Defence vs UKPC (Parking in my own space)

peoplepower555

Hi there, today i received a "Claim Form" from the County Court Business Centre in Northampton.

I have spent my entire evening reading tonnes of threads on this site so am better informed than when i started, yet still could use some guidance as my case unfolds. Please bear with me as this is all totally new to me. Please have a read of my case and let me know if you feel i am doing the right thing:

BACKGROUND

I am the owner of my flat (leasehold) since approximately February 2018. I spent the following months renovating it extensively with my father. I officially moved in at the beginning of July 2018, yet received a number of parking tickets for parking in my own allocated space during what i think was May and June, possibly earlier months too.

After receiving a few tickets in quick succession for parking in my space, i phoned the management group to complain. They explained i would need a permit. Perhaps rather naively i had thought one would be sent out to me (this was my first property and first experience with car park cowboys such as UKPC) - I arranged for one to be sent to me. I also believed my management company would wipe all of the tickets once i contacted them as i own the property. I received the permit via post and around half of the tickets were cancelled at the request of my management company to UKPC, however my management company over the phone said they couldn't control the tickets i had been issued prior to my receipt / payment of my parking permit.

Numerous letters have since arrived from UKPC, followed by debt collectors, the SCS Law and now the "Claim Form" for the county court business centre (Northampton).

THE CLAIM FORM (Dated 25th Jan but arrived on the 28th)

Under the "Particulars of the Claim" section on the Claim Form i have been sent, it says:
"The Claimant claims from the defendant the sum of £800 in respect of unpaid parking notices issued as a result of the Defendant's breach of terms and conditions of parking at sites managed by the Claimant. I will provide the defendant with separate detailed particulars within 14 days after service of the claim form"

A login to the moneyclaim.gov portal, with claim number and password has also been provided on the form.

SAR AND LETTER TO SOLICITOR

Now my memory is pretty rusty but i believe there are only around 3 or 4 outstanding parking tickets issued by UKPC, so how on earth they have arrived at £800 seems outrageous. After reading lots of advice this evening on this excellent forum, i believe the first thing is should do is request all information they currently have on me through a "Subject Access Request" (SAR) to the Data Protection Officer at UKPC - This should force them to provide evidence of information detailed in Coupon-Mad's thread for Newbies on the main page of this forum. I actually read about a case recently which UKPC lost a case for not responding to a SAR. Then i believe i should write to SCS Law, who are the solicitors in this case, notifying them that I have written to their client UKPC and that the case should be "put on hold" until their client has released all requested data,

Once the SAR and Solicitor's letter are done, i believe it's time to start planning for a defence. This is where i could use a lot of advice. Personally i feel outraged at being charged for parking in my own car parking space, however i realise outrage alone won't win this!

DEFENCE

There is a great-looking defence put together by Johnersh which i'm sure experienced members of this group are familiar with:

hxxxs://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?p=72977032#post72977032

In that post, it provides a defence, based on the lease not mentioning anything about private parking enforcement companies, which is really relevant to my case. I have read all 27 pages of my lease and only twice is parking mentioned. I have copied it below word for word:

1. " "The Car Parking Space" - For which the exclusive right to use is granted in this lease"

2. "Each parking space shall be used as a private motor car space only and shall not be used for the purpose of any trade manufacture or business of any description and of the avoidance of doubt no vans, commercial vehicles, boats, caravans, or any similar items may be parked in the parking spaces and motors vehicles shall not be parked elsewhere than on parking spaces so designated and no mechanical work may be carried out to any motor vehicle parked on the parking spaces"

My lease as quoted above mentions my “exclusive right to use” my car parking space - Can somebody tell me if this is enough to win the case?

