Staff outing - only ladies invited

System

phillw wrote: »

If we accept that men and women are inherently equal and the only thing stopping women from succeeding is society then higher male suicide has to be how society treats men. That has far reaching consequences though, because that also means that the reason more men are in prison is because of how society treats those men.

Discriminating against men for traits they have that women don't, when you can't legally discriminate against women for the same reason is one of those things that society does.

Men and women are not equal. Not even close. We are so different. We're are complimentary though of course and should be treated equally.



It's not just society that has an affect on men's actions. There are more men in prison because we have high aggression compared to women. Actually, more women attempt suicide than men, it's just as men, we have more aggression and tend to complete the act, whereas women attempt and fail generally.


There currently is huge issue with men and masculinity at the moment. Government agencies are openly discussing masculine traits as being toxic...it's sad...but the tide will hopefully turn and return to centre with a bit of luck. It started with creation of the manosphere and recently manifested itself as the HuffPost journalists getting the sack.

pinkshoes

Comms69 wrote: »

Perhaps if they need special attention to achieve what others are capable of doing without it, then this subject isn't the one for them?

Compulsory subject unfortunately!

(But yes, they would love to drop it if they could... As they can't drop it, I am therefore going to do whatever I can to help them.)

pinkshoes

ArcticRoll wrote: »

Are you honestly saying that none of those who are struggling in your class are boys? It would be quite an extraordinarily neat gender divide.

Of my class of 32, I have 15 girls of which 8 struggle. 4 of these girls will NOT attend the general revision class.

Out of the 17 boys, I'd say 2 struggle. Both attend the other revision class.

This pattern is replicated across the other 9 classes in the year group.

I am very anti gender discrimination, but given the statistical difference I need to do something!

Les79

pinkshoes wrote: »

Of my class of 32, I have 15 girls of which 8 struggle. 4 of these girls will NOT attend the general revision class.

Out of the 17 boys, I'd say 2 struggle. Both attend the other revision class.

This pattern is replicated across the other 9 classes in the year group.

I am very anti gender discrimination, but given the statistical difference I need to do something!

Define "struggle" though....


Because, as a male who has been in the teaching profession briefly, I can assure you that boys will "struggle" too but in different ways.


In fact, EVERYONE struggles at some point (except for the top of the top). The word "struggle" is so subjective....


I just want to know your METRIC is here, because your data is so statistically significant that I dare say that something is being ballsed up at your school by the STAFF! It is pure incompetence getting to the point where ~50% of the female students are "struggling" across ALL 10 classes, whereas only ~ 11% of boys ("I'd say") are "struggling".


Farcical. Plucking stuff out of your bum "I'd say" (I keep quoting that because I did chuckle when you were SO assured about 8 girls struggling, but seemed to have some doubt as to how many boys were struggling in your class!).


EDIT: Either that, or you buy into the concept that girls are inherently weaker than boys at certain subjects? It would be pretty harsh to blame the behaviour of some boys for the whole thing as well (particularly as they are still developing/learning about the world; and, actually, a lot of boys of school age have their own insecurities and flaws and desires etc; the world doesn't revolve around any specific gender!)).


Second EDIT: I'm sorry about the blunt reply. I actually do respect you for what you do. Not really fair taking it out on teachers who are making every effort to make a difference in children's lives. But I am a firm believer of challenging those in education and their views etc. I think the whole of education is overstretched and it can cause complacency in teachers.

miriamac

Perhaps someone who is currently teaching is better placed to judge pupils' needs - especially their own pupils' needs - than someone who did the job 'briefly ' at some point in the past.

Les79

miriamac wrote: »

Perhaps someone who is currently teaching is better placed to judge pupils' needs - especially their own pupils' needs - than someone who did the job 'briefly ' at some point in the past.

This is the sort of attitude which grated on me during my course


I recall sitting with my "mentor" who was like pushing 60 years old. Nice person like if you strip away the baggage, but they didn't give a flying monkeys about any of their students. I recall some poor year 7 student who had a sight impairment, and verbally asked for worksheets to be printed on non-white paper. Guess who couldn't give a monkeys VS who made an effort? And guess who got sarcastic comments in the post-lesson meeting with their "mentor" for doing it?


