New (used) commuting car advice

Jigglebiz

Oh yes yes found the MFV - £8724
Hmmm...

silverwhistle

Have you considered a Zoe via EVEZY? Minimum lease period 1 month but if you lease for 6 months you can get a charge point installed free, I believe. Either way worth a look I'd have thought.

DrEskimo

Jigglebiz wrote: »

I’ve booked a test drive for the Zoe tomorrow , so I’ll give it a go.
I was wondering that if I do end up going with EV, that PCP or leasing is often a wise choice because of the changing technology? Or is that not true?
Had a look at used Zoe’s and as you said the battery owned ones are very rare.
New Zoe’s aren’t as eye wateringly expensive as I thought due to the govt contribution. Was quoted on carwow £5600 as a deposit and £202 for 40 months at 10,000 miles but I don’t know what the MFV would be.
Anyway will test drive , see if I like it First. On a bit of a tight timescale now.

Exciting! I hope you like it after all the ranting and raving I've done...! It's certainly not the most 'luxurious' car I've ever driven, but I do enjoy driving it.

So the way people buy their cars is obviously quite personal, but I will take you through my personal thoughts on the matter and why I decided against buying brand new, financing with PCP or going with a lease.

Buying brand new
Prices of Zoe's are actually at the highest point since they were released. Strangely, it appears it's the opposite to other cars, where at release discounts are small, but then increase as the new model is announced. Back in early 2016 a battery owned ZE40 Zoe could be had for about £16k. November of last year I had quotes of £17.5k, and now today they are closer to £19k.

Given that the new Zoe is due release and whilst prices are not announced, I imagine a price of around £24/25k given that the e-Corsa can be had for £24k. For an extra £5k-ish, I think the new ZE50 is worth it given the increased battery capacity and CCS charging. Also the interior is a vast improvement on the current model.

PCP
PCP is just a loan, but I see you main motivation for considering it is to act as some form of asset value insurance. I've seen this argument put forward before, and I think it's generally a weak one. Namely because people forget to factor in the additional cost associated with having a PCP in the form of interest. The GFV on most PCP deals are pessimistic, as you have found with the GFV on the Zoe at just £8,700. When you consider that PCP is the most expensive form of finance in terms of total interest paid, you are looking at being charged around £2k over the term. So for the PCP to be economically better than straight cash, the Zoe would have to end up being worth <£6,700 (assuming interest payable is £2k). The chances of this are so remote that it's practical impossible.

Now if you can get the same discounted price for the Zoe, and get 0% finance, then it's obviously worth it. But I found that Renault's 0% HP deals did not have the same level of discount as the 5.9% PCP deals. From memory the car price was about £3k more. So in fact, it was cheaper to go with the 5.9% PCP!

Lease
I did consider leasing, and in particular the EVEZY deal of £289per month, no deposit, no contract and includes insurance, servicing, maintenance and POLAR subscription. However what deterred me was the restrictions imposed. The mileage restriction wasn't an issue, but you do not get a physical key, the insurance offered has an excess of £1,000, you can't travel abroad, you have to have a mandatory dashcam fitted, etc.

Primarily though, it came down to how long you wanted to drive the car. Relative to a new Zoe, the EVEZY subscription is probably cheaper over 6months. After a year, there probably isn't much in it still. More than a year however, and EVEZY becomes much more expensive quickly. Primarily as the flat rate is based on depreciation costs in the first year, but remain the same regardless how long you have it!

So I ended up deciding on used. Over 6-months EVEZY would have cost me £1,734. In contrast, given current trade in valuations I have made money on my Zoe, and future costs are unlikely to get close to £289/month. I also have no conditions/restrictions and can keep the car as long as I want, knowing the longer I own it and more I drive it, the cheaper it gets.


All that said, I didn't have time pressures! I was without a car for 18months before I bought mine, which allowed me to scour the market for months before committing. For you, it may be that you look to rent one from somewhere like EVEZY and wait for the pricing of the new one, or until a used one pops up at a good price?

EVEZY does have a long wait list though, so you could also try EV for everyone (https://eevonline.com/). They emailed me to say they have 41kWh Zoe's at £299 (so a bit more expensive) and you don't get insurance included (about £24/month for me), but they do have immediate delivery.

Good luck!

Jigglebiz

Thanks - really appreciate it! I assumed an EV was out of our reach but actually it’s not as much as o thought.
I havent had much luck finding an older used Zoe but seen some Renault Approved Pre-registered Zoe’s at around £15,000 - I have enquired about 0% deals and hire purchase. Advantage of this route is that servicing is included and they install the electric charging point...
Still from what you describe the used route is preferable, there don’t seem to be many available up north (lack of EV charging infrastructure I guess) although according to the map on Renault’s website there are actually plenty of fast charging points near my workand on my commute , if needed .

DrEskimo

Jigglebiz wrote: »

Thanks - really appreciate it! I assumed an EV was out of our reach but actually it’s not as much as o thought.
I havent had much luck finding an older used Zoe but seen some Renault Approved Pre-registered Zoe’s at around £15,000 - I have enquired about 0% deals and hire purchase. Advantage of this route is that servicing is included and they install the electric charging point...
Still from what you describe the used route is preferable, there don’t seem to be many available up north (lack of EV charging infrastructure I guess) although according to the map on Renault’s website there are actually plenty of fast charging points near my workand on my commute , if needed .

I take it these £15k pre-reg are battery leased? It's quite high, as there are a few lease models around the £12k mark.

