Help with ticket from APCOA Birmingham Airport Drop off

nikkietoni

Help please!

Help please! work colleagues were being dropped off at Birmingham Airport. At the drop off point the bags were removed from out of the boot of the car for two passengers.
A third passenger felt unwell so got out of the car and proceeded to vomit.. being car sick. He walked away from the car while the unloading of the cases was being carried out. aware it was a few minutes for drop off the car was driven quickly to collect the poorly passenger. The sickly passenger can be seen getting back into the car in one of the photos sent by Apcoa.
The car may have been outside the designated area as it says it is so on the parking charge notice sent to the keeper.
says the car was apparently there for seconds.
Charging £100.

Redx

forget about what happened on the day, this will be won on a technicality, when APCOA chuck the towel in later down the line


read the NEWBIES thread and get the RK to send the blue text template and appeal as KEEPER to apcoa, no blabbing about who was driving (ever)


when they reject it , read any recent APCOA airport appeal for BHX in similar circumstances re stopping , copy their popla appeal and adapt it to suit , then save as a pdf and submit to popla by choosing OTHER and attaching the appeal pdf


so 2 easy steps and apcoa will telll popla they are not contesting the appeal


couldnt be simpler

nikkietoni

Thankyou will do that

Umkomaas

There is misleading detail in the NtK - the charge is for dropping off/picking up, yet later in the NtK they state that you entered a contract 'to park'. Read their penultimate paragraph in the main block of text 'It is APCOA's legitimate interest .......'

So I would now involve the DVLA and ask them on what basis APCOA obtained your data. It will be interesting, and potentially to your advantage to know.

You should email the DVLA and ask which organisation (and for what reason) accessed the registered keeper's data from them between a short range of dates which includes the date of the parking incident. You need to provide the registered keeper's full name and address, the address on the V5C logbook and the Vehicle Registration Mark of the vehicle involved in the parking incident.

SubjectAccess.Requests@dvla.gov.uk

This service is free of charge.

Even though you email your request, the DVLA will respond via Royal Mail.

Coupon-mad

Long and the short of it, though, is NOT TO IMPLY WHO WAS DRIVING.

Search the forum for APCOA Airport and you will see we never lose these at POPLA.

nikkietoni

Appealed to Apcoa who sent this reply
PARKING CHARGE NOTICE NUMBER: VEHICLE REGISTRATION:
POPLA Verification Number:
Thank you for your appeal received February 2019 against the above Parking Charge Notice. Having carefully considered the evidence provided by you, we must advise your appeal has been unsuccessful on this occasion.
Your vehicle was observed stopped on a red route; red routes are in operation around the airport site in order to maintain the safety of our passengers, visitors and staff. Drivers are prohibited to stop, unload or park on the red routes or zig zag lines, which are clearly marked around the airport roads via signage and double red road markings. A vehicle monitoring and enforcement operation is in place, with an enforcement charge of £100. Please note nobody is allowed to enter/exit the vehicle in any circumstance on the airport roads or red route.
All the enforcement is carried out according to British parking association (BPA) guidelines and APCOA being an approved operator of BPA is authorized to manage and enforce the property on behalf of Birmingham International Airport. Any vehicles in contravention of the T&C of the Birmingham International Airport are sent out to DVLA for registered owner’s information under BPA guidelines.
Please note as the registered keeper of this vehicle, you are liable for this ticket, unless details of the driver are provided.
The Grace Period is not applicable as the person was not in a car park but was on a road way that is regulated under the Airport’s Byelaws which clearly state that Birmingham 5(2); 5(3) &/or 5(4)) vehicles should not be parked on roadways that are on the Airport Land. The driver entered onto private land freely and in full acceptance of the terms of parking clearly displayed. Terms and conditions are offered; and by remaining onsite, these are accepted.
As your vehicle was parked in contravention of the terms and conditions of the site we are satisfied that the notice was correctly issued in accordance with the BPA code of practice, and therefore not able to waiver the charge on this occasion.
Therefore you now have a number of options:
Pay the Parking Charge Notice at the discounted price of £50 within 14 days. Please note that after this time the Parking Charge Notice will increase to £100.
How to pay
Online at https://pcnpayments.apcoa.co.uk
Or send a Cheque or Postal Order made payable to APCOA Parking (UK) Ltd to: APCOA PARKING,
You have now reached the end of our internal appeals procedure. You now have the option to make an appeal to POPLA - The Independant Appeals Service. You can do this within 28 days of this letter by completing the online appeal form at https://www.popla.co.uk quoting the verification reference number Please be advised that if you opt for independent arbitration of your case, the Parking Charge Notice will be considered at the full amount of £100. If you require a hard copy of the POPLA form please contact our customer service centre on 0345 301 1151 where one of our customer service agents will be happy to assist you.
By law we are also required to inform you that Ombudsman Services (https://www.ombudsman-services.org/) provides an alternative dispute resolution service that would be competent to deal with your appeal.
However, we have not chosen to
participate in their alternative dispute resolution service. As such should you wish to appeal then you must do so to POPLA, as explained above.
If you choose to do nothing, we will seek to recover the monies owed to us via our debt recovery procedures and may proceed with Court action against you.
Yours Faithfully
Appeals Department APCOA Parking (UK) Ltd

So I have looked at some Birmingham Airpory appeals but am not really understanding about byelaws etc
And airport land and cannot seem to find anything as evidence to attach to the appeal. Please help thankyou

Umkomaas

Paragraphing please, make this readable.

