Renovating house: Individual trades vs combined - pros & cons?

James_Green_1982

need_an_answer wrote: »

It is perfectly reasonable to fit a renovation around a full time job,you don't need to be there during the day when work is actually carried out,and to be honest if you are you just get in the way!

Its a matter of how you want to use your free time.
I found it very easy to speak with contractors before or after work,or even at weekends...

That's fine as long as things go smoothly.
Like so much in life, it all goes well - until it doesn't.

need_an_answer

James_Green_1982 wrote: »

That's fine as long as things go smoothly.
Like so much in life, it all goes well - until it doesn't.

things running smoothly have little to do with whether you micro manage on site or have a full time job and have input when needed.

...but that's up to the OP to decide the best way forward.

LeoTLion

My experience is that it all starts with finding one good, reliable tradesperson and go from there.

In our case we needed a new bathroom fitted, so we started by looking around for a plumber. What we then found as that he had an electrician and tiler/flooring bloke who in turn used a regular plasterer.

The plumber had been in business to over 25 years and in that time had worked with, or had knowledge of, the vast majority of other local tradespersons and these were the people he trusted to do the job properly.

For me, that knowledge was worth any extra he might have charged me for 'project managing'.

I could have tried to find all of the others myself, and coordinate when they should be onsite and what they would need, but in truth it simply wasn't worth the hassle. Bearing in mind this was just a new bathroom, not a whole house!

As a general rule, good tradepeople work with other good tradespeople because a) it's easier for them and b) it's their reputation that is on the line and that's how they get more work.

What I did do was get cards off all of the different trades so I now have a group of people who I know I can trust do do a decent job and who know I will pay them on time, without any aggro. I've since had both the electrician and the plaster back to do other jobs and it has gone smoothly on every occasion.

The trick is, finding the right person in the first place.

cybervic

Having a single contractor is almost certainly more expansive. We are in similar situation though ours is only a 2bd flat. Full renovation needed, wall removals, rewire, replace cylinder boiler with a combi, new kitchen, new bathroom, new window, decoration and carpet throughout...etc. I went for individual trades because I have experience in project management and felt I rather spend money on appliance/furnitures than paying for someone to do what I can do myself. I went to several short courses (electrical, plumbing, carpentry, plastering) to learn some basics so that I know what the trades persons are taking about and avoid getting rip off.

I heard so many complaints from friends and family about moving into their "newly renovated" place, so I really like the fact that I have control over what's happening at each task (i.e., asking what material/method they use) and able to make sure the each work is done properly before moving on to the next.

The biggest pro for me is that I can get things done properly within my budget. I can worry less about builder or their sub contractors rushing it and do a sub-standard job, or builders trying to save money and attempt some tasks they are not so good at which cause problems in few years time.

HOWEVER, it takes up A LOT of times and efforts, finding the right people for each different trades is a long process, chasing after the quotes and their availabilities can be frustrating, not to mention any communication delay and more headaches when there are complications after walls/units been ripped and open up.

OP should consider how good your DIY/renovation knowledge are? Will you be very involved and learn as you get on? Are you able to understand what each trade is talking about and tell if they are bluffing? Most importantly, are you a perfectionist?

Whichever you decided on, I'd strongly advice you have a clear plan and knows the details of how you want your new home be before contacting builder's or tradespeople. This will gives a more realistic quote/estimates and reduce the risk of potential budget blow up. If possible, live in the house for several month and plan your renovation once you know your place better.

James_Green_1982

cybervic wrote: »

Having a single contractor is almost certainly more expansive. We are in similar situation though ours is only a 2bd flat. Full renovation needed, wall removals, rewire, replace cylinder boiler with a combi, new kitchen, new bathroom, new window, decoration and carpet throughout...etc. I went for individual trades because I have experience in project management and felt I rather spend money on appliance/furnitures than paying for someone to do what I can do myself. I went to several short courses (electrical, plumbing, carpentry, plastering) to learn some basics so that I know what the trades persons are taking about and avoid getting rip off.

I heard so many complaints from friends and family about moving into their "newly renovated" place, so I really like the fact that I have control over what's happening at each task (i.e., asking what material/method they use) and able to make sure the each work is done properly before moving on to the next.

