ES Parking Enforcement NTK - Interesting Private Land Issue

Coupon-mad

Would it help if I were to take pictures of the many, many, many vehicles which are parked in the same location and receive no tickets? I have been told by our security that most of the people who park in this lay-by will "get away with it" because they are seen to be contractors and are therefore working. Quite why they decided to jump on me 10 seconds after I was out of eyesight (and 30 seconds after parking there) I do not know.

Nope, leave that out entirely. It is irrelevant.

Your IAS appeal looks worth a try in this case, due to the sign allowing loading - but you MUST upload a couple of close up photos of the sign where it says that, with your appeal. Plus your Blue Badge. Plus the photo that shows you returning holding something (does it?!).

I'd remove this as the IAS will not agree and it just distracts them:

If this notice is attempting to make a contractual offer, then as they are forbidding they do not fulfill the basic requirement of a contract, which is that each party to the contract must offer valuable consideration to the other party, on clear terms capable of acceptance. In this case neither ES Parking Enforcement nor Spinningfields Estates is offering anything to motorists. The notices cannot, therefore, reasonably be construed as having created a contractual relationship between the Claimant and the Defendant.

dkl_uk

Thanks for your response. I'll remove that bit as suggested.

I also have a fair few emails from security at my work plus the management company who run the Spinningfields Estate, all wanted to get the ticket rescinded but since it's after 21 days since the ticket was issued, they say it's too late to even try.

I have one email from the building manager completely agreeing with the fact I was allowed to park where I was at it presented no issues to the company, and I have an email from the Spinningfields Estate people who said they'd have gladly got the ticket rescinded if we were within the 21 day period. I also have a further email from security stating that due to the CCTV being on a 31 day rotation, there's no proof of my arrival and departure, so I'm going to have to use the timestamps on the parking companies photographs - which show my car being there for around two minutes.

I'll get this sent ASAP. I can't paste the text into the IAS dispute box - they clearly want to make this as hard as possible. Looks like I'm writing 1,000 words all over again.

Coupon-mad

Yes I think you do have to type it in, but someone posted that they contacted the IAS to ask for a link to upload their appeal and attachments directly, as they couldn't access the appeals page.

You could try that! Make sure ALL attachments are attached before hitting submit.

I would ALSO include all the emails saying the companies want the PCN cancelled as you were loading for 2 minutes which is allowed.

I would add a line or two, pointing out that the landowner/companies on site objecting to the PCN being pursued, negates any claim that the charge has any 'commercial justification' as was held in the Beavis case at Para 199: ''What matters is that a charge of the order of £85 [...] is an understandable ingredient of a scheme serving legitimate interests. Customers using the car park agree to the scheme by doing so.''

And that it fails the test of good faith and open dealing, also discussed in Beavis:
Para 205: ''The requirement of good faith in this context is one of fair and open dealing. Openness requires that the terms should be expressed fully, clearly and legibly, containing no concealed pitfalls or traps. Appropriate prominence should be given to terms which might operate disadvantageously to the customer.''

dkl_uk

Hello again.

This is what I sent to the IAS. I included images of the first and last photo of my car (so the arrival and leaving times), a photo of my blue badge, emails from my building manager and the Spinningfields Estates people stating they weren't wanting the ticket to be charged, and the photo they took of their sign.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/5cxqf0rq89u4u1k/Parking%20Fine%20Dispute.docx?dl=0

They have, of course, refused to budge and the IAS are now asking me what I want to do.

I can submit further response or I can send it to arbitration. What needs to happen now please?

Coupon-mad

Submit a further response. Repeat that the signs allow loading, and you were loading.

dkl_uk

Today I received a further letter from ES Parking Enforcement adding £25 to the fine because I haven't paid it. The case is with the IAS, and although they didn't email me to tell me, I checked the IAS website today and it transpires they refused my appeal before 8am this morning.

Now the fine is £125, even though it went to the IAS.

G4S security guards spoke to the man who does the daytime ticketing and even he said there's a three minute window between sighting the vehicle and ticketing it. Their own photos show the vehicle was first photographed and then removed within three minutes.

Anyway, here's what the IAS say:
The adjudicator made their decision on 27/06/2019 07:21:43.

The Appellant should understand that the Adjudicator is not in a position to give legal advice to either of the parties but they are entitled to seek their own independent legal advice. The Adjudicator's role is to consider whether or not the parking charge has a basis in law and was properly issued in the circumstances of each individual case. In all Appeals the Adjudicator is bound by the relevant law applicable at the time and is only able to consider legal challenges and not factual mistakes nor extenuating or mitigating circumstances. Throughout this appeal the Operator has had the opportunity consider all points raised and could have conceded the appeal at any stage. The Adjudicator who deals with this Appeal is legally qualified and each case is dealt with according to their understanding of the law as it applies and the legal principles involved. A decision by an Adjudicator is not legally binding on an Appellant who is entitled to seek their own legal advice if they so wish.

The Operator has provided evidence of the signs at the site, which make it clear any driver parking in the restricted area, will be issued with the parking charge notice.

The Appellant has not put forward a ground of appeal. They have simply provided a number of documents. I should not have to try to infer the grounds from the documents and the names given to them.

The Operator has provided photographic evidence of the Appellant's vehicle parked on the land they manage, and within the restricted area. The appeal is dismissed.




You read my appeal above before I sent it to the IAS. I quite literally told them I should not be ticketed because they were predatory, had conflicting signs and I was not on the road or pavement.


ON CHECKING FURTHER there is no word document in the attachment list on the IAS website, only the images I wanted to send to support the appeal. Considering I work with computers every single day I find it hard to believe I wouldn't have attached the document, and I find it even more difficult to understand to what context ES Parking Enforcement refused my first appeal through the IAS website if there was no document for them to read there.

At this point it looks like I am going to have to pay because somehow the appeal document has gone missing, however, the additional £25 is surely incorrect since the appeal was in progress?

dkl_uk

Update: things got worse.

I received an LBA today, however, I have already written direct to ES Parking Enforcement's head office due to them increasing the ticket charge to £125 while it was under dispute with the IAS.

Timeline of events:

• Letter received from lease company about a ticket I had no idea I'd got.
• Went to dispute online, transpires the ticket was given while my car was left in a "no stopping at any time" zone for 120-180 seconds while I walked into and back out of my employer's parking garage.
• Disputed with ES Parking: Declined.
• Disputed with IAS: I attached images of the car arrival and departure (3 minutes is not enough time for the charge to be enforceable as far as I'm aware), emails from the landowner and my employer stating they didn't want the ticket persued, my blue badge, and a 1,000 word document because the IAS have disabled the ability to paste text into their dispute box.
• Dispute refused because the word document never went through, so the adjudicator threw it out.
• The very day I received the refusal I also received a letter from ES Parking telling me the ticket was now £125. I already knew it would go from £60 to £100 as part of the IAS appeals process, but now they were charging more for non-payment.
• I sent a letter to their head office. I photographed the letter and the receipt. No response.
• Now I have the LBA.

So what now?

Ralph-y

what does the LBA say ? who is it off? who does it say pay ?


the above will / would be useful




Ralph:cool:

dkl_uk

Here you go.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/6u0kbszioxhgk79/gladstones.jpg?dl=0


Ta

KeithP

Why have you hidden your PCN number on that letter but left your full name clearly visible?

Also, you would be wise to sign up to dropbox with a username something other than your full real name.