Redx

so now you have a popla code , read post #2 again and draft your popla appeal, based on a previous winning BHX popla appeal

nikkietoni

I Appealed to Apcoa who sent this reply
PARKING CHARGE NOTICE NUMBER: VEHICLE REGISTRATION:
POPLA Verification Number:

Thank you for your appeal received February 2019 against the above Parking Charge Notice. Having carefully considered the evidence provided by you, we must advise your appeal has been unsuccessful on this occasion.

Your vehicle was observed stopped on a red route; red routes are in operation around the airport site in order to maintain the safety of our passengers, visitors and staff.

Drivers are prohibited to stop, unload or park on the red routes or zig zag lines, which are clearly marked around the airport roads via signage and double red road markings.

A vehicle monitoring and enforcement operation is in place, with an enforcement charge of £100.

Please note nobody is allowed to enter/exit the vehicle in any circumstance on the airport roads or red route.
All the enforcement is carried out according to British parking association (BPA) guidelines and APCOA being an approved operator of BPA is authorized to manage and enforce the property on behalf of Birmingham International Airport.

Any vehicles in contravention of the T&C of the Birmingham International Airport are sent out to DVLA for registered owner’s information under BPA guidelines.

Please note as the registered keeper of this vehicle, you are liable for this ticket, unless details of the driver are provided.
The Grace Period is not applicable as the person was not in a car park but was on a road way that is regulated under the Airport’s Byelaws which clearly state that Birmingham 5(2); 5(3) &/or 5(4)) vehicles should not be parked on roadways that are on the Airport Land.

The driver entered onto private land freely and in full acceptance of the terms of parking clearly displayed. Terms and conditions are offered; and by remaining onsite, these are accepted.

As your vehicle was parked in contravention of the terms and conditions of the site we are satisfied that the notice was correctly issued in accordance with the BPA code of practice, and therefore not able to waiver the charge on this occasion.

Therefore you now have a number of options:
Pay the Parking Charge Notice at the discounted price of £50 within 14 days. Please note that after this time the Parking Charge Notice will increase to £100.

How to pay
Online at https://pcnpayments.apcoa.co.uk
Or send a Cheque or Postal Order made payable to APCOA Parking (UK) Ltd to: APCOA PARKING,
You have now reached the end of our internal appeals procedure. You now have the option to make an appeal to POPLA - The Independant Appeals Service. You can do this within 28 days of this letter by completing the online appeal form at https://www.popla.co.uk quoting the verification reference number

Please be advised that if you opt for independent arbitration of your case, the Parking Charge Notice will be considered at the full amount of £100. If you require a hard copy of the POPLA form please contact our customer service centre on 0345 301 1151 where one of our customer service agents will be happy to assist you.

By law we are also required to inform you that Ombudsman Services (https://www.ombudsman-services.org/) provides an alternative dispute resolution service that would be competent to deal with your appeal.
However, we have not chosen to
participate in their alternative dispute resolution service. As such should you wish to appeal then you must do so to POPLA, as explained above.
If you choose to do nothing, we will seek to recover the monies owed to us via our debt recovery procedures and may proceed with Court action against you.
Yours Faithfully
Appeals Department APCOA Parking (UK) Ltd

So I have looked at some Birmingham Airport appeals but am not really understanding about byelaws etc
And airport land and cannot seem to find anything as evidence to attach to the appeal. Please help thankyou

Redx

nobody cares if you dont understand bylaws

just do as I said and either find a perfect match that describes what happened on the day for your vehicle as well, OR copy and paste the nearest BHX version posted in the last 12 months and then alter any description about "what happened" so it describes any circumstances or places for your vehicle and not the one you have pasted from (could be a slightly different location or issue or whatever)

most of the appeal you use will be used verbatim, no changes required apart from the obvious

then post it below and highlight any changes so they can be checked

dont ask any more questions or reply UNTIL your reply is your draft popla appeal

I can assure you that you wont be able to write it from scratch, so copy , paste , adapt and post is your only suitable option

so dont ask , just DO !

for example , you can use this one as there is little or nothing to change, but check it anyway for any obvious errors (but I dont think there are any differences as it was a drop off area too , so not a hotel or anything else)