Based on my lease, I would want to use the entirety of the section “Authority to Park and Primacy of Contract” in Johnersh's defence, detailed in full below:

Authority to Park and Primacy of Contract
6. It is denied that the Defendant or lawful users of his/her vehicle were in breach of any parking conditions or were not permitted to park in circumstances where an express permission to park had been granted to the Defendant permitting the above mentioned vehicle to be parked by the current occupier and leaseholder of [address], whose tenancy agreement permits the parking of vehicle(s) on land. The Defendant avers that there was an absolute entitlement to park deriving from the terms of the lease, which cannot be fettered by any alleged parking terms. The lease terms provide the right to park a vehicle in the relevant allocated bay, without limitation as to type of vehicle, ownership of vehicle, the user of the vehicle or the requirement to display a parking permit. A copy of the lease will be provided to the Court, together with witness evidence that prior permission to park had been given.

7. The Defendant avers that the operator’s signs cannot (i) override the existing rights enjoyed by residents and their visitors and (ii) that parking easements cannot retrospectively and unilaterally be restricted where provided for within the lease. The Defendant will rely upon the judgments on appeal of HHJ Harris QC in!Jopson v Homeguard Services Ltd!(2016) and of Sir Christopher Slade in!K-Sultana Saeed v Plustrade Ltd![2001] EWCA Civ 2011. The Court will be referred to further similar fact cases in the event that this matter proceeds to trial.

7. Accordingly it is denied that:
7.1. there was any agreement as between the Defendant or driver of the vehicle and the Claimant
7.2. there was any obligation (at all) to display a permit; and!
7.3. the Claimant has suffered loss or damage or that there is a lawful basis to pursue a claim for loss.

When putting my final defence together, i would also consider using all of or most of sections 1, 2, 3, 4 and 5 of the defence by Johnersh (mentioned above)

Some questions:

1. What should my response to the claim form entail? I am given a login to the moneyclaim.gov/uk website, along with password and claim number, but what do i actually respond with? Do you have the type something? Is it just ticking a box?

2. Am i right to send a SAR to UKPC and letter to their solicitor?

3. Is a defence based on the lease contract enough to win this and have similar cases been won using this method?

Thank you for reading. Any (and i do mean ANY) advice and guidance, such as whether I'm along the right lines, anything i may be missing, any other avenues of defence i may be missing etc. would all be really appreciated!

KeithP

peoplepower555 wrote: »

THE CLAIM FORM (Dated 25th Jan but arrived on the 28th)

With a Claim Issue Date of 25th January, you have until Wednesday 13th Febuary to do the Acknowledgement of Service, but there is nothing to be gained by delaying it. To do the AoS, follow the guidance offered in a Dropbox link from post #2 of the NEWBIES FAQ sticky thread.

Having done the AoS, you have until 4pm on Wednesday 27th February 2019 to file your Defence.

That's over four weeks away. Loads of time to produce a perfect Defence, but don't leave it to the very last minute.


When you are happy with the content, your Defence should be filed via email as suggested here:

Print your Defence.
1. Sign it and date it.
   
2. Scan the signed document back in and save it as a pdf.
   
3. Send that pdf as an email attachment to CCBCAQ@Justice.gov.uk
   
4. Just put the claim number and the word Defence in the email title, and in the body of the email something like 'Please find my Defence attached'.
   
5. Log into MCOL after a few days to see if the Claim is marked "defended". If not chase the CCBC until it is.
   
6. Do not be surprised to receive a copy of the Claimant's Directions Questionnaire, they are just trying to put you under pressure.
   
7. Wait for your DQ from the CCBC, or download one from the internet, and then re-read post #2 of the NEWBIES FAQ sticky thread to find out exactly what to do with it.

Coupon-mad

Exclusive use of the space should be your killer point.

You do not have to display any permit or be charged money by a third party, as they are not offering anything by way of 'consideration' that you do not already have as an exclusive, unfettered right.

i.e. they can't sell you your parking right, that you are already granted in the lease.

I will provide the defendant with separate detailed particulars within 14 days after service of the claim form"

You will need to acknowledge the claim within 14 days of service anyway, but I would wait a week and see if the POC arrive, as strictly speaking you need to see the Particulars, since the defence then replies to those.

1. What should my response to the claim form entail? I am given a login to the moneyclaim.gov/uk website, along with password and claim number, but what do i actually respond with? Do you have the type something? Is it just ticking a box?

