How to spot a dodgy leasehold?

SmashedAvacado

peddles wrote: »

Thank you. That's more helpful. I was kind of hoping to hear "watch out for this lousy clause in a lot of dodgy leases"
But if that's not the case - I'll just do my best to read through the whole thing and ask a million questions to the solicitor

you only need to ask them one question - that the lease is acceptable to lenders. unless you have any particular thing you want to do / access at the property, that would be fairly unusual

need_an_answer

SmashedAvacado wrote: »

Sorry, but i don't agree. Even if you read the document, you don't know what's "not there". If you're looking to save money, then there are millions of ways of doing it, but second guessing the job of a solicitor who is trained and spends thousand of hours doing exactly that, is not.

sorry I didn't read the OP's post in a way that they wanted to save money,more that they just wanted to understand what was wriiten in the lease.

(and perhaps felt a little uneasy about asking the solicitor to explain into a way they could understand it)

StumpyPumpy

Ok, some context. As a first time buyer, you know nothing. Therefore you make sure that you get proper professional advice that you can trust. This, as has been pointed out, is what you pay a solicitor for. They are not scary (though mine is dull) And are quite happy to answer questions posed in the fashion "I'm a FTB and I have no idea what I am doing, can you explain this document to me in very simple terms and point out any pitfalls there are within it, please."

This is by far the preferred method in obtaining a good response. Throwing out a question to random nobodies on the internet is hardly a way to guarantee useful advice beyond "speak to an expert". No one here knows the specific leasehold agreement you are talking about or your circumstances. Perhaps it has a statement saying you have to maintain and pay for an armed patrol guard at night or bars you from keeping ring tailed lemurs, who knows if either of those would affect you? Only someone who is appropriately qualified can look at at the document and tell you if it is good or not.

SP

peddles

need_an_answer wrote: »

sorry I didn't read the OP's post in a way that they wanted to save money,more that they just wanted to understand what was wriiten in the lease.

(and perhaps felt a little uneasy about asking the solicitor to explain into a way they could understand it)

Spot on Thank you

peddles

StumpyPumpy wrote: »

Ok, some context. As a first time buyer, you know nothing. Therefore you make sure that you get proper professional advice that you can trust. This, as has been pointed out, is what you pay a solicitor for. They are not scary (though mine is dull) And are quite happy to answer questions posed in the fashion "I'm a FTB and I have no idea what I am doing, can you explain this document to me in very simple terms and point out any pitfalls there are within it, please."

This is by far the preferred method in obtaining a good response. Throwing out a question to random nobodies on the internet is hardly a way to guarantee useful advice beyond "speak to an expert". No one here knows the specific leasehold agreement you are talking about or your circumstances. Perhaps it has a statement saying you have to maintain and pay for an armed patrol guard at night or bars you from keeping ring tailed lemurs, who knows if either of those would affect you? Only someone who is appropriately qualified can look at at the document and tell you if it is good or not.

SP

Again...an unnecessary tone at the end there. This doesn't need to be a toxic debate. If the case is as you say and no one here can answer, then that's fine, and thank you for pointing me in the right direction. You can say that in a nice way though. I will ask my solicitor questions anyway, but personal experiences from the many "random nobodies on the internet" can be worth hearing, in my opinion.

[Deleted User]

Peddles I think you are right to be concerned about taking on such a property and there is nothing wrong with trying to educate yourself to ask the right questions of your solicitor. God knows Solicitors are not the holy grail when it comes to good advice given the many thousands of people trapped in nightmare Leases . This property sounds additionally complicated if it is part Freehold and Part Leasehold for the garage


I would encourage you to join the FB group National Leasehold Campaign and ask as many questions as you wish, you will find some very knowledgeable people there and also those who can share their own stories but importantly you will find a lot more sensible help than those here mocking or just saying speak to your solicitor.

OldMusicGuy

Here's what you need to watch out for, speaking from experience as the chair of a residents' association of a group of freehold owners constantly doing battle with the leasehold owner of the common areas on our development:

- What restrictions are there over what you are allowed to do with the garage? You may be restricted from changing it in any way (even the colour of the door). You might not be allowed to use it in certain ways or park certain vehicles in it or outside it.

- What rights do you confer to the leaseholder? They will probably stipulate that they or their representatives may require access to the garage to maintain/inspect it. You probably won't be able to keep them out so that may impact how you use the garage (ie would you want to store stuff like valuable bikes/dead bodies/who knows what in it if a third party has right of entry?).

- What are they going to charge you and how do the costs escalate? This is where the leasehold owners will often try to build in a mechanism to escalate costs year on year and they will make it very hard for you to challenge them on what they do. This could be an annual "rentcharge" for maintaining the garage and the ground around it. We found the maintenance company appointed by the leasehold owner was trying to charge us for unnecessary work because they could add a 15% management fee on top of it. We have been fighting with them for two years about this and had to go to the Property Ombudsman twice.

Of course the solicitor should highlight these things but based on my experience it's easy to skim over the long term implications of some of the lease terms. Don't be blinded by the "oh it's got a garage, great" mindset. I would be very wary of signing any kind of leasehold agreement like the one I currently have again.

We are currently moving and for this very reason we are avoiding new build developments where there are these kind of leasehold issues in place.

peddles

Thank you for that insight. That's why I came here
I'll be sure to look out for such things and ask the solicitor about them. I hadn't considered third party right of entry!

OldMusicGuy

peddles wrote: »

I hadn't considered third party right of entry!

The solicitor did not highlight this to us. Our deed of transfer actually grants the right for the property manager to enter the freehold properties any time if they feel they need to perform repairs or maintenance. They do not need to give any justification, just reasonable notice.

An example - one of the residents had a fitting for a basketball post on his front lawn (on the freehold property). The property manager conducted a health and safety report (which we paid for), the health and safety report stated this tiny fitting on a private lawn was a trip hazard (which it was not), so the property manager employed a contractor to dig this up and replace it. Which we paid for and all the costs had their 15% management fee on top.

The other residents were all outraged, taking the usual "it's private land, how dare they do this". None of them realised they had given permission for the property manager to enter their land and house, yet all of them had used solicitors to review all the terms. I'm afraid you shouldn't assume the solicitor will walk you through the implication of every aspect of the leasehold and related covenants.

peddles

OldMusicGuy wrote: »

The solicitor did not highlight this to us. Our deed of transfer actually grants the right for the property manager to enter the freehold properties any time if they feel they need to perform repairs or maintenance. They do not need to give any justification, just reasonable notice.

Indeed - it's my contract too! I'll ask the solicitor if anything can be done about it!
Thank you for your input.
By "we had to pay for it" - do you mean everyone in the residents' association split the cost?