Smart parking ticket

Inter101

Hi,

Hope everyone is doing well. I am new to this so I hope I don't ask any stupid questions. However, recently the car broke down due to it over-heating. The car started to struggle and needed to park at a safe place.

So the driver entered the retail car park and had his daughter with him who is only 4 months old and 1 nephew and Niece. The driver decided he needed to get her and other children home as soon as possible so he called a family member to pick the children and wife up. While they were waiting they done a little shopping for snacks for the kids in B &m. (Can't find receipts)

Once they were picked up the driver stayed with the car waiting for it to cool down. However, after waiting the driver decided not to take the risk and try taking the car home because it still hadnt cooled down.
Therefore, the driver called a friend of his who picked me up and took him home.

Once he got home the driver waited for the traffic to calm down and gave a good amount of time for the car to cool down. He then went back and brought the car home.

Today the registered keeper received the letter from smart stating a fine due to over staying.

Do I have any ground to appeal?

Thank you and sorry for the long message.

MistyZ

Absolutely you should appeal. Or rather the Registered Keeper should. Use the blue template from the Newbies' thread.

However before doing anything else, edit your post to conceal the identity of the driver. 'The driver entered a retail park and parked the vehicle ...'. 'The Registered Keeper received the fine today ...' etc.

The parking companies do lurk here and have been known to use peoples' posts against them.

Also complain strongly to the manager of B&M. Explain why the driver had to do what they had to do. Again, while you may be helping with this, the complaint should be from the Registered Keeper. Refer to money spent and to habitual custom if that applies. Insist on cancellation. Be polite but be very clear and definite. If the manager doesn't help promptly, escalate the complaint to B&M's CEO.

Two-pronged approach at this stage.

The_Deep

Read what Pete Wishert, MP said in the House of Commons recently about Smart Parking.

"I am sick and tired of receiving emails from people complaining about the behaviour of parking companies, telling me that they will never again visit Perth city centre because of the negative experience they had when they had the misfortune to end up in a car park operated by one of these companies. I have received more complaints about one car park in the city of Perth than about any other issue. That car park is operated by the lone ranger of the parking cowboys: the hated and appalling Smart Parking—I see that many other Members are unfortunate enough to have Smart Parking operating in their constituencies. It has reached the stage where one member of my staff now spends a good part of each day just helping my constituents and visitors to my constituency to navigate the appeals process.
…
The BPA does not have the ability to regulate these companies and has shown no sign whatsoever that it is trying to get on top of some of the sharper practices. The BPA gives a veneer of legitimacy to some of the more outlandish rogue operators by including them in their membership, allowing them to continue to operate. The Bill will oblige operators such as Smart Parking to amend their practices."

Nine times out of ten these tickets are scams so consider complaining to your MP.

Parliament is well aware of the MO of these private parking companies, and on 15th March 2019 a Bill was enacted to curb the excesses of these shysters. Codes of Practice are being drawn up, an independent appeals service will be set up, and access to the DVLA's date base more rigorously policed, persistent offenders denied access to the DVLA database and unable to operate.

Hopefully life will become impossible for the worst of these scammers, but until this is done you should still complain to your MP, citing the new legislation.

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2019/8/contents/enacted

Just as the clampers were finally closed down, so hopefully will many of these Private Parking Companies.

fisherjim

You did not receive a "fine" it's an invoice.

Inter101

Hi guys thanks for the replies. For some reason the edit button on my post is greyed out.

And I think i found the blue template in the newbies section but is there nothing I add? I will paste what I found if you can tell me if it's the correct one please.

Re PCN number:

I dispute your 'parking charge', as the keeper of the vehicle. I deny any liability or contractual agreement and I will be making a formal complaint about your predatory conduct to your client landowner and to my MP.

There will be no admissions as to who was driving and no assumptions can be drawn. Since your PCN is a vague template, I require ALL photos taken and an explanation of the allegation and your evidence, i.e.:

- If the allegation concerns a PDT machine, the data supplied in response to this appeal must include the record of payments made - showing partial VRNs - and an explanation of the reason for the PCN, because your Notice does not explain it.

- If the allegation involves an alleged overstay of minutes, your evidence must include the actual grace period agreed by the landowner. If you fail to evidence the actual grace period that applies at this site or suggest that only one period applies, this will be disregarded as an attempt to mislead. In the absence of evidence, it will be reasonably taken to be a minimum of twenty minutes (ten on arrival and ten after parking time) in accordance with the official BPA article by Kelvin Reynolds about 'observation periods' on arrival being additional and separate to a 'grace period' at the end.

