Domestic & General fraud.

Cleetus

Hi,

this is a post about direct debit payments to the payee name DGS/RRP DD but is in a different category of issue to other existing threads on that subject I have found here...

I recently discovered an outgoing DD on my account I could not identify, to the payee D&G Appliance Care First Payment DD. It turns out this is a payment to Domestic & General for a cover policy on a fridge. I have never owned a fridge, never purchased a fridge, nor any other white goods, and have never taken out a cover policy on any purchase or item. Ever. That is simply not my finance bracket.

I canceled the DD, called and explained these truths to Domestic & General, explained that I have zero knowledge of any contract relationship with them and have never knowingly given them my bank details or any other information, then contacted my bank and had a block placed against any payments from Domestic & General or derivations of that name.

However, upon referencing my historical statements, I discover that a monthly payment has been going to them since 2011 (!) for this item I have never owned on this contract I have not agreed to, or have any knowledge of.

Yes, obviously, recriminations... how did I let an outgoing DD go unnoticed for almost a decade? In my defence, when this contract apparently 'renewed' this month and the name changed to D&G Appliance Care First Payment DD, ie a name with actual words in it, I flagged it immediately. The previous DGS/RRP DD payments have 'always' been there, so if I ever flagged them, going out on the first of the month with various other outgoings, I probably took them for bank charges or card repayments. And again, I had no reason to suspect such a contract was outgoing since I have no affiliation with this company and never owned an item of that type.

Anyway, that is all back story. The issue now is that D&G were definitely not given my details by myself, I consider their holding of them to be criminal, the entire contract to be fraud, and the complete and total sum taken to be theft. Again, unlike others facing 'surprise' payments from this company this is not an older or lapsed policy that I've forgotten about. I have never made any kind of purchase in this entire market.

My bank have advised me to call them again, and if they refuse a refund then to file a motion with said bank.

But any additional advice before I make that call would be appreciated?

The only (tenuous) affiliation I have with this policy is that it is linked to an item at an address that I previously lived in, but only as a joint tenant, and the tenancy agreement did not extend to any insurance policy on items therein. While the payments date from 2011 when I did reside at the associated address, D&G informed me that the purchase the policy is against dates back to 2009, which was before I moved in or had any connection to that address.

It seems to me they have acquired my details in pursuit of a cancelled claim by another party, but this is only a guess, and I did not share those details myself.

What advice can anyone offer on how best to approach this? What pertinent information do I need to gather I might not otherwise know to think of if I have to turn this into a legal case?

Suffice it to say, because I had no knowledge of this entire account before this month I have zero paper work associated to it. I also, obviously, have zero paperwork associated to a fridge I have never owned or purchased.

davidmcn

Wouldn't it be simpler in the first instance to claim the money back from your bank via the direct debit guarantee? Have your bank told you how the DD was set up ie with your signature or paperless?

If there's any fraud going on, it'll be by a third party using your bank details for their warranty, not by D&G - though I suspect more likely to be a c0ck-up.

DoaM

davidmcn wrote: »

though I suspect more likely to be a c0ck-up.

Probably - though it's remarkable how the details on a DD form have exactly matched the OP's bank account, since you usually need Account Name, Account Number and Sort Code all to be correct for a DD to be set up.

I know the Account Name is sometimes not checked, but that would be the bank's fault if they still allowed a DD to be set up.

CardinalWolsey

DoaM wrote: »

I know the Account Name is sometimes not checked, but that would be the bank's fault if they still allowed a DD to be set up.

For DD's set up electronically, account names are never checked. The number of false positives on error checking is simply too high, due to the variation in how people believe their account names to be set up. All that is needed is sort code and account number, with the banks effectively pushing validation down to their customers (i.e. its up to you to spot if an incorrect DD has started taking funds from your account - hence the DD guarantee).

If you know how bank account numbers are constructed (i.e. they are not just a list of sequential numbers), its not too hard to calculate an account number, and try it to see if it works. Even if you get the account number wrong, a human being at the bank will not check - it will simply be automatically rejected (computer says "no") back to the originator with an error code, who will then come back to you and ask you to correct the account number.

agrinnall

It would be interesting to see whether a DD Guarantee claim going back 8 years works in full, so I hope that the OP takes that route and reports back.

Aylesbury_Duck

I've lived in my current house for six years. The previous occupants between them are still paying monthly and quarterly payments for:

Three magazine subscriptions
Rodent/pest cover
Wiring cover
Water pipes cover

This is despite me returning the early issues and letters with "no longer at this address" and doing so ever since. Between them they are paying around £30 per month for all this, and have done every month since 2013 when they moved out. It seems that checking one's bank account regularly isn't a concern to some people.

DCFC79

Aylesbury_Duck wrote: »

I've lived in my current house for six years. The previous occupants between them are still paying monthly and quarterly payments for:

Three magazine subscriptions
Rodent/pest cover
Wiring cover
Water pipes cover

This is despite me returning the early issues and letters with "no longer at this address" and doing so ever since. Between them they are paying around £30 per month for all this, and have done every month since 2013 when they moved out. It seems that checking one's bank account regularly isn't a concern to some people.

at least over £2k they are wasting. That's madness.

bris

8 years and only just discovered this? Hmm really?

spo2

Aylesbury_Duck wrote: »

I've lived in my current house for six years. The previous occupants between them are still paying monthly and quarterly payments for:

Three magazine subscriptions
Rodent/pest cover
Wiring cover
Water pipes cover

This is despite me returning the early issues and letters with "no longer at this address" and doing so ever since. Between them they are paying around £30 per month for all this, and have done every month since 2013 when they moved out. It seems that checking one's bank account regularly isn't a concern to some people.

The previous occupants of our house still pay buildings and contents insurance at over £500 per year! We've been in the house over 4 years now, and the bank owned it between them leaving and us buying, so who knows how much they've wasted!

Cleetus

Hi all, thank you for the replies. I asked my bank previously for the comprehensive details of the Payee, but didn't ask to specify how the DD was set up. I will do this.

I believe the Direct Debit Guarantee route is what my bank were suggesting I pursue, though they didn't use that term. They advised to contact the payee first though and provide a negative response if that is what was forthcoming.
What I'm expecting though is for D&G to calcify the harder I pursue this, so I want to extract all and any info I need in the first phone call. Obviously I know to ask any and all details about the set up, about the associated purchase (what product, from where, by whom etc) to gather any account numbers and so forth. But is there anything additional, any useful legalese, that I might not know to think of, if the DD Guarantee route is not forthcoming or disputed?

stragglebod

Perhaps these are vulnerable people who've been forced to sell and move into supportive housing, and who don't have the capacity to look after their own finances and don't have anyone else helping them?


Edit: this is in response to Aylesbury Duck and spo2