Solar - any time left?

ballisticbrian

I'm a bit late to the party on this but I read they can be done still until March 2019.

Did any of the changes to the subsidy occur mentioned in this MSE link https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/tips/25-11-2015/#solar

or when they say there is still time, is this now on a reduced subsidy?

Merlin139

Fit rate till 31/12/18 is now 3.86p per kWh for everything produced.

Rate reduces to 3.79p per kWh from 01/01/19-31/03/19

Once registered rate will increase each year from the following April based on the RPI for the previous year.

Export rate is now 5.24p per kWh on 50% of what is produced.

jimjames

ballisticbrian wrote: »

I'm a bit late to the party on this but I read they can be done still until March 2019.

Did any of the changes to the subsidy occur mentioned in this MSE link https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/tips/25-11-2015/#solar

or when they say there is still time, is this now on a reduced subsidy?

Solar can be done at any time. Time limit is for claiming FIT for new installation but it's not so significant now anyway

ballisticbrian

Time limit is for claiming FIT for new installation but it's not so significant now anyway

Is it possible to explain this to the complete outsider, thank you.

Zarch

jimjames wrote: »

Solar can be done at any time. Time limit is for claiming FIT for new installation but it's not so significant now anyway

I don't agree, the FIT is still hugely significant.

A 4Kw system will likely generate 3700kWh each year, which still yields around £240 per year in generation and export at current FIT rates. And as its inflation linked means that should get around £2800 in the first 10 years and around £6500 in the fixed 20 year term.

So FIT goes a long way towards paying for the install and providing some longer term profit.

These figures obviously don't include any energy savings that Solar also brings.

When FIT disappears next year the incentive to install will only be energy savings. I'm not sure many could get their money back over 20 years on energy savings, let alone see any profit. Unless install prices drop significantly.

So for me, the current FIT is still quite significant if you're considering a solar installation before the end of March 2019.

ballisticbrian

So for me, the current FIT is still quite significant if you're considering a solar installation before the end of March 2019.

Is it possible to explain in a nut shell what I have missed out on in terms of the tariff and any other incentives. Not that I had the money back then, but I mean, who like to arrive at their holiday destination, and everyone tells you they booked last year and got 50% off???

Zarch

ballisticbrian wrote: »

Is it possible to explain in a nut shell what I have missed out on in terms of the tariff and any other incentives. Not that I had the money back then, but I mean, who like to arrive at their holiday destination, and everyone tells you they booked last year and got 50% off???

Full historical FIT rates are here.

https://www.ofgem.gov.uk/environmental-programmes/fit/fit-tariff-rates

For example, in October 2014 the generation tariff was 15p, October 2018 its less than 4p.

But you have to counter that it only costs £4k to £5k to install a 4Kw system today, whereas 4 years ago it would have cost you significantly more to install.

So the outlay was more in the past, but the rewards were better too.

M0ney

Is it possible to turn this decision around? I was going to write to my MP about it, he is a Tory.


To me removing the FiT smacks of nothing but anti-green. Especially when you consider that Hinkley point would now be getting well over 10p/KWh, there's no reason why we can't give at least that to those producing electricity through solar.

Martyn1981

M0ney wrote: »

Is it possible to turn this decision around? I was going to write to my MP about it, he is a Tory.


To me removing the FiT smacks of nothing but anti-green. Especially when you consider that Hinkley point would now be getting well over 10p/KWh, there's no reason why we can't give at least that to those producing electricity through solar.

I agree, but just for clarification, the 10p/kWh for HPC includes the sale price of the leccy. The subsidy element is 'only' about 5p/kWh.

CfD's set a strike price, which the company gets 'topped up too', so if they sell at the expected wholesale price of approx £50/MWh in the late 2020's early 2030's, then they get a top up of £50/MWh. If the market price is lower, they get more, if the price is higher they get less, and if they sell at above the strike price, then the extra gets paid back into the LCF subsidy pot.

