx

The £100 is probably not unreasonable, it's been around for a decade and in the BPA Cop since 2012, the Beavis case found £85 was not unreasonable too

Failure to abide by the parking rules on the signs means the driver agrees to the daily default tariff, usually £100 or less

The wording on the signage is key, so defence arguments would include

POFA failures
No keeper liability
No landowner authority
Poor and inadequate signage
BPA Cop failures

Etc

Nobody can foretell the outcome , especially without seeing all the evidence

If they have all their ducks in a row, then you will fail, because you need to win on a technicality, which will involve a lot of work and time on your part

A typical loss in court is up to £200

The decision is yours to make, not ours

UnleaseTheCraggle

Thank you so much for the replies.

I haven’t received a letter before claim or formal court claim yet so I am still at the stage of ignoring the debt collectors.

I am drafting an email to my MP, Kevin Hollinrake. Unfortunately, he seems to be the only MP who had positive things to say about these parking firms in the parliamentary debate on 2 February 2018! It will therefore be interesting to hear what he says, if anything.

Thanks again.

Quentin

Throughout here you are advised never to reveal who was driving


You need to edit your post to remove details of who was driving


The ppcs monitor here and can use posts in your thread against you in court