Purchasing prooerty with solar panels. How do I know if owned or leased?

beckym1987

Hi guys,

Hopefully someone can help. My OH and I are purchasing a property with solar panels which when we didn't initially realise as we had an early viewing of the house before it was advertised and we also didn't pay much attention to the roof. The EA who showed up around the property didn't mention the solar panels but it was her first time viewing the property also so didn't know much. The seller didn't mention them either.

We found out after our offer was accepted and after paying for a survey. The survey report came back saying solar panels - owned. The survey was a mortgage survey.

We are now at the stage where we have everything and just need to sign the contract. Yesterday we finally received the fixtures and fittings list after much chasing and it asks a few questions about the solar panels. Date fitted and are they owned are both answered as 'unknown' then it asks about lease forms and it says 'to follow'.

I have contacted the seller (who isn't really the seller as the house is in her dad's name as she couldn't get a mortgage at the time) and she is adamant that they're owned, her dad is adamant that they're owned but they have no paperwork and she said she gets a reduction from her electric bills but doesn't seem to know what a FIT payment is.

This is a huge red flag and from the details I'm now getting I would assume that they're leased. If they are leased, how would I know? Would this have come up with my solicitor or should it have come up in the survey?

Basically we are a few days from signing which everything would have gone through with me thinking they're owned when they may be leased, but I have no idea how to find out either way.

Please help!

pinklady21

They would surely know if they were getting a FiT payment - they need to take a meter reading every quarter for the electricity company to work out the amount due and then pay the cash directly into the householder's bank account.
I have heard of schemes where there is a green deal type loan used to pay for the panels that remains with the property.
Clearly, this is not good news for you though!

If there is a FiT, then find out which electricity co is paying it and phone them up and ask them what the transfer process is.

Who installed them and when? Was it the father who signed up?
I suspect you are correct to be concerned, and I would be surprised if your solicitor allows you to exchange with these current "unknowns."
Best of luck.

eddddy

beckym1987 wrote: »

Yesterday we finally received the fixtures and fittings list after much chasing and it asks a few questions about the solar panels. Date fitted and are they owned are both answered as 'unknown' then it asks about lease forms and it says 'to follow'.

I have contacted the seller (who isn't really the seller as the house is in her dad's name as she couldn't get a mortgage at the time) and she is adamant that they're owned, her dad is adamant that they're owned but they have no paperwork and she said she gets a reduction from her electric bills but doesn't seem to know what a FIT payment is.

A cynical person might find the above suspicious.

The fixtures and fittings list forms part of the contract... and the seller is saying that ownership of the panels is unknown.

But informally (outside the contract), the seller is adamant that they own the panels.

If they are so adamant, why don't they state that within the contract?


In your position, I would want my solicitor to make further pre-contract enquiries to establish ownership of the panels.

beckym1987

I have emailed my mortgage advisor querying how the mortgage survey got their information that they were owned. Would they take it word of mouth from the seller? Surely they would need to see documentation? Our mortgage company has approved a mortgage on possibly a lie from this survey.

The EA are quite positive that because the seller hasn't received any documentation in the 4 years that they're owned, but if they're on a lease, why would she receive any letters?

She said she doesn't know about any FIT payments and she just gets a reduction in her electricity bill, which I would assume means that it's a lease.

I don't understand how this didn't come up when they purchased the house and why it is only coming up at this stage because I'm querying it now. My solicitor emailed the forms through but clearly she hasn't even bothered looking at them otherwise you would assume she would have mentioned something.

Seriously I'm in such a panic now as this sale could have gone all the way through if we hadn't queried it. We should have exchanged on Friday but I delayed it because I was adamant I wanted the fixtures and fittings form first.

She has ticked unknown as she doesn't actually know. She is 'pretty sure' and her dad (the real owner) is also 'pretty sure' that they're owned just because they would have thought they would have received something by now from the leasing company. But why would they if the lease wasn't originally with them?

