BW legal letter of claim

clarem1984

[FONT=&quot]Hi Guys,[/FONT]

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[FONT=&quot]So my hubby is away for another 4 months min and today I opened some of his post (at his request). In it is a letter of claim from BW Legal regarding a PCN from April (Link to letter above, but its the bog standard one other people get). It wasn't him who was driving and the driver was parking in an out of hours hospital drop in centre when they were visiting family so did not know the site well. The driver said there were no clear signs and didn't see any parking meters and would have paid if there knew they were supposed to. Unfortunately as we don't live near the site I cannot go and take pictures of the signs (if any) and since the incident happened a while ago the parking area could have changed in that time. [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]So I have read through the newbie info on this site and have created a draft response. If someone could just give me their thoughts on if it is ok to send? [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Also if this does go to court, is it possible that I could represent my husband in his absence? Or would the date get deferred to when he has returned home?
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[FONT=&quot]response letter:[/FONT]
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[FONT=&quot] BW legal
Enterprise House
Apex View
Leeds
West Yorkshire
LS11 9BH

29th September 2018

Your Ref: ****

Dear Sir/ Madam,

I am in receipt of your Letter of Claim dated 26th September 2018. For future correspondence, please can these be sent to the following address only:

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The letter contains insufficient details of the claim and fails to provide copies of evidence to which any court proceedings would rely upon.

You and your client must be aware that on 01 October 2017 a new protocol was introduced that applies to debt claims. Since proceedings have not yet been issued, the new protocol clearly applies and must be complied with.

The letter is very vague and breaches both the requirements of the previously applicable Practice Direction - Pre-Action Conduct and the new Pre-Action Protocol for Debt Claims (paragraphs 6 and 7). Please treat this letter as a formal request for all of the documents / information and evidence that the protocol requires your client to provide. Your client must not issue proceedings without complying with that protocol and I reserve the right to draw any failure of the Claimant to comply with the protocol to the attention of the Judge presiding over the case and to ask the court to stay the claim and order your client to comply with its pre-action obligations.

I require your client to comply with its obligations by sending me the following information/documents:

1. An explanation of the cause of action
2. Whether you or the client are pursuing me as driver or keeper
3. Whether you or the client are relying on the provisions of Schedule 4 of POFA 2012
4. What the details of the claim are; where it is claimed the vehicle was parked, for how long, how the monies being claimed arose and have been calculated including any interest and administration charges
5. Is the claim for a contractual breach? If so, what is the date of the agreement? The names of the parties to it and provide to me a copy of that contract.
6. Is the claim for trespass? If so, provide details.
7. A plan showing where any signs were displayed
8. Details of the signs displayed (size of sign or signs, size of font, height at which displayed)

Until you or your client has provided this information, I am unable to respond properly to the alleged claim and to consider my position in relation to it, and it will be a waste of costs and court time for you or your client to issue proceedings. Should you or your client do so, then I will seek an immediate stay according to paragraph 15(b) of the Practice Direction and order that this information be provided.

Yours sincerely


****


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Coupon-mad

Unfortunately as we don't live near the site I cannot go and take pictures of the signs (if any) and since the incident happened a while ago the parking area could have changed in that time.

OK, so firstly submit a SAR (subject access request, under the GDPR) to the parking firm themselves, addressed to their Data Privacy team (in you husband's name not yours!) and demand for all letters, all photos and all data held.

Attach proof of who the data subject is and their connection to the car (V5 document) so as not to delay the SAR, and do not write it on his behalf in your name!

Write as if you were actually him.

Also send a copy of the SAR to BW Legal, or the draft you've shown above (doesn't matter really) but finish it by telling BW Legal that due to the SAR the Defendant has sent to their client, there is an 'objection to processing' data and a restriction must be placed on the file, to avoid a claim being issued whilst the SAR and data concerns are investigated and replied to, and for a reasonable period (suggest an extra 21 days 'on hold') once the SAR response is posted by their client.