A pictorial walk-through the MCOL screens for acknowledging the claim are in a link in the second post of the NEWBIES thread. Nice and simple. But wait a week for the POC (do not wait more than 14 days!). See the dates as advised by KeithP above.

2. Am i right to send a SAR to UKPC and letter to their solicitor?

Yes (SAR to UKPC) but not the holding letter, as the case is already at court stage so it can't be put on hold.

3. Is a defence based on the lease contract enough to win this and have similar cases been won using this method?

Yes, almost all have been won, and the NEWBIES thread tells you we have a 99% success rate despite a loss being reported today (don't let that put you off - you risk nothing by defending).

peoplepower555

Thank you so much both of you. I also have just received the particulars of the claim document from SCS Law. They are trying to claim £160 per ticket - I read somewhere that UKPC are not allowed to ask for more than £100 per ticket, is this correct?

Coupon-mad

Yes, your defence can include words like this:

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?p=75304578#post75304578

peoplepower555

Thank you Coupon-Mad, I also have an update which is important and would like your thoughts on. In the particulars of the claim which i have received in the post, it has listed 5 "offences". 4 of the 5 are indeed as i have specified above (me parking my vehicle in my designated parking space last year, which my lease gives me access to). However, one of them is from 2016, where i got a ticket for parking in a residential area in the town centre. Personally i believe signage was poor as there were no double-yellows and i genuinely couldn't see the parking sign. However, I don't have the mental energy to fight this as well and i believe it complicates the case. I would like to offer to settle that one claim, hence my interest in what the maximum UKPC is allowed to claim per ticket actually is.

I asked above if UKPC can charge a maximum of £100, to which you said yes, but in the link you provided, it says £300 for the case in question - Could you offer some clarity on that and also if you think i should offer to settle for £100, £160 or a different amount? My main issue is the 4 tickets for parking in my space and perhaps this settlement would also make UKPC feel like they've gotten enough to drop the case? Do let me know your thoughts on what to do about this.

Just to be clear, the particulars of the claim are:

1. 2016 - Parking in a residential area without a permit. (£160)
2. 2018 - Parking in my space at my flat (£160)
3. 2018 - Parking in my space at my flat (£160)
4. 2018 - Parking in my space at my flat (£160)
5. 2018 - Parking in my space at my flat (£160)

Your help is greatly appreciated. Thank you

Umkomaas

I asked above if UKPC can charge a maximum of £100,

They can only charge the keeper what it says on the Notice to Driver (windscreen ticket). As the BPA maximum is £100, that should be the maximum for the actual parking charge. They can't unilaterally add on extra to that part of the claim.

However there are add-ons that they can legitimately charge, like the court filing fee - sliding scale starting at £25 (for a Claim up to £300) and higher as the claim sum increases.

https://www.gov.uk/make-court-claim-for-money/court-fees

Then they can claim a capped maximum of £50 for their solicitor costs - challengeable for them to provide proof of expenditure.

Court hearing fee (similar sliding scale to the filing fee).

Some interest at 8% pa on the £100.

They will also chance their arm on claiming debt collection fees (which almost certainly they will have not paid as debt crawlers tend to work on a no win, no fee basis). Challengeable!

So don't get the impression that 5 PCNs = £500 max. It needs to be broken down to understand what it is they are trying to claim. Have they given you that breakdown in the POC?

The_Deep

UKPC are fraudsters, I would fight them all the way.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/crime/11858473/Parking-firm-UKPC-admits-faking-tickets-to-fine-drivers.html

The whole industry is a scam, relying on threats of court, and the public's ignorance of the Law, A bill is currently before parliament which will regulate the scammers, many of whom are ex-clampers.

This is an entirely unregulated industry which is scamming the public with inflated claims for minor breaches of alleged contracts for alleged parking offences, aided and abetted by a handful of low-rent solicitors. Is has been suggested by an MP that some of these companies may have connections to organised crime.

