Incorrectly stopped for driving without insurance - are my insurance co in the wrong?

ruthyjo

My insurance policy automatically renewed yesterday (05/11). This morning on my way to work, on the motorway, but due to volume of traffic travelling only at about 40mph, I was pulled over by a police car which came up behind me with lights flashing etc. The police stated that I had been pulled over because the PNC showed that I was driving without insurance. I was given a form to produce my insurance documents at a police station within seven days.

After a few anxious minutes where I questioned to myself whether the insurance did actually renew automatically or whether I should have done something I was able to confirm with my insurance company that I was insured and having got home and checked I have a valid certificate which I can produce at the police station.

I was pretty upset by the experience and severely delayed in getting to work.

It seems to me that my insurance company have failed to update details of my policy to the PNC. In consequence I've missed a meeting at work, spent half the morning not properly concentrating at work and have a long round trip to my nearest manned police station.

What would be the normal expectation of what the insurance company should do when renewing a policy? Surely most policies would be on the PNC after 24 hours - otherwise approx 1 in 365 drivers would be liable to be stopped incorrectly by the police. If the insurance company have done something remiss I want to complain to them - not because I expect any compensation but just to emphasise the distress and inconvenience their actions have caused.

saintjanet

You are right the updates are not done as they occur,i have heard of people having their car confiscated!!,in rare cases and having to pay to get it back even though their insurance has been legal.It seems to happen alot in certain areas, Merseyside,allegedly,being one of them,there have been some horror stories on local radio.

Someone said the updates are done every three months,a ridiculous situation if it is true.Oh ,editing to say this was a policeman who said it!!!

One answer is to carry your insurance certificate with you.

Alias_Omega

unfortunately just one of them things, just shows that they are watching you and probably had ANPR on the car or so to illustrate that they use it.

if you carry a photocopy of your V5, insurance certificate and MOT in the car at all times, these are ideal for this kind of scenario. Another one could be if you are stopped by a local police officer who is not in touch with a computer system..

luxor4t

We were stopped (without the palaver you were subject to) and told we had no insurance according to the police computer. As soon as my husband told them the name of our insurance company we were allowed to continue - we were not asked to produce any documents.

We had found our company through Martin's method and insured via Quidco about 10 weeks earlier, which holds with what you said about irregular updating.

Without naming the company directly, our insurance cover brings to mind a fast bird!

ruthyjo

They did have ANPR in the car as I got in it (was pulled onto the hard shoulder of the motorway) and I saw the camera. They knew and confirmed to me that I had MOT, road tax and a valid driving license and I was not told to produce any of those.

I could not carry a copy of my insurance certificate with me as despite the automatic renewal the certificate was not posted to me until Saturday 03/11 and I hadn't received it before setting out for work this morning although it did arrive in today's post. I'll have a duplicate this year as the insurance company have sent me out another copy as a result of my conversation with them to confirm I was insured.

I would love to know what the normal practice is for insurance companies on updating these things onto the PNC so I know if we are all vulnerable to this or if I have a particularly poor insurance company and they should not have put me in this position.

It's occurred to me tonight that:

I could easily have been observed by many people at work from chief exec downwards and they would all probably assume I had done something wrong

I would have been very concerned from a safety point of view if I had been pulled up on a motorway with my 3 children in the car - they wouldn't all have fitted in the police car but I would not want to leave them in my car on the hard shoulder

Could being stopped for this have led to in any way to having to give a DNA sample? - I would be very annoyed to end up on the DNA database

Only the first of these things possibly happened so I guess I'll have to chalk it up to experience and it's bad luck for the client charged for the first two hours of my time this morning - cost them the equivalent of about six months insurance for my car by the time I got to work and calmed down.

peterbaker

This is not just one of those things - as you have noticed, those police removed your right of freedom until you talked them into giving it back.

I have never really looked up the definition of "police state" but I assume we are fast approaching full compliance with it.

What a totally awful situation we have got ourselves into in the UK.

No crimes solved without CCTV. So much CCTV that we are all recorded every day. Latest developments is that what we say will also be recorded in some city centres. No police traffic convictions without cameras, doubtful technology and access to all private data they want, and the apparent god-given police right to make a hash of collecting the data and in using it.

I got stopped for not displaying a tax disc a month or two ago. It was a vehicle I dont use daily and I'd retaxed it but forgotten to take the new disc with me that morning to put in the vehicle for the first journey since I'd renewed. Fair cop!

My story was verified in seconds by the policeman's laptop in his motor.

