I need help with universal credit claim - HRT (EEA national)

Felixstone

Hi, I've applied for universal credit and been refused. I had to do the HRT and that's the part that I'm having problems with. I'll give a summary of everything that I think is relevant :


I came to the UK from Spain when I was 2 years old. I've been here for over 40 years.

Based on everything I've read, I believe I have permanent residence (correct me if I'm wrong).

I don't have access to my birth certificate, nor do I have any idea where it is, but it's definitely back in Spain.

I don't know if I have indefinite leave to remain. Probably not, but as I say I don't know. I've never applied and I don't know if I need to.

My spanish passport is expired but at no point has that been brought up.

I've had jobs here, gone to school, had bank accounts, etc, the usual stuff that a person living here would do.

For many years I did not work, and I have never worked for 5 years continuously.Recently I became self employed, working from home, but it has been on and off and I haven't earned much. I have provided invoices and bank statements, and been told that I'm not gainfully self employed. I currently don't have a job (as an employee).

I have anxiety and I had a doctors note which expired recently and I hope to get it extended. I would have difficulty working outside of home but working from home is no problem.

Due to me not being able to get universal credit, my mum has been helping me out, giving me money for rent and council tax, and also some money to live on (except when I have been earning money from self employment).

My mum is is retired, but she always worked while in the UK.

No one in my family is a UK citizen.

I've contacted a lot of people (citizens advice bureau and many others) and although they seem to think that I should get universal credit, they haven't advised me on exactly what to do.



I have a SSCS1 form to appeal, but I have no idea what to say. I have contacted my local MP and they're looking into it but so far they've given me generic info which I already know.

What should I do?

Thanks.

calcotti

This is specialist stuff. If you haven’t got the guidance you need from advice agencies I don’t think you are going to find it here. You need specialist advice.

As regards your birth certificate, if you know where you were born can you not obtain a copy from the relevant local authority?

You cannot use the SSCS1 to appeal to the tribunal service unless you have already requested a Mandatory Reconsideration from the DWP and had Mandatory Reconsideration Notice from them.

tomtom256

https://www.gov.uk/apply-for-a-uk-residence-card

Is this something you could apply for.

I think they are treating you as not being a 'qualified person' for permanent residence but without knowing what wording they have used or which UCD letter they have issued its hard to tell.

The expired passport may also be an issue.

calcotti

tomtom256 wrote: »

https://www.gov.uk/apply-for-a-uk-residence-card

Is this something you could apply for.

This appears to be for people from outside the EEA which OP is not so I don’t think it applies.

tomtom256

calcotti wrote: »

This appears to be for people from outside the EEA which OP is not so I don’t think it applies.

If you read eligibility it states "You may also be eligible for a residence card if you have a ‘retained right of residence" which they may come under.

And the permanent residence card section if they want to claim UK citizenship, which may be of use to OP.

But like most of gov.uk its as clear as mud.

calcotti

tomtom256 wrote: »

If you read eligibility it states "You may also be eligible for a residence card if you have a ‘retained right of residence" which they may come under.

And the permanent residence card section if they want to claim UK citizenship, which may be of use to OP.

But like most of gov.uk its as clear as mud.

I’m reading it as everything being additional detail informing the basic opening criteria

“You can apply for a residence card if you’re both:

• from outside the European Economic Area (EEA)
• the family member, or extended family member, of an EEA national who is a permanent resident or ‘qualified person’

tacpot12

If you have permanent residence you should have either
- a blue ‘residence documentation’ booklet with a certificate in it OR
- a certificate inside your expired Spanish Passport.

It is worth checking whether you or your Mum has a residence documentation booklet or a passport with a permanent residence certificate in it.

If you don't have one of these, then you have two options:

1) You can challenge the DWP, or
2) Apply for a permanent residence document. See https://www.gov.uk/uk-residence-eu-citizens/permanent-residence

These basically come down to the same thing; you have to pass the Right to Reside part of the HRT - the application for a residence document applies the same test as the Right to Reside part of the HRT. The permanent residence document might be preferable because it doesn't involve the DWP!

