We’d like to remind Forumites to please avoid political debate on the Forum.

This is to keep it a safe and useful space for MoneySaving discussions. Threads that are – or become – political in nature may be removed in line with the Forum’s rules. Thank you for your understanding.

PLEASE READ BEFORE POSTING: Hello Forumites! In order to help keep the Forum a useful, safe and friendly place for our users, discussions around non-MoneySaving matters are not permitted per the Forum rules. While we understand that mentioning house prices may sometimes be relevant to a user's specific MoneySaving situation, we ask that you please avoid veering into broad, general debates about the market, the economy and politics, as these can unfortunately lead to abusive or hateful behaviour. Threads that are found to have derailed into wider discussions may be removed. Users who repeatedly disregard this may have their Forum account banned. Please also avoid posting personally identifiable information, including links to your own online property listing which may reveal your address. Thank you for your understanding.
📨 Have you signed up to the Forum's new Email Digest yet? Get a selection of trending threads sent straight to your inbox daily, weekly or monthly!

Rules on Entry/Exit to properties

1235»

Comments

  • EachPenny
    EachPenny Posts: 12,239 Forumite
    10,000 Posts Combo Breaker
    CarrieVS wrote: »
    Just for the sake of clarity, OP has to provide a gas safety certificate, and also check right to rent, even if the rent-payer is a genuine lodger.

    OP, all this discussion of tenant vs lodger is incidental to your actual question, but people are just concerned for you, and trying to help. You appear to have been mistaken about the legal status of your flatmate, and thus far it's not been at all clear whether or not you are aware of all the ramifications of them being a tenant - that it's not merely a matter of which word you use to describe them.
    Furthermore, as the OP refers to "feedback" from the Council (the building owner) rather than obtaining their 'permission', then it is doubtful whether the OP has truly grasped the legal ramifications of what they are proposing:-
    Alz1986 wrote: »
    None of this is an issue, I don't intend to illegally evict, there will be an agreement on notice written up. I am happy to accept council's feedback on whether a lodger or sub-tenant is acceptable.
    "In the future, everyone will be rich for 15 minutes"
  • OP - when the Council merged the two properties, did they permanently fix the second exit door i.e. is it screwed shut?
  • hb2
    hb2 Posts: 1,399 Forumite
    Seventh Anniversary 1,000 Posts Name Dropper
    CarrieVS wrote: »
    Just for the sake of clarity, OP has to provide a gas safety certificate, and also check right to rent, even if the rent-payer is a genuine lodger.

    Thank you - it is decades since we last had a lodger so I wasn't aware of that.
    It's not difficult!
    'Wander' - to walk or move in a leisurely manner.
    'Wonder' - to feel curious.
  • Alz1986
    Alz1986 Posts: 123 Forumite
    Fifth Anniversary 100 Posts
    edited 23 October 2018 at 3:43PM
    OP - when the Council merged the two properties, did they permanently fix the second exit door i.e. is it screwed shut?

    No it was not permanently fixed. It has handles and locks to open and close.
    EachPenny wrote: »
    Furthermore, as the OP refers to "feedback" from the Council (the building owner) rather than obtaining their 'permission', then it is doubtful whether the OP has truly grasped the legal ramifications of what they are proposing:-



    Councils do generally run an housing advice service, they will be able to advise if what I describe is a sub-tenant or a lodger, (as you say, "regardless of what I think"). So long as it ensures I have access to toilets I am happy to work with either option.
  • Alz1986
    Alz1986 Posts: 123 Forumite
    Fifth Anniversary 100 Posts
    CarrieVS wrote: »
    Just for the sake of clarity, OP has to provide a gas safety certificate, and also check right to rent, even if the rent-payer is a genuine lodger.

    OP, all this discussion of tenant vs lodger is incidental to your actual question, but people are just concerned for you, and trying to help. You appear to have been mistaken about the legal status of your flatmate, and thus far it's not been at all clear whether or not you are aware of all the ramifications of them being a tenant - that it's not merely a matter of which word you use to describe them.

    I think people (looking down their nose) generally assume that if a council tenant is subletting or lodging they are doing something criminal - ignoring or not aware that as a tenant you have the legal right to sublet or take in a lodger. Refusal from the council landlord must be backed up with good reason. If their reasons for refusal is unclear, they are breaching your legal right.

    This is similar to owning your home, where you must sign documents and inform/ask permission to council AND lender. There are many homeowners who let their property without having gone through the correct procedures.
  • Comms69
    Comms69 Posts: 14,229 Forumite
    10,000 Posts Third Anniversary Name Dropper
    Alz1986 wrote: »
    I think people (looking down their nose) generally assume that if a council tenant is subletting or lodging they are doing something criminal - literally no-one thinks that. The vast majority of people on here know better than to think something quite so naïve. - ignoring or not aware that as a tenant you have the legal right to sublet - with permission or take in a lodger - absolutely . Refusal from the council landlord must be backed up with good reason. - incorrect If their reasons for refusal is unclear, they are breaching your legal right. - rubbish

    This is similar to owning your home, where you must sign documents and inform/ask permission to council AND lender. - No-one who owns their home has to ask the council about either a tenancy or a lodger (unless it's a HMO with licencing) There are many homeowners who let their property without having gone through the correct procedures.



