Port of Wells PCN

Coupon-mad

is it advisable/safe to share my defence with CE Ltd now rather than wait til court? I would rather it didn't get to the court stage.

You can't avoid court stage but they often discontinue, such as here:

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/5956466/cel-proposed-defence

That shows you what happens in many cases. Or we win at hearings.

Also, is there still a time limit in which PCNs should be issued? Mine is dated as issued 36 days after the alleged crime. I received it a few days after that.

Depends if there was a windscreen PCN first.

busylizzy222

No windscreen PCN, just a postal 36 days later.

No mention of driver or keeper in the front. Small print in the back says it is the driver's responsibility to pay and the creditor does not know their name or address so I am invited to pay, or appeal or notify them of the drivers details.

busylizzy222

Thank you Fruitcake, Keith P and Coupon-mad. I've done all the recommended reading...

There is no mention of keeper or driver on PCN itself but in the small print on the back under 'payment' it says it is the drivers responsibility to pay. 'The creditor does not know both the name of the driver and the current address for service for the driver. We therefore invite you to pay or appeal the unpaid parking charge or if you were not the driver of the vehicle, to notify us of the name of the driver and a current address for service for the driver and pass the notice to the driver.'

No mention of POFA or keeper being liable. (ie they know about the Byelaws!)

So, you all recommend that I write to CE now, before the 30 days making the following points??

1 -You have failed to install signage at the site that is sufficiently different from the ones there before the changes were introduced last summer. The driver visits the area regularly but is not a 'local' so did not know about the changes and nothing at the site alerted them to the fact that they needed to walk up to the signs and read the new small print. Hundreds, possibly thousands of other people, including six of my family and friends, have not noticed the new signage either - so clearly there is a problem/inadequacy. The signs need to be big and bright orange at the entrance as seen in other places. Had they been aware I'm sure all of these drivers would have happily paid the new £1 evening charge in order to avoid an automatic ANPR PCN.

2 - I was not the driver. Are you relying on POFA in this instance? If so, the PCN should have been issued within 14 days. Mine was dated 36 days later and received some time after that.

3 - The land at this site is not 'relevant land' as defined in the POFA because it is within the Harbour Byelaws map, therefore liability cannot be transferred to me as keeper.


Also, copy in my MP and also Norman Lamb MP for North Norfolk?

Is there anything else I should add or are there any wording technicalities I need to be aware of here? I don't want to fail on a technicality at this stage!

Thanks again for all your help.

busylizzy222

Coupon-mad wrote: »

You can't avoid court stage but they often discontinue, such as here:

That shows you what happens in many cases. Or we win at hearings.

Depends if there was a windscreen PCN first.

Thank you
Would you be able to look over my draft reply to LBC in previous post please? I'm getting close to my 30 days so want to get it sent if you agree that's the best way forward.
Thanks

Coupon-mad

Yes it looks fine to me.

finchman

If you like a game play along at the end of the day the land is bye law landcivil court means nothing only harbour master can take you to magistrates court NOT CEL if the bailiff heavies come tell them Implied right of access has been denied to cel,s agents and employees ask them to leave as they are trespassing the deep gave the bes
t reply on another thread tell them to foad

If you live long enough you will get old

Umkomaas

if the bailiff heavies come tell them Implied right of access has been denied to cel,s agents and employees ask them to leave as they are trespassing

How would you anticipate a visit from 'bailiff heavies' might occur?

busylizzy222

'We now confirm that this Notice has been cancelled.'

Another one to add to your victories list - thank you all so much for all your help and the confidence you gave me to fight this.

Coupon-mad

Well done! What clinched it, did your MP put pressure on them?

busylizzy222

They didn't explain their reason. Norman Lamb MP for North Norfolk's office replied to me and said that he had written to the Harbour master expressing his concern about the inadequate signage. So me copying him in to my CE letter probably helped.
I think it was mainly the Byelaws thing tbh, they knew they couldn't pursue me as RK.

It took almost a year and quite a lot of effort but hopefully this will inspire others not to give in and just pay them. They really are a bunch of crooks!

I wouldn't have had the knowledge or confidence to fight it without the advice and experience of everyone on this forum, so thank you again to everyone one here, I really appreciate it.