The biggest pro for me is that I can get things done properly within my budget. I can worry less about builder or their sub contractors rushing it and do a sub-standard job, or builders trying to save money and attempt some tasks they are not so good at which cause problems in few years time.

HOWEVER, it takes up A LOT of times and efforts, finding the right people for each different trades is a long process, chasing after the quotes and their availabilities can be frustrating, not to mention any communication delay and more headaches when there are complications after walls/units been ripped and open up.

OP should consider how good your DIY/renovation knowledge are? Will you be very involved and learn as you get on? Are you able to understand what each trade is talking about and tell if they are bluffing? Most importantly, are you a perfectionist?

Whichever you decided on, I'd strongly advice you have a clear plan and knows the details of how you want your new home be before contacting builder's or tradespeople. This will gives a more realistic quote/estimates and reduce the risk of potential budget blow up. If possible, live in the house for several month and plan your renovation once you know your place better.

Personally, the only reason I would have any work done on my house is because I want it done. You'll probably only lose money if you try and do a renovation for profit.

cybervic

jwl83 wrote: »

1) Convert integral garage into extra bedroom (garage already has an internal door to the rest of the house and has electrics and lighting) [ballpark £10k - if we can't fit all the jobs in our budget, we'll drop this job from the renovation]
2) Combine several small rooms on the ground floor (utility room / water cylinder cupboard / toilet / box room), demolishing non load-bearing walls to make an extra reception room with french windows onto the garden [ballpark £4k]
3) Rewire the house, replacing the 1960s fuse box (and moving out of the garage) and installing extra power points (2 new double-points per room in each of 3 beds / 2 receptions / kitchen)[ballpark £4k]
4) Replace hot air ducted heating with standard combi-boiler and radiators [ballpark £5k]
5) Replace bathroom (toilet, sink, bath+shower, flooring, tiling) [ballpark £4k]
6) Replace kitchen [ballpark £6k]
7) Replace carpets downstairs with wood floors [ballpark £2k]
8) Replace carpets upstairs with new carpet [ballpark £1k]
9) Repainting (3 beds / 2 receptions / kitchen) [ballpark £1k]

The ballparks are just that - very rough estimates for now.

Your Bathroom, Kitchen, Painting & Flooring budget are on the lower side and most likely will go up by 20%-50% depending on what level of appliance you go for. You also did not include any plastering, doors, lightings which can cost several thousands too.

datlex

cybervic wrote: »

Your Bathroom, Kitchen, Painting & Flooring budget are on the lower side and most likely will go up by 20%-50% depending on what level of appliance you go for. You also did not include any plastering, doors, lightings which can cost several thousands too.

I was actually thinking the opposite re the painting if OP does it themselves. Decorating is not expensive.

markin

datlex wrote: »

I was actually thinking the opposite re the painting if OP does it themselves. Decorating is not expensive.

Some people seem to be destined to office jobs and would do a terrible job even painting.


Some of the prices listed don't seem to be London/south prices, i would say your looking at around 45K if you select each trade, and if you use a company a lot, lot more.

knightstyle

We did a house build using individual tradespeople. Takes a lot of time and effort but well worth it.
Friends used a single contractor for an agreed price, who then used the cheapest contractors he could find. Shoddy work and delays everywhere.

cattie

You won't get a whole house decorated for £1k, so you do need to be prepared for the budget to be much higher than your ballpark figures.

When I moved into my '60's flat I had different trades to do the refurbishment. Replacing the ch system, new kitchen including tiling & plastering & fitting of all appliances & update of consumer unit done by one lot. Then new bathroom including tiling & lots of joinery/carpentry & other work done in various rooms by a skilled sole trader I've used in the past & finally redecoration of the whole place, which was done by relative of somebody I know.

I preferred the work being broken down into 3 as once kitchen was done it gave me a few weeks breathing space before the bathroom & other work was to be done.

The redecoration seemed to drag on for ages as the person was only here part time as had other work to see to & I'd not have used them had I known this from the outset.

What I liked about using different people was that I was paying for materials at cost price rather than there being a mark up by contractors.