You need to read the guidance notes carefully and make sure you complete with all the requests:
See https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/672960/Form-EEA-PR-guidance-notes-v3.pdf

You can apply on the basis of being a family member and that your Mum has been supporting you. This is potentially your best option, so I would see if you can apply on the basis of being a family member.

You need to get help to assemble the evidence. I doubt your MP will be able to persuade the Home Office to grant you residence without evidence and if you have the evidence you don't need your MP, so focus your energy on getting this evidence. This is now your full-time job.

You can apply for British Citizenship immediately after receiving your permanent residence document. This might be worth considering if you think you will remain in the UK but need a passport for travel.

If you can't pass the HRT, and want to remain in the UK, then applying for Settled Status is your only option. See https://www.gov.uk/settled-status-eu-citizens-families (This is part of the UK Government's response to the UK leaving the EU). There is no guidance that I'm aware of that confirms whether Settled Status will allow you to claim benefits. My guess is that it will not.

I do hope you get this sorted and I regret the fact that our government is making this so difficult for you.

D_M_E

In addition to the above, this link gives a bit more detail

https://www.gov.uk/settled-status-eu-citizens-families/what-settled-and-presettled-status-means

and this link https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46701886 gives an explanation.

Felixstone

The purpose of the HRT is to stop people just showing up to the UK and claiming benefits (as well as british people who have been away for a long time and come back). That's the spirit of it, the reason why it even exists.

I am neither of the above. I came here when I was 2. I've probably been here longer than some of the people who have seen and dealt with my claim, and my english is better than whoever wrote the mandatory reconsideration notice.

It seems to me that they're treating me the same way as someone who just turned up the other week and wants to claim benefits right away. According to the spirit of the rules, they're wrong to reject my claim. And if they applied the rules in keeping with the spirit of it, I wouldn't be having any problems.

I'm hoping that there are some magic words that I can say to them that will get them to understand that they're applying the rules badly. I say magic words because we all know we live in a world where terminology can go a long way, and we also know that not everything that we're told is correct. People break rules, they misinform, and they get away with it.

If only I knew exactly what to say in my appeal that would clarify the fact that I ought to be treated (for the purpose of this claim) the same as a british citizen, although I obviously understand that I'm not one. I'm a guest here, but a very long term one and I didn't arrive yesterday just to claim universal credit.

Alice_Holt

If your mother has a permanent R to R this may apply:
https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/benefits/coming-from-abroad-and-claiming-benefits-the-habitual-residence-test/eea-nationals-and-the-habitual-residence-test/eea-nationals-claiming-benefits-as-a-family-member/

If not then go through this carefully, and check if any other circumstances apply:
https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/benefits/coming-from-abroad-and-claiming-benefits-the-habitual-residence-test/eea-nationals-and-the-habitual-residence-test/

I would start by setting out a chronology of your working life. Are you sure you don't have 5 years continuous (or near continuous) period of working, job-seeking or self-employment? Get together all your P60's, P45's, wage slips, NI contribution records, etc, etc.
(For permanent R to R).

Can you qualify as having retained worker status? For instance - where you working before having to stop work due to temporary illness?

Are you responsible for a child in education?

With your chronology and having worked through these links, and if you think one condition may apply - then go back to the CAB and ask them to contact their central Expert Advice Team (EAT) by email for further guidance on how to apply and the relevant grounds / case law.



If none of these applies, then the way to pass the UC habitual residence would be to take a part time job, so you are classed as a "worker". The job would need to accepted as "gainful" by the DWP.

xylophone

You can obtain a copy of your birth certificate.


http://www.mjusticia.gob.es/cs/Satellite/Portal/en/servicios-ciudadano/tramites-gestiones-personales/certificadocertificacion