E-Signature CCA - Evidence or Not?

StevenG13

Hi,


I recently requested a copy of my signed CCA agreement and received a response by email a scanned document as an attachment. In the signature box for the customer is a handwritten note (not by me) which simply reads "ESIGNATURE". My question is, will this document alone be sufficient evidence or will they need to provide the emails if I decide to defend the claim? Furthermore, if they are required to provide proof of the the e-signature how will they be able to prove the authenticity of the email and in what format will they be accepted as evidence by the judge? Surely a print out will not carry sufficient weight as evidence?


Any advice will be on this would be great.


Regards


Steve

sourcrates

Hi,

There is no requirement within the consumer credit act for a copy agreement to be signed, so your argument is void.

WhenIam64

How old is the agreement? I have signed quite a few "clickwrap" finance agreements (e signature) and have no issue with their legitimacy.

Is there a particular aspect of the agreement or a term you think has been added - after the event. Or are you seeking to have it suspended for not having a wet signature?

StevenG13

Hi,



Thanks for responding,



My argument is simply that I had never seen that document prior to a few days ago so I could not have signed it.



I was sent the pre-contract information which I agreed to by email, but I never received or was shown the actual CCA, either physically or electronically. Surely the burden of proof lies with them to show that they did provide me with the CCA and that I did sign it electronically and enter into an agreement with them? How can they seek to enforce a debt without demonstrating this?


Regards,


Steve

BoGoF

Saying 'Surely' doesn't make it so.

Did you receive the money or not?

WhenIam64

Did you receive the money or not?

It is the terms and not the money that is the issue at hand

I was sent the pre-contract information which I agreed to by email

The main issue with electronic contracts is whether there was agreement to the terms whether read or not. Usually they overcome the yes/no to the agreement with a cooling off period of 14 days. Was there a cooling off timescale?

After that time, it is deemed acceptance of the terms.

sourcrates

Different rules apply to online applications, you would have to have electronically signed the agreement to progress the application, it cannot complete otherwise.

Lenders may be fallible, but they are not stupid, if it came to a court case the creditors solicitor would just demonstrate how the app functions to the court and that would be that unfortunately.

WhenIam64

if it came to a court case the creditors solicitor would just demonstrate how the app functions to the court and that would be that unfortunately.

May I politely disagree. What happens in a lower court where there may be a multiplicity of issues being weighed up is not the test.

StevenG13

Hi,



I've just double checked the CCA they've sent and the pre-contract information they initially provided. There are differences in the total amount to be repaid, the date the first payment was to be made, and the amount of the first payment.



I did not sign an electronic version of the document on a computer in their store or via some sort of click through form online.



Yes, the pre-contract information does make mention of a 14 day right to withdraw, but I never signed the CCA so how could I withdraw if I didn't sign the agreement they've shown me? As I say, there are clear differences between the two documents.


I just want to find out if they can enforce an agreement which was never shown to or signed by me and what evidence they would need to provide in order to prove somehow that they did show me that specific agreement.

WhenIam64

I never signed the CCA so how could I withdraw if I didn't sign the agreement they've shown me?

This is the implied agreement

there are clear differences between the two documents.

Are they material? Do they fundamentally change the agreement or can you complain and have an adjustment.

Contact law/lawyers will do its/their utmost to keep the agreement going in some sort of shape or form. (SC comments above on which I had a comment). If contracts could be dismissed on such a simple flaw, we'd all grind to a halt.