So on average they will get about 5p/kWh (based on NAO predictions).

The outgoing PV FiT rate is less than 4p/kWh. [Note the export payment is not a subsidy, and can be equated to the selling price of HPC's leccy.]

So, the government is to remove a subsidy to households, that can deliver clean leccy today, and is already cheaper than it intends to pay for nuclear in 10yrs time.

Also worth note.

The FiT is for 20yrs, whilst the HPC CfD is for 35yrs (RE CfD's are for 15yrs). Whilst HPC will most likely generate for up to 60yrs, I think it's fair to say that PV won't need a subsidy in 20yrs time, so 20yrs is a max, v's the 35yrs for nuclear.

Demand side PV generates on the .... well, demand side, so losses across the HV and LV grids are saved. These are about 8%, so through either export or offset, demand side generation displaces approx 108% of large scale supply side generation.

Demand side generation, especially from PV, can benefit long term from storage. That means daytime PV generation displacing demand from the grid in the early evening - not only is peak demand more costly, pushing up the average price of leccy, but it's also the most carbon intensive, since that's when more and more generation capacity is brought on line to meet demand. If the demand side invests in storage, then everyone benefits from this but without having to pay/invest in supply side storage (unless grants are offered for storage, in which case we will all pay a contribution, rather than for all of it).

The FiT subsidy goes straight back into the UK economy, whereas the HPC subsidy will go to the owners/investors which are the Chinese government and the French government (owners of EDF), thus leaving the UK economy.

PV (and other RE) on the demand side is educational, aspirational, and might one day even become required under new buildings regs.

System

M0ney wrote: »

Is it possible to turn this decision around? I was going to write to my MP about it, he is a Tory.


To me removing the FiT smacks of nothing but anti-green. Especially when you consider that Hinkley point would now be getting well over 10p/KWh, there's no reason why we can't give at least that to those producing electricity through solar.

That I doubt whilst there is a Conservative Govt in power. They has just cut the PICG rebate for EVs and totally removed the £2.5K PHEV rebate. If Labour gets in, no doubt they will restore FITs back to the 2010 level adjusted for RPI with the money coming from Jack and his Beanstalk.

I'll get my coat.

pinnks

The OP asked for solar PV in a nutshell, so here goes.

If you install before March 2019 and your EPC rating is D or better ( think it's still D) you can qualify for the Feed-in-Tariff (FiT). This is made up of two elements. 3.86p for each kWh you generate and 5.24p for 50% of what you generate as a deemed export.

So, in simple terms it's currently 6.48p for every kWh generated. As already mentioned, depending on where you are, the orientation of your roof(s) and whether you have shading on the relevant roof you could generate about 3,700 to 4,000 kWh per year from a 4kWp PV system. That would be between £240 and £260 per year tax free.

In addition you will of course use some of the electricity you generate and probably become more energy-aware and use less generally. Own-consumption may save you another £120 or so per year and becoming more energy-aware could save a shed-load depending on how far you are down that path already.

Realistically you may save, say, £400 in the first year and that amount adjusted for inflation (CPI) for each of the next 20 years. So, perhaps £8000 overall. After that you carry on using what you generate but the FiT ceases after 20 years.

You are not limited to a 4kWp system. 3.68kWp is the larges you can go without permission from the local grid operator but you can have more panels and limit the amount the inverter can process. This can be useful if you have, say one roof facing east and one facing west. One roof will get the morning sun and a bit after midday; the other will kick in around midday and give you generation until the sun goes down.

The panels should last 20 years+ but no one knows for certain yet. The inverter may need replacing after 10 years but you can get extended warrantees to cover that. But you should think about needing perhaps £1000 at some point over the next 20 years if one of those eventualities transpires...

A 4kWp system is probably going to cost about £4,000 to £5,000 but you will need to shop around and share your research here as loads of people will chip in to pass on their experience and knowledge.

If you were minded to go ahead you have plenty of time if you kick off the research now.

HTH