Also if this does go to court, is it possible that I could represent my husband in his absence? Or would the date get deferred to when he has returned home?

No you can't, but you can go with him if he is around, or he can ask for it to be heard 'on the papers' only, in his absence, if the date clashes with the dates he gives the court in his DQ (N180 form) later on, telling them which dates he can't attend.

The date will likely be in the Spring.

So this is all surmountable.

clarem1984

Thank you very much for your response. Ill add in the sentences you suggested into my letter to BW Legal and Ill also put a copy of the SAR in there.



Ill also send the SAR to Total Parking Solutions.



Am I right in thinking that by doing the request, the information held wont have been complaint under the new data protection guidelines?

Coupon-mad

Not sure what you mean. The data held might well be compliant with the GDPR but the purpose of getting it is to show you the scammer's hand, before the court claim!

clarem1984

so is that letting me see all the information they hold?

Coupon-mad

Divulging all data held, is what a SAR is (it's all over this forum, and easy to Google).

clarem1984

so here is my amended letter. is the section i added in that you provided ok?


BW legal
Enterprise House
Apex View
Leeds
West Yorkshire
LS11 9BH

29th September 2018

Your Ref:

Dear Sir/ Madam,

I am in receipt of your Letter of Claim dated 26th September 2018. For future correspondence, please can these be sent to the following address only:

***

The letter contains insufficient details of the claim and fails to provide copies of evidence to which any court proceedings would rely upon.

You and your client must be aware that on 01 October 2017 a new protocol was introduced that applies to debt claims. Since proceedings have not yet been issued, the new protocol clearly applies and must be complied with.

The letter is very vague and breaches both the requirements of the previously applicable Practice Direction - Pre-Action Conduct and the new Pre-Action Protocol for Debt Claims (paragraphs 6 and 7). Please treat this letter as a formal request for all of the documents / information and evidence that the protocol requires your client to provide. Your client must not issue proceedings without complying with that protocol and I reserve the right to draw any failure of the Claimant to comply with the protocol to the attention of the Judge presiding over the case and to ask the court to stay the claim and order your client to comply with its pre-action obligations.

I require your client to comply with its obligations by sending me the following information/documents:

1. An explanation of the cause of action
2. Whether you or the client are pursuing me as driver or keeper
3. Whether you or the client are relying on the provisions of Schedule 4 of POFA 2012
4. What the details of the claim are; where it is claimed the vehicle was parked, for how long, how the monies being claimed arose and have been calculated including any interest and administration charges
5. Is the claim for a contractual breach? If so, what is the date of the agreement? The names of the parties to it and provide to me a copy of that contract.
6. Is the claim for trespass? If so, provide details.
7. A plan showing where any signs were displayed
8. Details of the signs displayed (size of sign or signs, size of font, height at which displayed)

Until you or your client has provided this information, I am unable to respond properly to the alleged claim and to consider my position in relation to it, and it will be a waste of costs and court time for you or your client to issue proceedings. Should you or your client do so, then I will seek an immediate stay according to paragraph 15(b) of the Practice Direction and order that this information be provided.
I am also attached a copy of the Subject Access Request (SAR) that I have sent to your client. There is an objection to processing data and a restriction must be placed on the file, to avoid a claim being issued whilst the SAR and data concerns are investigated and replied to. I would request a period of 21 days for this once the SAR response is posted by your client.

Yours sincerely

clarem1984

and here is my SAR request, using the template that was on here:


Data Privacy Team
Total Parking Solutions LTD
3 Kings Court
Kettering Venture Park
Kettering
NN15 6WJ

29th September 2018

Your Ref:

Vehicle Reg:

Dear Sir/ Madam,[FONT=&quot][/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Subject Access Request[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot](name and address)
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[FONT=&quot]I am writing to you in your capacity as data protection officer for your company – Total Parking Solutions LTD I have reason to believe you hold personal data on myself as a vehicle I own and am the registered keeper for visits car parking sites managed by your company. Such data is collected by your ANPR camera systems. It should be noted that contrary to article 13 of GDPR legislation no privacy information was provided to myself, the data subject, at the time of collection. I am therefore compelled into making this request for access to personal data pursuant to Article 15 of the General Data Protection Regulation which, as you will be aware, came into force on 25 May 2018.