If they're leased, do they still need to give a meter reading? My mum has solar panels and she purchased them and she said that she gets reduced electric PLUS she gets FIT payments of around £500 per year and of they're owned then someone must be getting the FIT payment.

It was the previous owner who had them installed and not the current owner so they don't seem to have any idea. You would have thought it would have come up when they purchased the house? Isn't it a Solicitors job to check this?

Cakeguts

We have solar panels and you don't get a reduction from you electricity bill what you get is a payment for the electricity that is deemed to have gone into the grid. She would know if she was getting this because you have to read the meter to find out how much the panels have produced.



Do you know what the EPC for the house is because you don't get the FiT payment if the house is in a lower grade than a D?



I suppose someone could have installed them just to get cheaper electricity but if they have done a DIY job then you will have to get them checked to make sure that they have been installed correctly and aren't damaging the roof. You will also have to check that the electrical work has been done safely. If it has then they would know how much they paid for them or they would know if they are leased. Either way they can't just say unknown because they must know.

davidmcn

beckym1987 wrote: »

I have emailed my mortgage advisor querying how the mortgage survey got their information that they were owned. Would they take it word of mouth from the seller? Surely they would need to see documentation? Our mortgage company has approved a mortgage on possibly a lie from this survey.

The surveyor wouldn't know whether or not they were owned (in the same way that they don't usually see title deeds, consents for alterations, etc). Are you sure that's not just one of their assumptions, and it's for the solicitor to come back to tell them if they were wrong?

The mortgage offer is subject to the solicitor confirming that 101 other things are ok, including any solar panels, it's not evidence that the lender is already satisfied.

AnotherJoe

I agree its a massive red flag. Do they not have receipts for the work done when they bought them?

sevenhills

beckym1987 wrote: »

My mum has solar panels and she purchased them and she said that she gets reduced electric PLUS she gets FIT payments of around £500 per year and of they're owned then someone must be getting the FIT payment.

It was the previous owner who had them installed and not the current owner so they don't seem to have any idea. You would have thought it would have come up when they purchased the house? Isn't it a Solicitors job to check this?

If no one is getting a FIT payment, then they do not own them. I get around £250+ per year from my panels and some free electricity.
Not sure what must happen to satisfy your solicitor and mortgage provider, but not owning the panels would not break the deal for me.
It could be a way to knock a few thousand off the asking price, although free electricity is a posative, but not everyone likes them.


When I bought my house, ownership was transfered to me, and it was simple, but I have read where it is a nightmare just to get in touch with the owners of the panels, search for 'a shade greener'.


https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/5651816/a-shade-greener

beckym1987

I think the issue is that it was the previous owner that installed them or had them installed. The second issue is that when these owners bought the house, the sale went through with no questions or queries about the solar panels and they must not have asked for any information as to who fitted them, certificates of installation, receipts etc.
We want all this and they don't have any information.
If you buy a property with a lease, do you not have to have a copy of the lease when you exchange contracts?
The fixtures and fittings came to me Friday afternoon so I guess I will have to wait until next week when my solicitor gets back to work.
If it is leased then depending on what the lease agreement contains, it might put us off as one of the selling points for me was that we were saving enough money to enable us to pay for an extension which I know some solar panel leases can affect this. Other leases show that it's up to the owner to pay for maintenance etc of the panels, which is fine of you own them but not ok if you dont.

beckym1987

Cakeguts wrote: »

Do you know what the EPC for the house is because you don't get the FiT payment if the house is in a lower grade than a D?

The EPC certificate I got from EA at the beginning says it's a D (60) and this is from August 2011 which is BEFORE the solar panels were installed as I know the previous owners purchased the property in November 2011

hjd

sevenhills wrote: »

If no one is getting a FIT payment, then they do not own them.

Not necessarily true. We are the second owners of our house. All the ones on our side of the road have a couple of panels on the roof. Basically the solar energy is used to heat the hot water so in the summer we use hardly any gas, as the water is already hot and doesn't need to be heated again. There are no FIT payments and no meter readings needed, just lower bills in the summer.