ANPR charge in Belfast

stupot101

Hi, so I have looked at the FAQs but I'm still not sure where I stand with this.

We have received a charge from Civil Enforcement Ltd. We parked in the car park of a furniture store in Belfast in August for 50 minutes. Didn't notice the signs, but on looking at Google Street View they say "strictly Starplan customer parking only". The charge we received says that the "parking terms and conditions cleared stated on the signage - permits holders only.

So technically they are incorrect here?

If they have just made an admin error and the letter should have said "customers only" then I assume they actually check CCTV to see if we came into the store? We had intended to but ran out of time after having lunch in McDonalds next door.

Any advice appreciated. It's an NHS Fleet Solutions car if that makes any difference.

Redx

CEL wont be using or having any CCTV

for NI there is no keeper liability, so IGNORE but complain to the landowner or retailer and get it cancelled

stupot101

CCTV images of us driving in and out with the times were on the PCN.

Edit - sorry, I now see you probably meant they have no cctv to prove whether we actually went into the shop?

Redx

or ANPR images

beamerguy

CEL are like a bunch of rabbits with myxomatosis
They can pop out their holes at any time and try to scam the community

As it's NI, just ignore even though you might get a load of rubbish letters.

Myxomatosis can be passed to humans, so no contact with CEL

Redx

stupot101 wrote: »

Edit - sorry, I now see you probably meant they have no cctv to prove whether we actually went into the shop?

correct , they monitor vehicles at the car park ENTRANCE/EXIT with number plates, not people , then they use the DVLA to get KEEPER details (not drivers details)

there would be something wrong if they had pictures of everyone in N.I. and were using facial recognition to identify them individually (this isnt N.C.I.S. or BLINDSPOT or M.I.5 etc)

think about it , lol !


I suppose the issue here is this

Is this car park also for patrons of the fast food outlet ?
or just permit holders for the retailer itself ?

Fruitcake

As above, in NI you ignore the scammers unless you get real court papers. The sticky thread for NEWBIES explains all about this.

Always complain to the landowner.

Also complain to your MP about this unregulated scam.

stupot101

Redx wrote: »

correct , they monitor vehicles at the car park ENTRANCE/EXIT with number plates, not people , then they use the DVLA to get KEEPER details (not drivers details)

there would be something wrong if they had pictures of everyone in N.I. and were using facial recognition to identify them individually (this isnt N.C.I.S. or BLINDSPOT or M.I.5 etc)

think about it , lol !


I suppose the issue here is this

Is this car park also for patrons of the fast food outlet ?
or just permit holders for the retailer itself ?

Yeah, the images on the letter we received are just of our car coming in and out of the car park. They don't show the entrance of the shop. So I think they've just made a mistake here. Unless they are cross referencing against the shop's CCTV! "Permit holders" says to me that they think car park is for shop staff, but the signs clearly say it is for customers.

The McDonalds car park is in the same retail park, but it is separate. But if you genuinely intend to use a shop, but then can't, what are you meant to do!

Redx

if you are using McD then you use their private car park and nobody elses private car park , hence why this ANPR caught infringement led to CEL obtaining keeper details, they have no idea who was driving or where the occupants of the vehicle went but they know that the offending vehicle should not be there

they would not be allowed to cross reference against shop CCTV, they are a private company and not the police or council or MI5

stupot101

Spoke to the retailer. When entering the store you have to enter your car registration. They then check this against the CCTV. Even though we intended to go into the shop, I don't think I have any choice but to pay here. It's a lease car through my wife's employer so can't risk court action.