- in all cases, you must include a close up actual photograph of the sign you contend was at the location on the material date.

Formal note:
Should you later pursue this charge by way of litigation, note that service of any legal documents by email is expressly disallowed and you are not entitled to assume that the data in this dispute/appeal remains the current address for service in the future.

Yours faithfully,


And finally should I send this to BandM or the retail park it self as it had other shops in the park.

Furthermore, do I sent a copy to online challenges to smart parking too?

Sorry for being such a rookie.
And thanks for your help

waamo

It's an appeal. It goes to Smart.

Quentin

If you are trying to navigate this forum by phone then don't

You need to use a laptop or PC

Then you can edit!

Inter101

Thanks I managed to edit it by using a computer. So does the registered keeper mention anything about breaking down with children to smart?
Or literally copy and paste the below

Re PCN number:

I dispute your 'parking charge', as the keeper of the vehicle. I deny any liability or contractual agreement and I will be making a formal complaint about your predatory conduct to your client landowner and to my MP.

There will be no admissions as to who was driving and no assumptions can be drawn. Since your PCN is a vague template, I require ALL photos taken and an explanation of the allegation and your evidence, i.e.:

- If the allegation concerns a PDT machine, the data supplied in response to this appeal must include the record of payments made - showing partial VRNs - and an explanation of the reason for the PCN, because your Notice does not explain it.

- If the allegation involves an alleged overstay of minutes, your evidence must include the actual grace period agreed by the landowner. If you fail to evidence the actual grace period that applies at this site or suggest that only one period applies, this will be disregarded as an attempt to mislead. In the absence of evidence, it will be reasonably taken to be a minimum of twenty minutes (ten on arrival and ten after parking time) in accordance with the official BPA article by Kelvin Reynolds about 'observation periods' on arrival being additional and separate to a 'grace period' at the end.

- in all cases, you must include a close up actual photograph of the sign you contend was at the location on the material date.

Formal note:
Should you later pursue this charge by way of litigation, note that service of any legal documents by email is expressly disallowed and you are not entitled to assume that the data in this dispute/appeal remains the current address for service in the future.

Yours faithfully,

The pcn number will be added and after faithfully it the registered keepers name.

Thanks is that right?

waamo

Inter101 wrote: »

Thanks I managed to edit it by using a computer. So does the registered keeper mention anything about breaking down with children to smart?
Or literally copy and paste the below

Re PCN number:

I dispute your 'parking charge', as the keeper of the vehicle. I deny any liability or contractual agreement and I will be making a formal complaint about your predatory conduct to your client landowner and to my MP.

There will be no admissions as to who was driving and no assumptions can be drawn. Since your PCN is a vague template, I require ALL photos taken and an explanation of the allegation and your evidence, i.e.:

- If the allegation concerns a PDT machine, the data supplied in response to this appeal must include the record of payments made - showing partial VRNs - and an explanation of the reason for the PCN, because your Notice does not explain it.

- If the allegation involves an alleged overstay of minutes, your evidence must include the actual grace period agreed by the landowner. If you fail to evidence the actual grace period that applies at this site or suggest that only one period applies, this will be disregarded as an attempt to mislead. In the absence of evidence, it will be reasonably taken to be a minimum of twenty minutes (ten on arrival and ten after parking time) in accordance with the official BPA article by Kelvin Reynolds about 'observation periods' on arrival being additional and separate to a 'grace period' at the end.

- in all cases, you must include a close up actual photograph of the sign you contend was at the location on the material date.

Formal note:
Should you later pursue this charge by way of litigation, note that service of any legal documents by email is expressly disallowed and you are not entitled to assume that the data in this dispute/appeal remains the current address for service in the future.

Yours faithfully,

The pcn number will be added and after faithfully it the registered keepers name.

Thanks is that right?

The instructions tell you not to amend it or add anything to it.

Inter101

Yes however it does say if a disabled person was in the vehicle that can be added. So should the registered keeper and there was a baby in the vehicle and it was broken down. Or don't add anything at all and just literally paste the blue temple with the pcn number?

And when writing to b and m that will include all the scenario from beginning to end.

Sorry once more for all the questions

KeithP

Inter101 wrote: »

Or literally copy and paste the below

Thanks is that right?

Yes, that's right.