Parking Eye, CPM, Smart, (especially Smart}, and others have already been named and shamed in the House of Commons as have Gladstones Solicitors, and BW Legal, (these two law firms take hundreds of these cases to court each week), hospital car parks and residential complex tickets have been especially mentioned. They lose most of them, and have been reported to the regulatory authority by an M.P. for unprofessional conduct

The problem has become so widespread that MPs have agreed to enact a Bill to regulate these scammers.

Sir Greg Knight's Private Members Bill to curb the excesses, and perhaps close down, some of these companies passed its Second Reading in the Lords this month, and, with a fair wind, will l become Law later this year..

All five readings are available to watch on the internet, (some 7-8 hours), and published in Hansard. MPs have an extremely low opinion of the industry. Many are complaining that they are becoming overwhelmed by complaints from members of the public. Add to their burden, complain in the most robust terms about the scammers.

Fruitcake

I have no knowledge of the court process, but I'm surprised that the scammers can include a claim for a completely different case unrelated to the others. Different location, different circumstances, possibly different driver (who shouldn't be named) for the retail PCN, different reason for the claim, different "contract" breached etcetera.

I would challenge this with the court and asked for it to be stripped out of the particulars of claim or whatever the terminology. Point out that it is so different from the other claims it should be thrown out, or the scammers should be forced to submit a separate claim.
That will give you some breathing space.

You could then make a drop hands offer to the scammers. Tell them the judge will obviously side with you on the residential case where you will ask for additional charges for unreasonable behaviour, whereas the retail one is 50-50 judge bingo. Consequently they should drop both to save themselves money and you will drop a counter-claim.

With regards to "exclusive use" it simply excludes a third party from entering your space, excludes a third party from forcing you to display a third party permit, and excludes a third party from charging, taking you to court, or harassing you.

The scammers should know this, should have checked with the MA/HA/landowner before pitching up on site and issuing charges. They should have employed due diligence to check they were not ticketing people who should not be receiving them. They should have done this up front by asking their "employers" especially as this was at a residential site. It would be unreasonable for them not to know they shouldn't be ticketing genuine residents, and should have checked the residents' lease before they agreed to mis-manage the site IYSWIM.

You should emphasise how unreasonable their behaviour is/was at each stage.

Have you checked with the DVLA that the scammers requested keeper details for each and every PCN?

peoplepower555

Hi Coupon-Mad, i am about to send their DPO a SAR. Please could you cast an eye over it and check if this looks ok?

[MY FULL ADDRESS]

[TODAY'S DATE]

UK Parking Control Limited

Dear Sir or Madam,

Subject access request ( Data Protection Act 2018 / General Data Protection Regulations (GDPR)

Full name: [MY FULL NAME]

Current address:
[MY CURRENT ADDRESS]

Previous address:
[MY FULL PREVIOUS ADDRESS]

Please supply the data about me that I am entitled to under data protection law!relating to myself.

I write to request all of the following:

All photos taken of my vehicle by UKPC Ltd.

All letters sent to me by UKPC Ltd.

All of my personal data currently held by UKPC Ltd.

A list of all PCNs you consider outstanding relating to myself.

Any other information UKPC Ltd will rely upon in relation to my alleged Parking offences.

If you need any more data from me to confirm my identity please let me know as soon as possible. It may be helpful for you to know that data protection law requires you to respond to a request for data within one calendar month.

If you do not normally deal with these requests, please pass this letter to your Data Protection Officer, or relevant staff member. If you need advice on dealing with this request, the Information Commissioner’s Office can assist you. Its website is!ico.org.uk!or it can be contacted on 0303 123 1113.

Yours faithfully,

[MY FULL NAME]

peoplepower555

Thanks for your reply, I'll be using your advice when putting together my defence, which I am adamant will be a strong as possible. I despise these scammers!

In my defence, would you consider it constructive to highlight stories such as the one you mentioned, in order to remind the judge that these people have a track record of disregarding the law in order to make money from innocent people?

xxx.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/crime/11858473/Parking-firm-UKPC-admits-faking-tickets-to-fine-drivers.html