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/5909409/apcoa-bhx

swap 1) and 2) round so the POFA issue in 2) becomes point 1), swap in the menu and also in the appeal itself

add your name , address , VRM details and popla reference to it , save as a pdf , and upload it to the POPLA website tiny bin icon after choosing OTHER in the popla options

take you 10 minutes max (and we still dont care if you dont understand it)

nikkietoni

Needs tweaking quite a lot but hope this is on the tight lines thanks
A notice to Keeper was received by myself the registered keeper for an alleged contravention of the breach and terms and conditions of use at Birmingham Airport, Please consider my appeal for the following reasons


1) Not relevant Land under POFA 2012; no registered keeper liability (ref POPLA case Steve Macallan 6062356150)
and Airport Act 1986
2)Non compliance with requirements and timetable set out in Schedule 4 of POFA 2012
3)The operator has not shown that the keeper is in fact the driver who was liable for the charge. (ref POPLA case Carly Law 6061796103)
4) No landowner contract nor legal standing to form contracts or charge drivers
5) Photo evidence appears falsified

6)Amount demanded is a penalty

7)Misleading and unclear signage

8)No grace period given (Clause 13 BPA Code of Practice)

9)The Notice to Keeper does not comply with sub paragraph 9(2&5) of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012

1) Airport land is not 'relevant land' as it is covered by statutory bylaws and so is specifically excluded from 'keeper liability' under Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012. As I am the registered keeper I am not legally liable as this Act does not apply on this land. I put the Operator to strict proof so if they disagree with this point it would require them to show evidence including documentary proof from the Airport Authority that this land is not covered by bylaws.
POPLA assessor Steve Macallan 6062356150 September 2016 found that all land under statutory control cannot be considered ‘relevant land’ for the purposes of POFA 2012.
As the site is not located on "relevant land" the operator is unable to rely on POFA 2012 in order to transfer liability to the hirer./keeper
Airport byelaws do not apply to any road to which the public have access, as they are subject to road traffic enactments.

Airport Act 1986
65 Control of road traffic at designated airports
(1) Subject to the provisions of this section, the road traffic enactments shall apply in relation to roads which are within a designated airport but to which the public does not have access as they apply in relation to roads to which the public has access.

Both the Airport Act and Airport byelaws say that byelaws only apply to roads to which road traffic enactments do not apply


3) If APCOA want to make use of the Keeper Liability provisions in Schedule 4 of POFA 2012 and APCOA have not issued and delivered a parking charge notice to the driver in the place where the parking event took place, the Notice to Keeper must meet the strict requirements and timetable set out in the Schedule (in particular paragraph 9). I have had no evidence that APCOA have complied with these BPA Code requirements for the PCN issued so require them to evidence their compliance to POPLA.

The BPA code of practice also says 20.14 “when you serve a Notice to Keeper, you must also include information telling the keeper the ‘reasonable cause’ you had for asking the DVLA for their details.“' The PCN does not provide this information; this does not comply with the BPA code point 20.14.


4) In cases with a keeper appellant, yet no POFA 'keeper liability' to rely upon, POPLA must first consider whether they are confident that the Assessor knows who the driver is, based on the evidence received. No presumption can be made about liability whatsoever. A vehicle can be driven by any person (with the consent of the owner) as long as the driver is insured. There is no dispute that the driver was entitled to drive the car and I can confirm that they were, but I am exercising my right not to name that person.

Where a charge is aimed only at a driver then, of course, no other party can be told to pay. I am the appellant , and as there has been no admission regarding who was driving, and no evidence has been produced, it has been held by POPLA on numerous occasions, that a parking charge cannot be enforced against a keeper without a valid Notice to Keeper. As the keeper of the vehicle, it is my right to choose not to name the driver, yet still not be lawfully held liable if an operator is not using or complying with Schedule 4. This applies regardless of when the first appeal was made because the fact remains I am only the keeper and Schedule 4 of the POFA (or evidence of who was driving) can cause a keeper appellant to be deemed to be the liable party.
The burden of proof rests with the Operator, because they cannot use the POFA in this case, to show that I have not complied with terms in place on the land and show that I am personally liable for their parking charge.

The circumstance of full compliance with POFA 2012 was confirmed by parking law expert barrister, Henry Greenslade, the previous POPLA Lead Adjudicator, in 2015:
Understanding keeper liability - “There appears to be continuing misunderstanding about Schedule 4. Provided certain conditions are strictly complied with, it provides for recovery of unpaid parking charges from the keeper of the vehicle. There is no ‘reasonable presumption’ in law that the registered keeper of a vehicle is the driver. Operators should never suggest anything of the sort. Further, a failure by the recipient of a notice issued under Schedule 4 to name the driver, does not of itself mean that the recipient has accepted that they were the driver at the material time. Unlike, for example, a Notice of Intended Prosecution where details of the driver of a vehicle must be supplied when requested by the police, pursuant to Section 172 of the Road Traffic Act 1988, a keeper sent a Schedule 4 notice has no legal obligation to name the driver. ] If {POFA 2012 Schedule 4 is} not complied with then keeper liability does not generally pass."

