Petrol vs Diesel - has the formula shifted?

edde

Elika0215 wrote: »

Mazda CX-3, Audi A3 or VW Golf. Maybe the Honda HR-V

Personally I'd go Honda or mazda I'd keep away from audi or vw. Imo they are overpriced and there quality isn't there.

Mitsubishi Phev? Least most of your short local drives will be on battery so very cheap. OK the uni runs won't be as cheap as a diesel but the saving on ele tri itt will be superb. Assuming your milage is about half electric miles and half going to from uni your average mpg should be around 100mpg which no diesel will manage.

Saving would at a quick guess be 500 a year vs a diesel

Other hybrids would be an option.

Arklight

edde wrote: »

250 quid to replace a cambelt often vs a serious bill if the chain breaking (and they do break a lot more than you'd think) I'd take the cambelt.

It's not £250 where I am. More like £300 to £400.

I don't think a timing chain breaking is common at all unless you own a BMW. A chain breaking will instantly trash an engine and no decent manufacturer will sell cars with that issue.

Timing chain stretch possibly is. But my last car had done 135,000 miles with no problems when I traded her in. That's £1000 of cambelt changes I never had to worry about.

A cambelt isnt a deal breaker, but it was another cross against diesel.

System

Elika0215 wrote: »

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The petrol vs diesel argument has shifted since I last bought a car (in 2007). Diesels were much more efficient and didn't have a DPF which seems to be the single biggest issue with diesels doing low, city, mileage.

Diesels are still more efficient. Petrols have come close to the thermal efficiency of diesels but still no cigar.

Finally, all that seems to point to buying a diesel, yet I've been advised to buy petrol by a dealership but as their 2nd hand petrols were more expensive, I'm a little cynical.

Get a 10-12 year old diesel and then no DPF filter to worry about. Any VAG Group (VW, Audi, Skoda, Seat) with the 1.9L TDI engine in.

motorguy

forgotmyname wrote: »

The formula is flawed because everyone's needs and wants are different.

Nobody in their right mind would tell me to buy a Diesel. Sub 4000 miles a year, 99.9% of that short local journeys, rarely getting past 40mph. Fairly heavy traffic conditions also.

Yet my needs/wants are 40mpg rather than 20mpg and i prefer the low down pulling power of a diesel for towing.

So diesel works for me.

What age / make / model is your diesel car?

motorguy

Tarambor wrote: »

Diesels are still more efficient. Petrols have come close to the thermal efficiency of diesels but still no cigar.


Get a 10-12 year old diesel and then no DPF filter to worry about. Any VAG Group (VW, Audi, Skoda, Seat) with the 1.9L TDI engine in.

Did you not read the O/P's original post at all? They've an 11 year old car already which they wish to change to a 2-3 year old one.

motorguy

Elika0215 wrote: »

Looking to buy a car and courtesy of this site, am going for a 2-3 year old (to avoid the biggest drop in depreciation) with low mileage.

The petrol vs diesel argument has shifted since I last bought a car (in 2007). Diesels were much more efficient and didn't have a DPF which seems to be the single biggest issue with diesels doing low, city, mileage.

However, diesels now seem to be a little cheaper than many petrol models and they're depreciating quicker from what I've seen.

So my issue is should I go for petrol or diesel? A little about my driving;

-I do about 8k a year, mainly in towns and country roads.
-I don't travel regularly to big cities that may incur diesel charges in the near future.
-My driving style is pretty relaxed.
- I prioritise economy, reliability and service costs over performance.
-I don't mind a car that depreciates quickly as I intend to keep it for a while.

Finally, all that seems to point to buying a diesel, yet I've been advised to buy petrol by a dealership but as their 2nd hand petrols were more expensive, I'm a little cynical.

Sadly diesel cars of recent years have become strangulated by emissions control devices which has led to reliability issues even in the short term. With your miles and driving pattern and thinking forward for long term ownership i believe the go to choice would be a diesel.

I bought a year old Passat TDI two years ago and within a fortnight i'd DPF issues. It was back at the dealers 3 times for a day at a time and they then had the car for over a week while they replaced the entire emissions control system on the car - including DPF, EGR valve etc at (what would have been) a cost (to me if it had been outside warranty) of £2,250. That was on a year old car. :eek:

Needless to say i now drive a petrol car, even though i've been a long time diesel advocate.

Arklight

motorguy wrote: »

Sadly diesel cars of recent years have become strangulated by emissions control devices which has led to reliability issues even in the short term. With your miles and driving pattern and thinking forward for long term ownership i believe the go to choice would be a diesel.

I bought a year old Passat TDI two years ago and within a fortnight i'd DPF issues. It was back at the dealers 3 times for a day at a time and they then had the car for over a week while they replaced the entire emissions control system on the car - including DPF, EGR valve etc at (what would have been) a cost (to me if it had been outside warranty) of £2,250. That was on a year old car. :eek:

Needless to say i now drive a petrol car, even though i've been a long time diesel advocate.

That's the kind of story that put me ff buying a diesel, unfortunately.

motorguy

Arklight wrote: »

That's the kind of story that put me ff buying a diesel, unfortunately.

I purposely went for the highest mileage one on offer too - at 16,000 miles and a year old, so it hadnt exactly sat around.

To me they're just not worth the risk any more. That could easily have been me getting a big bill outside of warranty.

It put me off the car TBH. I lost faith and heart in it after that and got rid at the first opportunity. There was no guarantees at all that the car wasnt going to do the same thing again down the line and VW i suspect would have refused a second claim.

When i was motor trading there wasnt a month went by where we didnt have / see or experience a car with DPF problems or diesel related issues (injectors, pump, turbo, etc), though these would have been middle aged cars.

Fortunately i dont do big miles so a petrol car is fine. If that changes i'd go down the hybrid route rather than a diesel.

Elika0215

edde wrote: »

Personally I'd go Honda or mazda I'd keep away from audi or vw. Imo they are overpriced and there quality isn't there.

Mitsubishi Phev? Least most of your short local drives will be on battery so very cheap. OK the uni runs won't be as cheap as a diesel but the saving on ele tri itt will be superb. Assuming your milage is about half electric miles and half going to from uni your average mpg should be around 100mpg which no diesel will manage.

Saving would at a quick guess be 500 a year vs a diesel

Other hybrids would be an option.

Did a little research on PHEVS and the post-2016 Prius and the Hyundai Ionic are really tempting.

The only problem I have is for either model < 15k miles, prices are around £20k which is too much. I doubt I'd make the excess £5k back over the next 5 years

I know they seem to be reliable so when comparing Hybrid with Petrol, is it reasonable to increase the starting mileage when searching used deals? I didn't explain that very well;

So, petrol searches say up to 15k is like searching hybrids with 22k for instance.

JP1978

The two hybrids I have driven were only ever running on electric only at low speeds - like sub 20mph and any sign of brisk acceleration and the petrol would kick in. I did read somewhere that a lot of the Hybrid EV's were just a means of a tax dodge re the way that they were taxed at the time.

If you drive in a lot of heavy stop start traffic then maybe this would be OK? However, what is the long term reliability of the hybrids?

I have also driven several Seat Leon's with the 1.4 (or 1.5) TFSI engine that has active cylinder technology - this shuts off two of the cylinders when not required. You can be driving at 70mph on only two cylinders. Obviously start to push the engine and the other two fire up seamlessly. I found that 50mpg was quite easy to attain (DSG Gearbox / Estate) - been a hire car, wasnt really trying to get best fuel economy either!