Father has failed the Habitual residence test twice.

bflare

neontetra wrote: »

Ok Its not helpful, talk to embassies, mps, outcome wont differ, dad is not entitled, however how much does it cost to feed another mouth, cost of healthcare your dad should have insured himself when moving to a different country. Not helpful, you may have to check and see if he has paid enough taxes in Italy that might cover his health costs.

Not even sure what your waffling on about but thanks for wasting your time :T

OhWow

_shel wrote: »

Ordinary residence is "settled" residence. He's not settled he's only just arrived

Two things:

1. There are 6 types of British nationality passports but not all allow settlement in the UK (allow the holder to live in the UK or an EEA country, work, have benefits, use the NHS bill free) and these are treated as visitors to the UK unless they have a visa.
https://www.gov.uk/types-of-british-nationality/british-citizenship
As you can see from that government link, "British citizen" always has settlement when they reside in the UK, from day one, but that has nothing to do with the NHS or benefits as they have different rules.


2. "[FONT=Calibri,Calibri][FONT=Calibri,Calibri]Ordinarily resident"[/FONT][/FONT] for bill free use of the NHS, means bill free for those who are a "British citizen" who reside in the UK, and those with a valid ILR (Indefinite Leave to Remain) visa who reside in the UK, as per The Immigration Act 2014. [FONT=Calibri,Calibri][FONT=Calibri,Calibri]Everybody else are on various agreements, exemptions, they pay the NHS, their own country pays[/FONT][/FONT] the NHS. Therefore the OP's British citizen father is covered by the NHS from the first day he returned to the UK to reside and he just needs to show that proof to avoid being billed.

"[FONT=Calibri,Calibri][FONT=Calibri,Calibri]Ordinarily resident" for bill free use of the NHS, used to mean everybody who was lawfully living in the UK (not visitors) but The Immigration Act 2014 ended that from 6 April 2015. [/FONT][/FONT]
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[/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Calibri,Calibri][FONT=Calibri,Calibri]You can read the NHS part of that Act, but there was a lot about this on the web in 2014 and any search will get millions of hits. That Act (Act of Parliament = new law) made a lot of changes, including ending those who could use the NHS bill free before.[/FONT][/FONT]
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[/FONT][/FONT]
[FONT=Calibri,Calibri][FONT=Calibri,Calibri]A "British citizen" who resides in the UK, can use the NHS bill free from day one, even if they have returned from living abroad, never worked in the UK, never lived in the UK before.[/FONT][/FONT]

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neontetra_2

Why did your dad move to Italy in first place? is he only moving back here because of health costs?

bflare

neontetra wrote: »

Why did your dad move to Italy in first place? is he only moving back here because of health costs?

So let me get this straight. You accuse my father of fleecing the system then go on to ask my why he moved to Italy which clearly shows you've not even bothered to read my original post therefore your comments hold no substance with me what so ever.

OhWow

poppy10 wrote: »

- he won't be entitled to NHS care. If they find out they can make him pay.


...


These are the questions we have to ask to check whether someone is ordinarily resident and entitled to free NHS care:

• Have they been in the UK for the last 6 months or more?

There is not a 6 month wait for a British citizen to be able to use the NHS bill free if they are residing in the UK. These can use the NHS bill free from day one.They will ask for proof that he is residing in the UK now.


British citizens can be billed and have 50% added to the bill if there is no insurance to pay, or refused treatment if it is not life saving (under the Immigration Act 2014), but are not billed if they prove they are now residing in the UK again. Under that Act, the NHS must now check whether somebody can use the NHS bill free.

Pollycat

bflare wrote: »

So let me get this straight. You accuse my father of fleecing the system then go on to ask my why he moved to Italy which clearly shows you've not even bothered to read my original post therefore your comments hold no substance with me what so ever.

Personally, I'd step away from responding to posts that you don't think are helpful.
The person you are currently interacting with has had a post removed from this thread.

[Deleted User]

bflare wrote: »

So let me get this straight. You accuse my father of fleecing the system then go on to ask my why he moved to Italy which clearly shows you've not even bothered to read my original post therefore your comments hold no substance with me what so ever.

I thought you threw your toys out the pram and were leaving?

budgie_mcinally

I am getting really cheesed off with this department and the advice that I and other people have been given by these expert advice agency's. I was told that I did not Qualify for pip as i lived in Spain for two years and had a stroke, I proved my HRT and won the case I am currently waiting on getting paid. HRT lasts for Three months and then that means you have proved that you are living in the UK. Put in your claim again stating EEA Laws rules and regulations On the right to freedom of movement within The European Economic Area. Also the rights of British and Irish Citizens. Also the rights of transfer of information between member states, which means that any information ie medical information criminal convictions etc is transferable from the UK to Italy and transferable back again and the dwp have to use it. If I where you Reinstate your claim from day one and also claim PIP. . I did not at the time know I could claim PIP when living in Spain. When you have put this information to them , Also Put in for A mandatory reconsideration and a tribunal, once you start the process of tribunal, When you get a phone call saying you are correct and do qualify for it and do you still want to go ahead with tribunal the answer is YES as this is a stalling tactic. If anyone needs any of the relevant EEA laws etc, European convention on human right act , Or social security act or case laws they are on line. Here is a case law for you to use.Surinder Singh case no. C-370/90 Immigration appeal tribunal v Secretary of state. Articles 48 and 52 on the treaty of Rome EEC treaty and council directive 73/148 on 21 May 1973 on the Abolition of restrictions on movement. I have since been to CAB, Also headway who actually try and advise DWP on head injuries etc but have never had a reply. I won this by myself and finding out things that no one had an inkling into EEA laws. Good luck and get the appeal reinstated you can go back 11 months but if you state to the tribunal the reasons that the Dwp lied to you or mislead you you will get it back dated.

elsien

Oh for goodness sake, will the holier than thou brigade get over yourselves, stop baiting the OP and take it to DT.
No one is trying to fleece the sodding system.
A British citizen has returned home which he is perfectly entitled to do and is living off his savings while he accesses the benefits to which he will be legally entitled. All they are doing is double checking when that will be - after all the DWP isn't exactly noted for correct decision making at the best of times.
If my disabled parent was returning to her country of birth where she had paid taxes and built up NI Contributions throughout her working life, and to be nearer to her family when she most needed to, I'd be asking exactly the same questions as the OP. And I'd put money on it most of you would too. It's why we have the welfare state in the first place. So he made some poor decisions. So do we all at times. He's not made himself destitute on purpose.

And the OP has been a heck of a sight politer than I would have been.
Completely unneccessary.

OhWow

budgie_mcinally wrote: »

. Here is a case law for you to use.Surinder Singh case no. C-370/90 Immigration appeal tribunal v Secretary of state. Articles 48 and 52 on the treaty of Rome EEC treaty and council directive 73/148 on 21 May 1973 on the Abolition of restrictions on movement.

That was about a non-British citizen, non-EEA citizen, who wanted to live in the UK using EU laws. bflare said his father is a British citizen and therefore he is allowed to live in Britain.