But the penalty I had to pay was to stand in full view of all the local traffic and busy pavement in this particular South London high street and blow into a breathalyzer:rotfl: ... something about being seen to balance up certain comparative statistics? :T


That's the second time I've been a 'comparative stop and have a chat' statistic in the past 24 months. First time I said OK, but no you can't have my name and address for your database because I don't wish to be on it thanks, and as I have not broken any law (on that occasion), that's the way it will remain if you don't mind officers! That threw them a bit. That's when the one in charge said 'Sorry Sir, but we need to be seen to ... balance the numbers ... didadida' :rolleyes:

I think this kind of 'intelligence' (sic) based policing and database-filling is getting out of control in this country.

Kick up too much fuss about it and I suppose those who can't humour the policeman into early release might easily become labelled as difficult citizens ... sad really ...

But as for keeping all the documents in the car to prove I am legal at all times ... nah, personally I think I'll continue to have a little sport before I die


Hey and what's that you are saying about a client charged for the first two hours of your time this morning? Forgive me if I have got hold of the wrong end of the stick now, but that sounds worse than the thread topic ???

ruthyjo

I don't feel on the information I have at the moment that the police did anything wrong in stopping me - according to the data they had I was breaking the law. Having been through the pain in the past of being hit by an uninsured driver in the past I'm quite happy for uninsured drivers to be penalised. Arguably it should have been obvious to the police that it was unlikely I was uninsured because of the car I was driving, the time (7 am commute to work) and the business dress I was wearing. I think they recognised I was most likely insured as they were completely pleasant and quite chatty to me, but they were only acting on their data which did say different.

Initially it seems to me that it is the insurance company rather than the police who are under the obligation to update details of policies sold. Surely if the police were aware they weren't updating data onto their own database they would not use it?

I would still love to know though if it is likely to be the police or the insurance company who are at fault for up to date data not being available - anyone have any inside info or experience of this?

peterbaker

ruthyjo ... isn't it obvious who is at fault? If you accuse someone of an offence, you best be sure of your facts first right? There's your answer.

Now then, what was all that about charging a client for your first two hours?? I thought you had explained you were otherwise engaged??

I am sure that rather like the police matter, things can be rectified somewhat? Right? Or has the whole world gone mad?

arnie&caseysma!

Ruthyjo, unfortunately not all insurance companies supply details of policies to PNC which I think is wrong so it may be that your company is actually one of these and it was showing that insurance was not held rather than it being expired. It is a total inconvenience being stopped but there are some people out there (wearing business suits and driving a car that you would think would definitely be insured) who think they are above the law and don't need these things.

MOT and driving licence details are automatically available as DVLA is linked to PNC now and all the details are recorded. It may not help but under data protection the officers have to log the fact that they have checked you in their official notebooks should they be asked questions in future. This record may not have been written in your presence but during them writing up their notes very shortly after you were on your way.

The form you were given to produce your insurance document asks you to specify the police station that you wish to produce it. This need not be the one local to your house but can be one that you pass on your way to work/home/supermarket etc which may have made life a little easier for you. Just remember to produce the certificate within 7 days or they will be obliged to report you for either failing to have the required insurance or failing to produce the document (usually one or the other, not both).

I see before you asked about DNA. Do not worry, this stop would not have resulted in you having to provide a sample and be on the database as officers are only empowered by law to take these samples when a person is ARRESTED AND CHARGED with an offence so you have nothing to worry about there (unless you are going to take up drink driving and getting the jail for it!).

A routine stop, do not fret, and I am glad to hear you got sorted with the insurance company who confirmed you were covered.

ruthyjo

Thanks - I'm not really fretting any more. Just feeling indignant, as being treated to sirens etc did not feel particularly routine at the time!

I went through a couple of potential police stations to produce docs at with the police but they transpired to be all unmanned so I was forced to opt for one a fair way away.

I'm not that impressed that I was stopped and cautioned if there's a legitimate possibility that I'm insured with a company that does not pass data to the police. The information they had was certainly about no insurance rather than expired insurance. When I come to renew my policy in a mere 364 days I'll ask about updates to the PNC when I'm getting a quote.

goldspanners

Alias_Omega wrote: »

unfortunately just one of them things, just shows that they are watching you and probably had ANPR on the car or so to illustrate that they use it.

if you carry a photocopy of your V5, insurance certificate and MOT in the car at all times, these are ideal for this kind of scenario. Another one could be if you are stopped by a local police officer who is not in touch with a computer system..

i dont think this is one of those things,thier information is not 100% reliable as not all insurers disclose this information.

and DONT keep you documents in the car,you are not legally required to do so and secondly what if your car is broken into,the glove box gets emptied and someone clones you registration number or even rings another car with your details,they also have your home address which they could match up to those house keys that may be in there too and cash in your tax disc. :T