£3 per hour - Am I missing something?

qwerasdfzxcv

Hi all,

Just looking for some clarification and whether I'm missing anything.

I'm on UC now simply for what would be the JSA allowance. So circa £80 a week.

I'm getting funding for a 4 week course to begin soon.

I've been trying to find some work here and there to top up my money in the meantime. Through agencies I've managed to get 3 days and have worked them. I've had an offer of another day but decided I should really check whether it's worth my while.

I've worked 26 hours and after tax will earn circa £200. At the taper rate that will reduce my UC by £126, meaning that really I've worked 26 hours for £76 / £2.84 an hour.

Why am I working in the meantime when it is having pretty much no tangible benefit to me and is not leading to future work?

I don't get paid for that work for around 4 weeks and it is PAYE. So one way or another they're going to find out about it or sanction me if I keep shtum. Am I missing something or am I actually working for nigh on nothing?

(Do I have to let them know once I have actually received the money, or before?)

I understand some will not appreciate the undertone to this but appreciate your responses nonetheless.

Many thanks

WhenIam64

While it may seem pointless, the issue is that you get back into the way of things. Real life is not UC/Benefits.

An employer will look to see a track record of working even if it is patchy.

The last point, and this is the one that most people seem to miss, is that if you want to be in the right place at the right time for the right job, you have to be out there and not at home. You get a job from a job in most cases.

KatrinaWaves

qwerasdfzxcv wrote: »

Through agencies I've managed to get 3 days and have worked them. I've had an offer of another day but decided I should really check whether it's worth my while.

I've worked 26 hours and after tax will earn circa £200. At the taper rate that will reduce my UC by £126, meaning that really I've worked 26 hours for £76 / £2.84 an hour.

Why am I working in the meantime when it is having pretty much no tangible benefit to me and is not leading to future work?

No, you will have worked 26 hours for the agreed hourly rate.

What you mean is you'd rather not work for the money...

qwerasdfzxcv

WhenIam64 wrote: »

While it may seem pointless, the issue is that you get back into the way of things. Real life is not UC/Benefits.

An employer will look to see a track record of working even if it is patchy.

The last point, and this is the one that most people seem to miss, is that if you want to be in the right place at the right time for the right job, you have to be out there and not at home. You get a job from a job in most cases.

Understood.

In my current situation though, the work that satisfies the getting back into the way of things, living a normal life and contributing, getting out there etc will be coming from the training course I'm doing. A course in an entirely different industry to the one off work I've been getting.

So given all said, I conclude at this time that it is simply not in my interest to make myself useful for the odd day here and there. Who wants to graft away for around £20 per 8-10 hour day after food and travel!

qwerasdfzxcv

KatrinaWaves wrote: »

No, you will have worked 26 hours for the agreed hourly rate.

What you mean is you'd rather not work for the money...

Ask yourself in my circumstances who actually would? And be honest with yourself.

I can only work one or two days a week, if I could find it, in the run up to my course. During the course no days at all.

What is the purpose in my taking the moral high ground with myself and making myself work for the UC I will receive in the meantime anyway, effectively taking home a £2.84 an hour topup?


Do you think I want to live on £79 per week? Had I not been in this circumstance then obviously I ramp myself back up into work regardless of the reasoning in this thread.

WhenIam64

There is a lot of behavioural science in the design of UC. It has removed a few of the "poverty traps" where there was the type of marginal payments you appear to have an issue with.

Clearly those designing the system can't cover all eventualities or opinions. You have taken a stance and you'll have to follow through. We're all adults here

However your comments are just suckering people onto the punch, then you might be able to spend your time more productively by finding a part-time job somewhere.

qwerasdfzxcv

WhenIam64 wrote: »

There is a lot of behavioural science in the design of UC. It has removed a few of the "poverty traps" where there was the type of marginal payments you appear to have an issue with.

Clearly those designing the system can't cover all eventualities or opinions. You have taken a stance and you'll have to follow through. We're all adults here

However your comments are just suckering people onto the punch, then you might be able to spend your time more productively by finding a part-time job somewhere.

Thank you for your response, the context and your time in doing so.

I have no intention of suckering people onto any punch. I simply was looking for clarification as to whether the outworking of my particular situation is unavoidable. Despite the forum tagline being one of no judgement, it unfortunately seems that others still partake in thinly veiled passings of such.

Regarding part-time work, you seem to have missed my point in that finding that is simply a waste of time for me. Considering that for the next 6 weeks I can only work circa 5 days, effectively earning that meagre top-up to my UC. My value is more than that £2 or £3 per hour. Working in this scenario therefore is simply not worth it, and I am not creating connections that will be further explored afterward.

Again, thanks.

calcotti

You are right that when working whilst within the benefits system the reward for time spent working is small. Universal Credit has got rid of the 'cliff edges' that exist in legacy benefits where you can completely lose a benefit at a trigger point or effectively work for nothing but it is inevitable that the rate of return is reduced at the border between benefits and work. UC was intended to be more generous but George Osborne increased the benefit claw back rate.

Situation is slightly better for people with LCWRA or child responsibilities because some of the earnings are completely ignored before the taper rate is applied.

w06

Looking at it the other way aroudn may help, by working just three days you've added an extra week's worth of cash to your total income. For many of us on UC that would make a big difference.

I much prefer the taper to the cliff edge that was.

qwerasdfzxcv

calcotti wrote: »

You are right that when working whilst within the benefits system the reward for time spent working is small. Universal Credit has got rid of the 'cliff edges' that exist in legacy benefits where you can completely lose a benefit at a trigger point or effectively work for nothing but it is inevitable that the rate of return is reduced at the border between benefits and work. UC was intended to be more generous but George Osborne increased the benefit claw back rate.

Situation is slightly better for people with LCWRA or child responsibilities because some of the earnings are completely ignored before the taper rate is applied.

Thank you Calcotti.

Yes I imagine the rigmarole of losing the benefit completely, or re-registering every few days/weeks was highly counter productive for both DWP workload/logistics and the claimant.

It has been more than a decade since I last had any involvement with benefits. UC does seem a much better/long overdue system.

qwerasdfzxcv

w06 wrote: »

Looking at it the other way aroudn may help, by working just three days you've added an extra week's worth of cash to your total income. For many of us on UC that would make a big difference.

I much prefer the taper to the cliff edge that was.

Do you mean thinking about it as the excess from the 3 days that I will actually see, the £20-£30 'take home' per day, as coming to effectively one extra week of UC money?

It is hard to turn up and rid the "I'm working for less than £3 an hour" from my mind! In fact as it stands I'm seeing it as a 63% ultra higher rate tax!

My situation is just unfortunate I see, I.e. not rewarding me for trying to be proactive in the meantime. If I was on a linear route back into work, then the taper is fine, and ideally the 2 to 3 days of work would result in further opportunities and eventually full time work.

Thanks for your input.