Uni tuition fees termination of employment

JayRod

Hello,



My employer pays for my UNI course, it is a degree. Annual cost is 4.7k, I'm on second year, so the cost up to today is 9.2k
I have a training agreement stating that if i will leave before 1 year after completion the course i have to repay 100%, after that 50% before 2 years after completion, and nothing after 2 years.

Now. The course is 4 years long. Does that mean that if i will leave any time during six! years from starting the course i will have to repay 100% of total cost which is increasing in time, 4.7k every year?

Or maybe each year should be treated separatelly, and i have to repay for year 1 only for up to 2 years of year 1 completion and so on?



The thing is I am hugely underpaid. Comparing my salary to my colleagues at uni.

I could easily find a job with 20-25% higher salary plus obviously new employer would pay tuition fees as well.

I requested pay rise from current employer to no avail.

They think they own me because of that training agreement. Do they?



What happens if they will suck me, because I start to do bad at work?

Do i still have to rapay the cost if it is their decision to let me go for whatever reasons?



Am I a slave?

bugslett

Are you underpaid in comparison with other people who are having their degree paid for, or are you underpaid compared with people who paid for their own degree?

JayRod

Yes.

Im conparing myself to other part timers with full time job whose tuition fees are sponsored by employet.

Also same industry on same position with similat duties.

Comms69

JayRod wrote: »

Hello,



My employer pays for my UNI course, it is a degree. Annual cost is 4.7k, I'm on second year, so the cost up to today is 9.2k
I have a training agreement stating that if i will leave before 1 year after completion the course i have to repay 100%, after that 50% before 2 years after completion, and nothing after 2 years.

Now. The course is 4 years long. Does that mean that if i will leave any time during six! years from starting the course i will have to repay 100% of total cost which is increasing in time, 4.7k every year? - yes, obviously.

Or maybe each year should be treated separatelly, and i have to repay for year 1 only for up to 2 years of year 1 completion and so on? - clearly not



The thing is I am hugely underpaid. Comparing my salary to my colleagues at uni. - you aren't underpaid. You voluntarily agreed your salary and benefits (including the 5k a year to get you a degree)

I could easily find a job with 20-25% higher salary plus obviously new employer would pay tuition fees as well. - Go for it. You'll find most employers will get a reference, that reference will say you left partway through a course. No-one will be paying it for you a second time

I requested pay rise from current employer to no avail. - Not surprising really

They think they own me because of that training agreement. Do they? - nope. You are free to leave (and pay the money owed)



What happens if they will suck me, because I start to do bad at work? - I suspect they'll take you to court for the money paid

Do i still have to rapay the cost if it is their decision to let me go for whatever reasons?

- depends I suspect on your contract and the circumstances of your dismissal

Am I a slave?

No. You are not a slave, you are quite ignorant though...

spadoosh

If they dismiss you they will be doing so presumably on the grounds of you being incapable of doing the job or gross misconduct. The agreement will still stand.

The way it reads is that you will have to repay 100% of the course fees if you leave within 1 year of completing the course. So not 6 years but 5.

They dont own you. No.

Youre not a slave either.

They have invested heavily in you and are wanting to protect their investment.

Presumably if you can leave and get paid 20-25% more this will more than cover the cost of repaying any money owed? That is assuming that for whatever reason the company youre moving to who apparently offer training paid dont actually pay for the training youre getting.

gettingtheresometime

Did you sign an agreement for the whole course or do you sign a new agreement for each year?

JayRod

thank for reply, but.


I am underpaid, and just bacause you have skewed thinking that if an agreement is signed all is fair.


By your understansding employer can give no payrise for 5 years because of the cost of trainign.


Other businesses in the same industry on same positions, same curcumstances pay 25% more. It is obvious I am underpaid. And I have actually an offer of 25% more from other company + paying my tuition fees (also with trainign agreement with similar terms)


And I am not ignorant.
At the start of the course noone would pay me more, but it is standard the companies in my industry review the salary year after year, after all, you gain experience, you became better, and you learn while doing the course constantly omproving your abilities.


I signed one trainign agreement, not new one every year.