I would be wary of the leased model in general though, as they don't hold their value nearly as well in my experience. I know that trade in value for a relatively new leased Zoe is only around the £10k mark....Some dealers won't even accept them at trade in, and they are harder to sell privately as you need to ensure the buyer has taken on the lease before you release it, and that requires a credit check...it's an additional layer of complexity that ends up costing you more IMO...not to mention the cheapest battery lease is £59, which is probably what you would spend on petrol anyway!

You can get 2 free services on any used Renault too, just need to buy it with the PCP finance. This also comes with a £500 deposit contribution. I did this and just settled the finance soon after.

You also get a £500 OLEV grant towards a home charging installation. Depending on the work needed to get it installed, it will only cost around £200 extra (also depending on what charger you want!).

If you want to send me any details of any Zoe's you are interested in, or any deals just give me a shout. I spent an inordinate amount of time researching these (habit with everything I buy...!), so good to put my useless knowledge to some use...!

Jigglebiz

I’ve costed up the total cost of ownership and I reckon a pre-reg 2019 Zoe with a battery lease is only marginally cheaper than a brand new Yaris 1.5 Petrol over the 5 years.. I will test drive the Zoe and see what we think as driving comfort , enjoyment etc is probably what will win it over if everything else is negligible.

Can you recommend any good used EV dealers? I was contacted by Just EVs, they seem to have a lot of knowledge which is useful for a newbie like me!

Also I noticed that the Zoe’s seem to have a bench back seat - ie it folds in one piece rather than 60/40 - this could be a dealbreaker for us as often have a child car seat as well as want to carry larger items. Might need to consider a Nissan Leaf as well...

DrEskimo

Jigglebiz wrote: »

I’ve costed up the total cost of ownership and I reckon a pre-reg 2019 Zoe with a battery lease is only marginally cheaper than a brand new Yaris 1.5 Petrol over the 5 years.. I will test drive the Zoe and see what we think as driving comfort , enjoyment etc is probably what will win it over if everything else is negligible.

Can you recommend any good used EV dealers? I was contacted by Just EVs, they seem to have a lot of knowledge which is useful for a newbie like me!

Also I noticed that the Zoe’s seem to have a bench back seat - ie it folds in one piece rather than 60/40 - this could be a dealbreaker for us as often have a child car seat as well as want to carry larger items. Might need to consider a Nissan Leaf as well...

Yea there won't be much in it with a leased model, but as you say, better drive and more equipment might win you over.

Not really, sorry. I found most of the listings from Just EV's or Drive Green were overpriced. Matt at GoGreenAutos is very knowledgable and a nice chap, but again, pricing was similar to main dealers and stock was limited. I ended buying from a Renault dealer in South London, Masters in Beckenham. They have a good selection of battery owned Zoe's. Might be worth giving them a call and seeing if they have any other older stock coming in?

Ah yes, that may be problem. Newer Zoe's do now come with split folding seats, but you need to be looking at 18 or even 68-plate Zoe's to get it. Some might be registered in late 2018, but built earlier and not have them though, so need to look at pictures.

I know it's very easy to remove the rear bench, (good video from GoGreenAutos, actually has a lot of good videos! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NzVPXtWkhC0) so I had planned to look at whether it's something you can easily retrofit. Haven't got round to ringing for prices though...

Jigglebiz

Ah brilliant thanks, yes we test drove a 19 plate Zoe with a Renault dealership and wow we were impressed! Very comfortable and relaxing to drive. It has the 60/40 back seats. Much nicer than the Yaris or Auris hybrid we test drove recently...
The dealer said he couldn’t actually sell us that car because it is their only demo until they get the new model in, which is annoying as I need a car within the month.
Will call round other Renault dealerships - thanks for the contact - and see if I can find anything available now. They are clearly in demand!

DrEskimo

Jigglebiz wrote: »

Ah brilliant thanks, yes we test drove a 19 plate Zoe with a Renault dealership and wow we were impressed! Very comfortable and relaxing to drive. It has the 60/40 back seats. Much nicer than the Yaris or Auris hybrid we test drove recently...
The dealer said he couldn’t actually sell us that car because it is their only demo until they get the new model in, which is annoying as I need a car within the month.
Will call round other Renault dealerships - thanks for the contact - and see if I can find anything available now. They are clearly in demand!

Here is the cheapest 41kWh leased Zoe on the market right now, and has the split folding seats:

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201908020720002

I would try and haggle down to £12k, then ask for it on PCP to get the £500 FDA and 2 free services. If you can, settle the PCP soon after as the interest is high.

I wasn't interested in the lease model for the reasons I've given, but if you don't mind I would try and get it for as close to £11k as possible, as that's a good price. You might be able to get this for £11.5k if you are good at negotiating and take advantage of their PCP deposit contributions!

Glad you liked it, EV's do drive nicely don't they! You won't be able to go back to an ICE

Jigglebiz

Thank you! Unfortunately that one has sold.. apparently it’s the only used Zoe the Lookers group have in stock .. called up another few dealers and though they have nearly new cars advertised for sale they are merely on show to get people to buy new.
Did get a good offer on a new Zoe though (outgoing model). Battery leased at £14990z
My drive is just about wide enough! Very tempted but it would be the most I’d ever spent on a car and probably need to be PCP.. waiting for the quote. Seems like a good deal though.
Best carwow offer I’ve had on battery owned is just over £20k.