Can jobcentres apply universal credit conditionality to jsa claimants

donnajunkie

This is just an enquiry as i know of this happening to people. In an area where uc has been rolled out they are still on jsa and have found some jobcentre staff saying they must show actual evidence of what they do with staff saying its because things have changed. This has never been a requirement of jsa. I believe it is of uc, or am i wrong about that? Secondly they are being made to show their private online accounts including email so that the jobcentre can see their activity. Again isnt this just a uc condition? Or am i wrong about that. Are they breaking privacy/data protection laws by doing this regardless to whether you get jsa or uc?

calcotti

When I was on JSA five years I was required to provide evidence of my work search activities as required by my jobseeker agreement - I don’t think this is a new thing.

donnajunkie

calcotti wrote: »

When I was on JSA five years I was required to provide evidence of my work search activities as required by my jobseeker agreement - I don’t think this is a new thing.

I believe you can provide your evidence anyway you wish even in written form or verbally. They used to provide booklets for this that are phased out for uc because you have an online journal instead. Did they ask for copies of each application you did or ask you to log into your online accounts in front of them?

calcotti

donnajunkie wrote: »

I believe you can provide your evidence anyway you wish even in written form or verbally. They used to provide booklets for this that are phased out for uc. Did they ask for copies of each application you did or ask you to log into your online accounts in front of them?

Ok I get it. Your initial post referred to having to provide actual evidence and I was recording that actual evidence was required. At the time I was on JSA we were supposed to use Universl Jobsearch but it was rubbish so I provided a manual record with print outs of emails etc.

I think you’re more specifically concerned about being required to access email accounts in front of DWP staff. That’s not something I experience but it wasn’t possible then as I didn’t have any smart phone etc. Nor access to a computer at the JobCentre.

donnajunkie

calcotti wrote: »

Ok I get it. Your initial post referred to having to provide actual evidence and I was recording that actual evidence was required. At the time I was on JSA we were supposed to use Universl Jobsearch but it was rubbish so I provided a manual record with print outs of emails etc.

I think you’re more specifically concerned about being required to access email accounts in front of DWP staff. That’s not something I experience but it wasn’t possible then as I didn’t have any smart phone etc. Nor access to a computer at the JobCentre.

They have computers at jobcentres now i believe. What i have learned is that staff have changed what they ask of people since uc was rolled out and they have had their uc training. What i am mainly curious about is in two parts, can they apply uc conditionality to jsa claimants and are they breaking the law if they require you to allow them to look at your private online accounts including email.

calcotti

For UC the Advice to Decision Makers says


J3102 Evidence of work search includes
1. evidence from employers, employment agencies or other bodies that the claimant has contacted
2. the claimant’s activity on Universal Jobmatch
3. copies of letters or applications that the claimant has sent to employers on-
line, by post or in person
4. the claimant's uncorroborated written evidence (claimants should keep a record of their job search and other efforts to find work)
5. the claimant's own verbal evidence, recorded by an officer of the Jobcentre Plus office.

J3103 Corroboration of the claimant’s evidence is not essential (see ADM Chapter A1). DMs should note that
1. claimants will not always be able to obtain corroborative evidence if they state that they have
1.1 “asked around” or
1.2 applied for jobs that are normally advertised and filled by word of
mouth and
2. employers do not always reply to written enquiries.

J3104 If the DM has reason to doubt whether a claimant has contacted certain employers or agencies those employers or agencies may be asked whether they
1. keep a record of enquiries by job seekers and
2. are able to confirm that a particular person approached them for employment.
But such enquiries should only be necessary if the evidence before the DM is inconsistent or seems unlikely.

bigbill

No to both:

On JSA by law you are required to carry out at least two actions per week that would give you a reasonable chance of finding work, so they can ask you to do more in your claimant commitment but that is just a wish list.

Data protection law does not allow anyone access to your JSA account without your consent, anyone on JSA can withdraw consent and should do to prevent JC staff snooping.

donnajunkie

bigbill wrote: »

No to both:

On JSA by law you are required to carry out at least two actions per week that would give you a reasonable chance of finding work, so they can ask you to do more in your claimant commitment but that is just a wish list.

Data protection law does not allow anyone access to your JSA account without your consent, anyone on JSA can withdraw consent and should do to prevent JC staff snooping.

Ujm has been replaced by findajob website which does not have the inbuilt facility to allow access like ujm did. I believe certain staff are expecting people to log onto the likes of findajob, reed, indeed, hotmail, etc infront of them and allow them to look at everything there. They even added this requirement to a persons jsa agreement which said this person will bring their log in details for online sites and email each time they attend the jobcentre.

Ineededaname

You may want to read this recent FOI request - https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/information_regarding_35_hour_a

Specifically:
'These requirements differ, as they are governed by different legislation, depending on whether making a claim to Universal Credit is available.

The Jobseeker’s Regulations 1996 detail the work related requirements of those JSA claimants for whom Universal Credit is not available. '

'The work related requirements of JSA claimants for whom Universal Credit is available to claim are detailed in the Jobseeker’s Allowance Regulations 2013. '

Here's a link to that legislation - http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2013/378/pdfs/uksi_20130378_280218_en.pdf

You can also see the 'Claimant responsibilities after introduction of universal credit' section of the Welfare Reform Act 2012 -
http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2012/5/part/2/chapter/1/crossheading/claimant-responsibilities-after-introduction-of-universal-credit/enacted

Note specifically:
'
The Secretary of State may, for the purpose of verifying the claimant’s compliance with a work-related requirement, require a claimant to—
(a)
provide to the Secretary of State information and evidence specified by the Secretary of State in a manner so specified;
(b)
confirm compliance in a manner so specified.'

Despite all of the above I would expect that requesting people to log into their own personal e-mail accounts in front of them would violate other laws and could be refused.

Please note I've no legal background and just looked this up out of my own interest. Feel free to make what you will of the links provided.

donnajunkie

Ineededaname wrote: »

You may want to read this recent FOI request - https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/information_regarding_35_hour_a

Specifically:
'These requirements differ, as they are governed by different legislation, depending on whether making a claim to Universal Credit is available.

The Jobseeker’s Regulations 1996 detail the work related requirements of those JSA claimants for whom Universal Credit is not available. '

'The work related requirements of JSA claimants for whom Universal Credit is available to claim are detailed in the Jobseeker’s Allowance Regulations 2013. '

Here's a link to that legislation - http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2013/378/pdfs/uksi_20130378_280218_en.pdf

You can also see the 'Claimant responsibilities after introduction of universal credit' section of the Welfare Reform Act 2012 -
http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2012/5/part/2/chapter/1/crossheading/claimant-responsibilities-after-introduction-of-universal-credit/enacted

Note specifically:
'
The Secretary of State may, for the purpose of verifying the claimant’s compliance with a work-related requirement, require a claimant to—
(a)
provide to the Secretary of State information and evidence specified by the Secretary of State in a manner so specified;
(b)
confirm compliance in a manner so specified.'

Despite all of the above I would expect that requesting people to log into their own personal e-mail accounts in front of them would violate other laws and could be refused.

Please note I've no legal background and just looked this up out of my own interest. Feel free to make what you will of the links provided.

Thankyou, i didnt see anything that says jsa claimants can be subjected to uc conditionality or what they can require you to show, online accounts etc. but it is quite big and i may have missed it.