Actually I am now responsible for a lot more and do a lot more then at the beginnign and these duties are not mentioned in my contracts. So I presume I can just stop doing them

Comms69

JayRod wrote: »

thank for reply, but.


I am underpaid - no you are not , and just bacause you have skewed thinking that if an agreement is signed all is fair. - did someone hold a gun to your head? No, you entered into a voluntary agreement. Time to grow up and act like a responsible adult.


By your understansding employer can give no payrise for 5 years because of the cost of trainign. - Absolutely, there is no legal reason for a payrise; except if not doing so would mean paying below the NMW.


Other businesses in the same industry on same positions, same curcumstances pay 25% more. - then you should've gone to them in the first place! It is obvious I am underpaid. And I have actually an offer of 25% more from other company + paying my tuition fees (also with trainign agreement with similar terms) - excellent, off you pop. Make sure you pay the £9.4k on your way out.


And I am not ignorant. - yes you are. On many things.
At the start of the course noone would pay me more, but it is standard the companies in my industry review the salary year after year, after all, you gain experience, you became better, and you learn while doing the course constantly omproving your abilities. - Did you negotiate that in your contract? No?


I signed one trainign agreement, not new one every year. - Irrelevant




Actually I am now responsible for a lot more and do a lot more then at the beginnign and these duties are not mentioned in my contracts. So I presume I can just stop doing them

Nope, you cannot. You have started doing them and they now form part of your agreed work.

spadoosh

JayRod wrote: »

thank for reply, but.


I am underpaid, and just bacause you have skewed thinking that if an agreement is signed all is fair.


By your understansding employer can give no payrise for 5 years because of the cost of trainign.


Other businesses in the same industry on same positions, same curcumstances pay 25% more. It is obvious I am underpaid. And I have actually an offer of 25% more from other company + paying my tuition fees (also with trainign agreement with similar terms)


And I am not ignorant.
At the start of the course noone would pay me more, but it is standard the companies in my industry review the salary year after year, after all, you gain experience, you became better, and you learn while doing the course constantly omproving your abilities.


I signed one trainign agreement, not new one every year.




Actually I am now responsible for a lot more and do a lot more then at the beginnign and these duties are not mentioned in my contracts. So I presume I can just stop doing them

Why have you even posted this? The obvious answer is to just take the other job that will pay you more and pay your training fees, no?

No matter what happens you are not going to force your current employer to pay you more and you will be liable to the agreements that you signed. That is the legal position. You might be able to convince them to pay you more, you might be able to convince them to waive the course fees. They dont have to though.

bugslett

I am an employer and we have a reducing training cost repayment clause in the Contract of Employment. It's different to your scenario in that these are simple courses over in a week, so if they were to leave within 6 months, 100% of costs, 2 years 50% etc. Qualifications last 5 years.

What isn't different is that they have voluntarily signed the contract that says they will repay the money. We don't re-issue the contracts every year, and their agreement stands from year to year. If they don't like what is a pretty standard term in many business contracts of employment, they don't have to sign it.

You were aware of the salary, you were aware of the training costs clause and could have sought clarification of any point before you signed.

Whilst it may be annoying to have to repay, it's also annoying for an employer to shell out for no benefit.

Les79

I don't want to quote you directly, because you seem like an overthinker (lots of info with not so much substance), but my thoughts are:


- A lot of the questions posed here should have been asked BEFORE UNDERTAKING THE TRAINING 2 YEARS AGO. That includes things like the specific repayment arrangements if you leave early, the going rate for people in your position (and why you are being underpaid) and the policy on wage increases year on year.


- Negotiate the contractual terms, particularly if there is an abundance of work available


- Though I suspect that you were initially a newbie and you took this job/signed the contract based on the fact that you had little experience and, whilst the other companies will NOW take you on because you have experience, it was difficult back then to find other options.




But anyway, you are not a "slave" here. Your remuneration is VERY GENEROUS compared to a slave in that YOU GET MONEY! You also have the option of finding another job if you so wish and you can also explore repayment options with the employer. Your freedom will not be restricted through lack of payment of a debt, nor will your assets be taken by force (unless it goes up to CCJ level and then the bailiffs etc).