Rule of 85 Transitional Protection

Dunnsdale

I found this on the Scots Lgps site. Does the same apply to the lgps in England too?

If you will be age 60 or over by 31 March 2020 and choose to retire before age 65, then, provided you satisfy the 85 year rule when you start to draw your pension, the benefits you build up to 31 March 2020 will not be reduced.

Johnnyboy11

Here's a dinky wee R85 checking tool:


https://www.spfo.org.uk/index.aspx?articleid=22388


The LGPS Regs. are UK wide, and the R85 protections were amended last year, so a lot of stuff online is out of date.

hyubh

Dunnsdale wrote: »

I found this on the Scots Lgps site. Does the same apply to the lgps in England too?

Yes - https://www.lgpsmember.org/more/eightyfive.php

If you will be age 60 or over by 31 March 2020 and choose to retire before age 65, then, provided you satisfy the 85 year rule when you start to draw your pension, the benefits you build up to 31 March 2020 will not be reduced.

Keep in mind what protection you get depends on when you joined, and your age. Also, the 85 year rule was abolished completely for anyone who joined after September 2006.

hyubh

Johnnyboy11 wrote: »

The LGPS Regs. are UK wide

Not quite, there are separate regulations for England/Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland, though the LGPS is very similar across the home nations. The main difference is arguably that the 60ths and CARE benefit structures were introduced in Scotland a year after England, though contribution bandings and other technicalities also differ.

the R85 protections were amended last year, so a lot of stuff online is out of date.

What amendments are you thinking of, out of interest...?

Johnnyboy11

hyubh wrote: »

... What amendments are you thinking of, out of interest...?

These changes...


https://www.spfo.org.uk/index.aspx?articleid=22880

Silvertabby

“ ... What amendments are you thinking of, out of interest...?
Originally posted by hyubh

Johnnyboy11 wrote: »

These changes...

https://www.spfo.org.uk/index.aspx?articleid=22880

Doesn't change R85, which remains linked to age 60.

Anyone retiring today at age 60 will, at the most, only have full R85 protections in respect of their pre 2008 service .

hyubh

Johnnyboy11 wrote: »

These changes...

https://www.spfo.org.uk/index.aspx?articleid=22880

Well, the 2018 Regs are specific to the Scottish LGPS, however the things highlighted on that page (i.e. early retirements under the CARE scheme without employer consent now being from age 55) bring matters into line with the 2014 Regs for England and Wales.

I may be wrong, but I don't think this actually affects rule of 85 arrangements, since the existing ones under the 2015 Transitional Regs (2014 in E&W) carry over - namely, if a voluntarily retiring member with at least some 85 year rule protections meets it before age 60, turning it on is an employer discretion.

Silvertabby

hyubh wrote: »

Well, the 2018 Regs are specific to the Scottish LGPS, however the things highlighted on that page (i.e. early retirements under the CARE scheme without employer consent now being from age 55) bring matters into line with the 2014 Regs for England and Wales.

I may be wrong, but I don't think this actually affects rule of 85 arrangements, since the existing ones under the 2015 Transitional Regs (2014 in E&W) carry over - namely, if a voluntarily retiring member with at least some 85 year rule protections meets it before age 60, turning it on is an employer discretion.[/QUOTE]

Which is rarer than hen's teeth. Some employers may be more free with their public money but, from experience, they won't chuck £ks into the pot just so one of their employees can voluntary retire at 60 without an early payment reduction.

Rich2808

I presume each LGPS has some super mega 300mb excel model that works all this out for people!

Its so complicated with pre 2008, 2008-2014 and post 2014 schemes with no doubt several more changes before most people retire. Most people don't realise they have 85 year rule protections for pre 2008 service even if they are many years from retirement - and the illustrative examples never seem to explain scenarios clearly.

Johnnyboy11

Rich2808 wrote: »

I presume each LGPS has some super mega 300mb excel model that works all this out for people!

Its so complicated with pre 2008, 2008-2014 and post 2014 schemes with no doubt several more changes before most people retire. Most people don't realise they have 85 year rule protections for pre 2008 service even if they are many years from retirement - and the illustrative examples never seem to explain scenarios clearly.

I think I've just about got my head around my own circumstances, with the helpful comments from SilverTabby and hyubh. I have a deferred persion, predominantly pre 2008, which I think I can voluntarily start at age 56 when I meet R85, albeit with a 4-year actuarial reduction (about 20%). Not sure I will start it early, but it's nice to know that I can.


I recall strike action at work, back in 2008-ish when R85 was being messed around with. Now I know what was being fought for.


Significantly, most of my former colleagues are unaware that they no longer need their employer's consent to reitre from age 55, albeit with an actuarial reduction.

Dunnsdale

Yes it does seem rather complicated. On the last annual statement a figure is given for " An annual pension at 31st March 2018 of xxxx". Would this figure take into account all the related intricacies and adjustments of the individuals circumstances regarding R85 etc?