So no lawful right exists to pursue unpaid parking charges from me as keeper of the vehicle, where an operator is NOT attempting to transfer the liability for the charge using the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012.

This exact finding was made in 6061796103 against ParkingEye in September 2016, where POPLA Assessor Carly Law found:
"I note the operator advises that it is not attempting to transfer the liability for the charge using the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 and so in mind, the operator continues to hold the driver responsible. As such, I must first consider whether I am confident that I know who the driver is, based on the evidence received. After considering the evidence, I am unable to confirm that the appellant is in fact the driver. As such, I must allow the appeal on the basis that the operator has failed to demonstrate that the appellant is the driver and therefore liable for the charge. As I am allowing the appeal on this basis, I do not need to consider the other grounds of appeal raised by the appellant. Accordingly, I must allow this appeal."

The same conclusion was reached by POPLA Assessor Steve Macallan, quoted in appeal point 4 above.


5) I do not believe that the Operator has demonstrated a proprietary interest in the land, because they have no legal possession which would give APCOA Parking Ltd any right to offer parking spaces, or a contract with third party customers of the lawful owner/occupiers. In addition, APCOA Parking lack of title in this land means they have no legal standing to allege trespass or loss, if that is the basis of their charge. I require APCOA Parking Ltd to demonstrate their legal ownership of the land to POPLA.
I contend that APCOA Parking Ltd is only an agent working for the owner and their signs do not help them to form a contract without any consideration capable of being offered. Parking Ltd to levy these charges and therefore it has no authority to issue parking charge notices (PCNs). I require that APCOA Parking Ltd produce a copy of their contract with the owner/occupier and that the POPLA adjudicator scrutinizes it. Even if a basic contract is produced and mentions PCNs, the lack of ownership or assignment of title or interest in the land reduces any contract to one that exists simply on an agency basis between APCOA Parking Ltd and the owner/occupier, containing nothing that APCOA Parking Ltd can lawfully use in their own name as a mere agent, that could impact on a third party customer.


6) I would question the authenticity of the photos of the vehicle and time stamps and

location. he details are added as black box shapes on top of the photos in the right hand corners. Photo editing can be used to add these boxes and text.

By close examination of the photographs, the details (time, location, direction) are added as a black overlay box on-top of the photos in the upper right hand corner. It is well within the realms of possibility for even an amateur to use free photo-editing software to add these black boxes and text with authentic looking Meta data. Not only is this possible, but this practice has even been in use by UKPC, for faking time stamps on tickets it has emerged (Independent.co.uk 27/04/2018)

l challenge APCOA to prove that a stationary, highly advanced camera was used to generate these photos (including viewing direction, camera location etc.). I would also challenge APCOA that they possess the technology to generate these precise types of coordinates, as they have been applied to the photo in such an

amateurish way (there are much more sophisticated ways of hardcoding photo data).

7) The amount

demanded is a penalty and is punitive and contravenes the Consumer Rights Act 2015.The Parking Eye and Beavis case was characterised by clear and ample signage where the motorist had time to read and consider and also decide whether to accept or not. this case signage is neither clear nor ample and the motorist has not time to read the signage or consider it as the charge was applied instantly the vehicle stopped. Therefore the signage cannot be read safely

from a moving vehicle,

8)The alleged contravention according to APCOA is in" breach of the terms and conditions of use of the Airport Road infrastructure and signs are clearly displayed" It would appear that signs at this location do not comply with road traffic regulations or their permitted variations and as such are misleading as they are unable to be seen by the driver and could not be read without stopping and so do not comply with BPA code of practice .APCOA are required to show evidence to the contrary. In particular the No Stopping Zones section of the Chief Adjudicator's first annual report 2013 states "It is therefore very important that any prohibition is clearly marked bearing in mind that such signage has to be positioned and be of such size as to be read by a motorist without having to stop to look and read the signs .Signs which are on the red routes unlike the ones indicating most parking restrictions are usually positioned to face the oncoming traffic rather than parallel to it.

9) No grace period given ..Clause 13 BPA Code of Practice as section 13 states "you should allow the driver a reasonable grace period in which to decide if the person is going to stay or go. If the driver is on your land without permission you should still allow them a grace time to read your signs and leave before you enforce action.

.So if a driver stops for a short period of time to read a sign they must have the opportunity to leave and not accept the terms of an alleged contract A few seconds I would say does not breach a fair grace period and therefore APCOA is in breach of the code.


I therefore request that POPLA uphold my appeal and cancel this PCN.