Unwittingly parked in stealth disabled bay - what are my chances?

tahrey

OK, so Saturday night I made a rare foray up the M42 to Nottingham for a gig taking place in one of the pubs. I checked for parking places before I left, and got the postcodes of a few that were within reasonable walking distance but didn't cost the earth.

Given a previous experience with getting hopelessly lost in the middle of Leicester whilst looking for a venue after parking up (thanks to phone failure), I thought it best if I did a flyby on the way to familiarise myself with where I had to aim for. Luckily it turned to be right on the edge of a pedestrianised zone so whilst there wasn't any clear parking nearby for less than twenty quid, it could at least be identified and a visual return route plotted.

After finding the pub, I pulled over for a moment and put the address of the cheapest place into the satnav, and set off following it, only to find round the very next corner what looked like available on-street parking bays much like what are available around the periphery of Birmingham's own pedestrian-and-bus zone, and that the online directories rarely pick up. Bonus!

Pulled into the first available gap, in front of another car, and, not seeing any obvious signage on my own side, relied on the signs that were on the opposite side of the road, which said to go and pay at the meter. Again, there weren't any in evidence on my own side, but I'd seen one on the other as I'd rounded the corner, so I dutifully climbed back up the hill, read the poorly lit details on the meter which initially suggested a similar "overnight" tariff as in the larger off-street parks, and fed in my entirely reasonable-seeming two pounds. Only after hitting print did I realise the text actually said "6pm to 8pm" not "8am", and overnight was free, but as I had the ticket and it wasn't quite 8pm I figured I may as well throw it on the dash, then backtrack to my actual destination. The small car behind me had just left, so I first quickly reversed up to the top of the bay to close the gap.

On my return from the pub a little over 3 hours later I was somewhat surprised to find a yellow plastic PCN bag very loosely attached to my windscreen. I thought it was a joke initially, maybe it had been ripped off another car and stuck on by a drunk as it was almost falling off, but, no, it had my reg on it, and an "observation time" of 20:36 to 20:38. For the offence of parking in a disabled bay without displaying a blue badge. Eh?

Had a look around and finally spotted a small "blue badge holders only" sign, unlit, at the top of a tall pole, about where my rear passenger door was (handy for any disabled people exiting from there...), silhouetted against nearby street and security lights. Further down there was another one, literally hidden behind the one-way sign. Also three drop kerbs in somewhat random positions that I doubt would be particularly convenient for disabled parkers wanting to get their wheelchairs out of the back and up onto the pavement, especially not from the space I was in (my bonnet barely cleared the first one, and I had originally parked so that there was some space between my own car and the other one, assuming they were provided for people crossing the road). Width of the bay maybe a little wider than normal, but it was the exact same as other non-disabled bays on the same side further up the same hill (and arguably closer to the city centre attractions!), reserved for Taxis and Car Club vehicles, and I assumed they were simply a little generous, particularly given that a couple of seven-seater vans parked in the other spaces barely fit within the lines. No markings on the road at all other than the normal dotted parking space lines, with no delineation of individual spaces, no "DISABLED" text, no wheelchair logo... but, the car club spaces had a "CAR CLUB ONLY" legend painted next to them on the carriageway!

Other side of the road was regular parking spaces, and if it had been at all obvious that my side was disabled-only I probably would have fit my dinky hatchback into a gap in that row, or possibly just deffed the idea off completely and continued to my original destination.

Took a few pictures at the scene and a video on my phone, propped on the dash, illustrating the complete lack of any clear indication that the bay was reserved from the perspective of someone drawing up there at night (I daresay it's a bit easier in the day?). Quite how a disabled driver, or someone with a blue badge passenger is meant to identify them as spaces allegedly designed with their needs in mind is beyond me. I also have one clip from my dashcam showing me pulling away, and that the parking sign behind the one-way sign isn't really visible even from the passenger side and after pulling forwards, but unfortunately all footage showing my arrival got eaten by the recording roll-over given that home is a good hour away from the scene.

Have tried to find out what standards Nottingham adhere to from their website and other online council publications, but have hit a bit of a wall. However, any pictures that have come up in the few documents I could find show bays with DISABLED written on the road next to them. Also they have an entertaining passage within their Civil Enforcement Annual Report 2015-2016 which runs as follows...