    Yes there are. That is irrelevant. (and you don't understand the procedures)
  • EachPenny
    EachPenny Posts: 12,239 Forumite
    10,000 Posts Combo Breaker
    Alz1986 wrote: »
    Councils do generally run an housing advice service, they will be able to advise if what I describe is a sub-tenant or a lodger, (as you say, "regardless of what I think"). So long as it ensures I have access to toilets I am happy to work with either option.
    Yes, they do provide advice services.

    But you are still missing the point that what you need is not 'advice' nor 'feedback' but almost certainly the consent of the Council (as landlord) if you (a) sub-let and (b) make arrangements such as using a door you've apparently been asked not to do, in order to facilitate (a).
    "In the future, everyone will be rich for 15 minutes"
  • Alz1986
    Alz1986 Posts: 123 Forumite
    Fifth Anniversary 100 Posts
    Comms69 wrote: »

    I think people (looking down their nose) generally assume that if a council tenant is subletting or lodging they are doing something criminal - literally no-one thinks that. The vast majority of people on here know better than to think something quite so naïve. - ignoring or not aware that as a tenant you have the legal right to sublet - with permission or take in a lodger - absolutely . Refusal from the council landlord must be backed up with good reason. - incorrect If their reasons for refusal is unclear, they are breaching your legal right. - rubbish

    This is similar to owning your home, where you must sign documents and inform/ask permission to council AND lender. - No-one who owns their home has to ask the council about either a tenancy or a lodger (unless it's a HMO with licencing) There are many homeowners who let their property without having gone through the correct procedures.
    Originally posted by Alz1986

    Yes there are. That is irrelevant. (and you don't understand the procedures)

    You contradict yourself as you say you do require permission on some occasions if you are a home owner. You do also require permission from your lender who on technicality owns the property, and you may be changing the use of the property. The local authority will stop you if they suspect there will be overcrowding, even if you "own" your property. Many councils now want a list of people who are occupying the houses/flats.

    Same with tenant - you do not require permission from council to take a lodger, but you must inform them that you have done so. For subtenant- you require permission.

    You're wrong and you need to fact check - it is your legal right to sublet. They will not refuse you permission unless there will be overcrowding.

    The council may own the property - but they are an organisation, and they can't just do what they "please". Decisions need to be based on informed facts and agreements in consultation. Decisions need to be backed up by strong evidence, not just feelings and prejudices.
  • davidmcn
    davidmcn Posts: 23,596 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 10,000 Posts Name Dropper
    Alz1986 wrote: »
    You do also require permission from your lender who on technicality owns the property
    No they don't. You own the property. Your lender has a charge over the property.
  • Comms69
    Comms69 Posts: 14,229 Forumite
    10,000 Posts Third Anniversary Name Dropper
    Alz1986 wrote: »
    You contradict yourself as you say you do require permission on some occasions if you are a home owner. - No, you require a licence if you want to do something specific. General letting to one person, or getting a lodger, requires no licence. Think of it as passing your driving test, then wanting to drive a HGV - you need something extra. You do also require permission from your lender who on technicality owns the property - you require consent to let, for a tenant. No the lender does not own the property. , and you may be changing the use of the property. - No The local authority will stop you if they suspect there will be overcrowding - define overcrowding. , even if you "own" your property. Many councils now want a list of people who are occupying the houses/flats. - All councils will want a list, in the form of an electoral role, if that's what you mean. But the LL is under no obligation to provide such a list.

    Same with tenant - you do not require permission from council to take a lodger, but you must inform them that you have done so. - Only if you no longer receive or are eligible a single person discount on council tax For subtenant- you require permission. - if the council is your landlord, yes.

    You're wrong and you need to fact check - it is your legal right to sublet. - No such right exists. But if I'm wrong, I'm sure the Human Rights Act will list it somewhere. Or another piece of statute; an you will kindly link it. They will not refuse you permission unless there will be overcrowding. - They can refuse you permission because they don't like you

    The council may own the property - but they are an organisation, and they can't just do what they "please". - yes they can. Decisions need to be based on informed facts and agreements in consultation - please don't start spouting nonsense . Decisions need to be backed up by strong evidence, not just feelings and prejudices.



    You're wishful thinking will get you nowhere.


    A landlord, whether council or private, is free to accept or reject requests on a case by case basis.


    Unless they refuse for one of the (very few) reasons protected by the equality act you have no recompense.
This discussion has been closed.
Meet your Ambassadors

🚀 Getting Started

Hi new member!

Our Getting Started Guide will help you get the most out of the Forum

Categories

  • All Categories
  • 352K Banking & Borrowing
  • 253.5K Reduce Debt & Boost Income
  • 454.2K Spending & Discounts
  • 245K Work, Benefits & Business
  • 600.6K Mortgages, Homes & Bills
  • 177.4K Life & Family
  • 258.8K Travel & Transport
  • 1.5M Hobbies & Leisure
  • 16.2K Discuss & Feedback
  • 37.6K Read-Only Boards

Is this how you want to be seen?

We see you are using a default avatar. It takes only a few seconds to pick a picture.