I entered teaching with the best of intentions you know... A bit too naïve in respect of how the world works (and getting bullied didn't help; I have NEVER, not even as a kid, been bullied in the sort of manner than I was on my PGCE course with "colleagues". If I was a woman I'd be doing the #MeToo stuff but I've got to wait until that wave of outrage hits society before I speak up).


But I can still criticise Do you have kids? If so, I'm fairly confident that you criticise the school/teachers in respect of your child and that you want the best "value for money" from the school. Hopefully you don't have a boy in pinkshoes' classroom as it may be a case that they aren't sure if your child is struggling or not.

ViolaLass

andydownes123 wrote: »

Men and women are not equal. Not even close. We are so different. We're are complimentary though of course and should be treated equally.



It's not just society that has an affect on men's actions. There are more men in prison because we have high aggression compared to women. Actually, more women attempt suicide than men, it's just as men, we have more aggression and tend to complete the act, whereas women attempt and fail generally.


There currently is huge issue with men and masculinity at the moment. Government agencies are openly discussing masculine traits as being toxic...it's sad...but the tide will hopefully turn and return to centre with a bit of luck. It started with creation of the manosphere and recently manifested itself as the HuffPost journalists getting the sack.

People are different, men and women are equal in many ways (sure, the fastest marathon might have been run by a man but that's hardly an average person, is it? There's a huge overlap most of the time).

Men are socialised to 'have more aggression' i.e. to show their emotions that way.

And no, it's not masculine traits that are being labelled toxic. It's some traits being labelled as 'toxic masculinity' which is not the same thing. These traits are not bad because they are stereotypically male, they are bad in the first place and also stereotypically male.

Boys being taught that the only acceptable emotion to express is aggression is an example of toxic masculinity.

Dean000000

ViolaLass wrote: »

Men are socialised to 'have more aggression' i.e. to show their emotions that way.

And no, it's not masculine traits that are being labelled toxic. It's some traits being labelled as 'toxic masculinity' which is not the same thing. These traits are not bad because they are stereotypically male, they are bad in the first place and also stereotypically male.

Boys being taught that the only acceptable emotion to express is aggression is an example of toxic masculinity.

Oh is it really?

I’m gonna invent toxic femininity

You know, like women that refuse to even entertain the idea of learning how to change a car tyre..... ‘ya know, stereotypically’....

Works both ways tutts

miriamac

Les79 wrote: »

This is the sort of attitude which grated on me during my course


I recall sitting with my "mentor" who was like pushing 60 years old. Nice person like if you strip away the baggage, but they didn't give a flying monkeys about any of their students. I recall some poor year 7 student who had a sight impairment, and verbally asked for worksheets to be printed on non-white paper. Guess who couldn't give a monkeys VS who made an effort? And guess who got sarcastic comments in the post-lesson meeting with their "mentor" for doing it?


I entered teaching with the best of intentions you know... A bit too naïve in respect of how the world works (and getting bullied didn't help; I have NEVER, not even as a kid, been bullied in the sort of manner than I was on my PGCE course with "colleagues". If I was a woman I'd be doing the #MeToo stuff but I've got to wait until that wave of outrage hits society before I speak up).


But I can still criticise Do you have kids? If so, I'm fairly confident that you criticise the school/teachers in respect of your child and that you want the best "value for money" from the school. Hopefully you don't have a boy in pinkshoes' classroom as it may be a case that they aren't sure if your child is struggling or not.

Based on the way pinkshoes has posted, I think she has a good grasp of which pupils need extra help; which pupils are already receiving that extra help through standard revision classes; and which pupils need a different approach. I'd be delighted if a child of mine, of whatever gender, was in her classroom.

Based on the way you have posted, I am very thankful that no child at all is in a classroom where you are teacher.

ViolaLass

Dean000000 wrote: »

Oh is it really? Yes, it is. Teach men to repress any other emotion and you are doing them a disservice. Women are not taught this.

I’m gonna invent toxic femininity Be my guest. I have invented nothing here.

You know, like women that refuse to even entertain the idea of learning how to change a car tyre..... ‘ya know, stereotypically’....Do women stereotypically refuse to learn this skill? I agree that it would be a useful one to pick up. I would agree, for example, that women being taught that their appearance matters over anything they have to say is not good - but that wouldn't erase the existence of toxic masculinity

Works both ways tutts

No need to call me 'toots'. I'm not your inferior.

You sound rather cross.