Armtrac BW legal court threat

lemonzaz

I have only just found this forum and am panicking. Quite a while ago, we parked on a beach car park. My partner had droven and parked and renewed the ticket
When we got back, the ticket had fallen off the dash and we had a penalty charge. Originally, i comtacted them and explained this. I also, stupidly, gave them the name of my partner, the driver as i was defending him. He has been having letters from them which we have completely ignored. Now he has a letter saying his case has been passed to BW legal. Im aware things are now serious and we (he?) needs to request a sar. As the vehicle keeper, do I need to request this or does he (as the letter is addressed to him). Could you help me form a letter to my mp and the land owner too please? ive never dealt with something like this and am worried my initial reaction has made things worse.

Redx

nobody received a PENALTY charge notice, total fiction, sorry

the pcn was a PARKING CHARGE NOTICE, or INVOICE

the person named on the paperwork needs to request the SAR from ARMTRAC using their DPO details

also, yours is similar to this one posted today too, so read that one

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/5933323

the NEWBIES FAQ sticky thread will help with this

YOU have nothing to fear, it is your partner that needs to deal with this and could be taken to court at your local county court

lemonzaz

thank you for your reply! Ive had a read of that thread and the sticky. Ive sent a SAR (in my partners name) to armtrac and have advised BW legal.

id also like to contact the landowner, but can not find a template to do so (and am not sure where to begin). Would anyone be able to link me to a template? And an MP template too if possible?

lemonzaz

Also, after discussing this matter with my mother, i found that an independant appeals chance (popla?) was not mentioned. This email was drafted and sent. Seen as its been passed on to BW legal now though and awaiting court, am i correct in thinking they will still take it to court anyway?

The place i recieved the ticket was Porth beach tourist park, Newquay.


'The letter I received the PCN on was headed with the IPC Operator logo. Having looked on the IPC web site I cannot however see this company listed. I have asked the IPC to confirm if this company is indeed a member and, if it is not, will be reporting the matter to ACTION FRAUD. Whilst wishing to be reasonable I am sure you will also accept that I have certain rights and that fraud in any form is unacceptable.

One of these rights is for notification of the ability to register an independent appeal. Should the PCN issuing company be a member of IPC then according to the rules to which they should abide they should have informed me of the ability to make an independent redress through the independent appeals service. I would highlight that till this time I have not been informed or offered this ability to make a formal appeal.

Having not been provided with notification of my rights then I am informing you of my intention to make a formal appeal to the IAS (whom I have found you are a member). This will be completed online via their web site (theias.org/appeal) within 14 days of receipt of the information I requested under the Subject Access Request (DPA/GDPR) presented to KBT Parking on 04 Dec 18 (and which may form part of my defence).

Although I acknowledge that the time frame for this matter has been elongated; I would point out that this could have been dealt with much sooner had I been provided with correct notification of my rights at an earlier point in time. I believe it is a fair and reasonable assumption that I should have been made aware of such rights and I would be prepared to offer this mitigation to a County Court should the matter be pursued in this way.

I also do not accept that the informal appeal process was correctly handled and specifically that a full reason for its decline was not provided. I do not believe that this is fair and reasonable as it does not allow me to offer comment or provide further information/mitigation. I can for example provide several witness statements for a formal appeal and/or County Court Judge. At no time was I asked if there were witnesses which I find quite inexplicable in making such decisions.

I would also like it to be taken on record that I expect all further charges to cease whilst the correct appeal process is undertaken.'

KeithP

Having looked on the IPC web site I cannot however see this company listed.

Armtrac Security Services is a trading style of KBT Cornwall Ltd.

KBT Cornwall Ltd is a member of the IPC's Accredited Operator Scheme.

IPC AOS members do not offer PoPLA as a second level appeal option.

lemonzaz

oh dear. That was sent in vain then. Thank you for telling me those details.
How do I progress once i recieve the SAR? I assume i will have to prepare for court?

The_Deep

It is the will of Parliament that these scammers be put out of business. Hopefully that will take place in the near future. The Bill has passed through the HOC without hitch, and goes to the Lords soon. In the meantime involve your MP, the poor dears are buckling under the weight of complaints about these scammers. Read this one which I wrote earlier

This is an entirely unregulated industry which is scamming the public with inflated claims for minor breaches of alleged contracts for alleged parking offences, aided and abetted by a handful of low-rent solicitors. Is has been suggested by an MP that some of these companies may have connections to organised crime.

Parking Eye, CPM, Smart, (especially Smart}, and others have already been named and shamed in the House of Commons as have Gladstones Solicitors, and BW Legal, (these two law firms take hundreds of these cases to court each week), hospital car parks and residential complex tickets have been especially mentioned. They lose most of them, and have been reported to the regulatory authority by an M.P. for unprofessional conduct

The problem has become so widespread that MPs have agreed to enact a Bill to regulate these scammers.

Sir Greg Knight's Private Members Bill to curb the excesses, and perhaps close down, some of these companies passed its Third Reading in late November, and, with a fair wind, will become Law next year.

All three readings are available to watch on the internet, (some 6-7 hours), and published in Hansard. MPs have an extremely low opinion of the industry. Many are complaining that they are becoming overwhelmed by complaints from members of the public. Add to their burden, complain in the most robust terms about the scammers.

Redx

lemonzaz wrote: »

oh dear. That was sent in vain then. Thank you for telling me those details.
How do I progress once i recieve the SAR? I assume i will have to prepare for court?

not necessarily, but you should prepare to receive an MCOL, which doesnt mean that court is inevitable, not unless the claimant pays the court fee

so whilst they may pay the MCOL fee and start the process, they may not pay the court fee, in which case it wont go to any court (but court is ALWAYS a possibility)

beamerguy

lemonzaz ... don't worry about court with BWLegal

Here is a Trustpilot review about being in court ...
https://uk.trustpilot.com/review/bwlegal.co.uk

See post from "John" dated 3rd Feb this year

QUOTE
"They sent a poor excuse for a local representative to fight me in court (he was wearing a scruffy suit and trainers and seemed to have less legal knowledge than me, a first time court-goer). He resorted to threatening me and telling me I had not filed some court documents in time (I had, it's just that BW Legal had been too incompetent to forward these to the local representative). Fortunately, the brilliant judge saw through their lies and threw the case out, she also awarded me ~£90 costs. I wouldn't be happy if I was their client!"

lemonzaz

The deep - thank you, thats a great example. I will get to sending one like that to my mp later.

RedX - thats really helpful to know, thank you. So just to clarify, we should NOT pay the court fee?

beamerguy - Thats a releif to hear �� hopefully we get someone incompetent too lol.


UPDATE:

I recieved the SAR from armtrac. It answers barely any of my questions. I asked for;
- All photos taken
- A close up of the signs on the day in question
- Evidence that you have paid a debt collector
- All letters/emails received, including the appeal correspondence
- The PDT machine record from the day in question, of payments made.
- All data held, all evidence you will rely on and a full copy of the PCN, NTK.
- A list of all PCN's you consider outstanding against myself and/or this VRN.

I got:
- the letters they sent me (standard)
- photos of my car at different angles
- photo of expired ticket but not of the new one on the windscreen.

Thats it!

What should i do now? Insist they send what i asked for? Or use their lack of evidence against them?

lemonzaz

Please?