"It is essential that the signs and lines denoting parking restrictions are accurate so that parking enforcement can take place.
Processing and Enforcement employs a private contractor
with a dedicated team to carry out replacement of large
stretches of lineage and a local contractor to manufacture
signs. The Council has a Compliance and Fraud Officer who
continually monitors signs and lines and replaces smaller
sections of markings and erects missing signs in accordance
with the Traffic Regulation Order (TRO) and the Traffic Signs
Regulations and General Directions 2002.
In addition, information is received on a regular basis from the Civil Enforcement Officers where they consider that there is a potential problem. Every month lines and signs associated with Bus Lanes are inspected by in house Bus Lane Enforcement Officers who are employed within the Processing and Enforcement team.
Any anomalies between signs and lines and the TRO are passed to the Traffic Management team for prompt action. "

Doesn't look like that particular idea holds any water with their city centre parking space team, eh...

Have also had a look at the place on Google Streetview, and it seems that the lines have been untouched for at least the last 11 years, which might mean that they were directly in contravention of the old laws governing these things, though nowadays it might be more of a discretionary matter and arguing that they're not upholding best standards in terms of making sure visiting drivers are fully aware of where they are and aren't allowed to park, and thereby ensuring that the reserved bays are kept open at all times for the proper users. Rather than them being needlessly blocked and then the unwitting offender getting charged.

Another thing highlighted by streetview is that either the "Blue badge holders only" signs have been slowly migrating upwards over the years, in a couple of small jumps, or the One-Way signs have been creeping lower. 2007, the disabled sign that would have been in front of me was clearly visible below the one-way. 2012 or so, only about half of it could be seen, but it was still obvious that something was there and it had a wheelchair logo on it. 2017 onwards, it's completely hidden from the perspective of anyone actually driving the correct way along the road.

So, anyway, given all that ... how do you rate my chances of lodging a successful informal appeal against them? Seeing as I could easily have paid £22 in an NCP just for a normal ticket if I was daft, and the reduced charge is £25, I'm not sure if I want to take it all the way to a formal challenge which means the fine doubles if I lose. But I don't want to let them get away with it without at least moaning at them and petitioning that they improve the signage, for actual disabled drivers' sake if nothing else.

Videos are creeping their way into unlisted youtube uploads as we speak and the photos will be similarly anonymously hosted, if anyone wants to see them. Can also provide shots of the ticket, and whatever images Notts CC have online in relation to it. (But, right now, I have to dash, I need to be somewhere by 6.30...)

Ta much

Umkomaas

As we tend to major on private parking tickets here, PePiPoo will be your best bet for council tickets. Register there (but please note that a hotmail address won't work - try using a gmail account instead if you do have trouble registering) and post a new thread; here's your link:

http://forums.pepipoo.com/index.php?act=SF&s=&f=30

Have a read through some of the other threads there before you post your own to get the hang of what information they need from you in your opening post - but as a minimum you will need to post redacted photos/scans of all correspondence you've received from the council (both sides, if appropriate) as they need to see all the small print.

PePiPoo has an excellent success record in dealing with council tickets.

HTH

tahrey

Thanks. Hopefully they're OK with yahoo accounts, and me just copying and pasting the above spiel across as-is. Took long enough to type first time and I'm still suffering a little of the cold that robbed me of all the energy I might have used to get on top of the problem this week (...and on top of that, my internet now seems to be playing up).

I do have the on-the-scene pictures uploaded to imgur already, with the plates and other identifying features obscured, and those couple of videos (though I might need to make a new YT account as they went to one with my name on). Currently scanning the original dashcam memory card (put a temporary spare in for now) to see if I can get any of the earlier footage back, as it only seems to have officially used about 90% of the capacity, but it's not looking good. Unfortunately I live far enough away from the scene that going back to recreate the conditions would cost me as much as just coughing up.

Do have some other potentially supporting photos to upload as a second batch - namely, all the disabled spaces I've spotted whilst heading on foot to/from training course in brum, local doctor's surgery, early christmas shopping in the local town centre. The difference in how well they're marked and signed is pretty stark. Like, I wasn't even looking for them, they were just kind of there, and jumped out at me. There's no way you'd have any excuse for parking in them unless you were legally registered as too blind to drive in the first place (which would presumably get you a blue badge anyway), and that's rather the setup I'm used to from pretty much anywhere else I've ever been.

Will also have to do some Streetview screengrabs to include with those... and scan the ticket of course.