The vehicle in question is a (make) with VRM:

Should you require further documentation necessary to verify my identity please contact me.

I would like you to be aware at the outset, that I anticipate a reply to my request within one month as required under Article 12, failing which I will be forwarding my inquiry with a letter of complaint to the Information Commissioners Office (ICO).

Please advise as to the following:[/FONT]

1. [FONT=&quot]Please confirm to me whether or not my personal data is being processed. If it is, please provide me with the categories of personal data you have about me in your files and databases.[/FONT]
   1. [FONT=&quot]In particular, please tell me what you know about me in your information systems, whether or not contained in databases, and including e-mail, documents on your networks, or voice or other media that you may store.[/FONT]
   2. [FONT=&quot]Additionally, please advise me in which countries my personal data is stored, or accessible from. In case you make use of cloud services to store or process my data, please include the countries in which the servers are located where my data are or were (in the past 12 months) stored.[/FONT]
   3. [FONT=&quot]Please provide me with a copy of, or access to, my personal data that you have or are processing.[/FONT]
2. [FONT=&quot]Please provide me with a detailed accounting of the specific uses and lawful basis that you have made, are making or will be making of my personal data.[/FONT]
3. [FONT=&quot]Please provide a list of all third parties with whom you have (or may have) shared my personal data.[/FONT]
   1. [FONT=&quot]If you cannot identify with certainty the specific third parties to whom you have disclosed my personal data, please provide a list of third parties to whom you may have disclosed my personal data.[/FONT]
   2. [FONT=&quot]Please also identify which jurisdictions that you have identified in 1-1 above that these third parties with whom you have or may have shared my personal data, from which these third parties have stored or can access my personal data. Please also provide insight in the legal grounds for transferring my personal data to these jurisdictions. Where you have done so, or are doing so, on the basis of appropriate safeguards, please provide a copy.[/FONT]
   3. [FONT=&quot]Additionally, I would like to know what safeguards have been put in place in relation to these third parties that you have identified in relation to the transfer of my personal data.[/FONT]
4. [FONT=&quot]Please advise how long you store my personal data, and if retention is based upon the category of personal data, please identify how long each category is retained.[/FONT]
5. [FONT=&quot]If you are additionally collecting personal data about me from any source other than me, please provide me with all information about their source, as referred to in Article 14 of the GDPR.[/FONT]
6. [FONT=&quot]If you are making automated decisions about me, including profiling, whether or not on the basis of Article 22 of the GDPR, please provide me with information concerning the basis for the logic in making such automated decisions, and the significance and consequences of such processing.[/FONT]

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Yours Sincerely,[/FONT]

Coupon-mad

The SAR is very generic, and if it were me I would not ask the wasted questions where the answer is known:

Please advise as to the following:
Please confirm to me whether or not my personal data is being processed. If it is, please provide me with the categories of personal data you have about me in your files and databases.
In particular, please tell me what you know about me in your information systems, whether or not contained in databases, and including e-mail, documents on your networks, or voice or other media that you may store.
Additionally, please advise me in which countries my personal data is stored, or accessible from. In case you make use of cloud services to store or process my data, please include the countries in which the servers are located where my data are or were (in the past 12 months) stored.

Please also identify which jurisdictions that you have identified in 1-1 above that these third parties with whom you have or may have shared my personal data, from which these third parties have stored or can access my personal data. Please also provide insight in the legal grounds for transferring my personal data to these jurisdictions. Where you have done so, or are doing so, on the basis of appropriate safeguards, please provide a copy.
Additionally, I would like to know what safeguards have been put in place in relation to these third parties that you have identified in relation to the transfer of my personal data.

That's not specific to parking cases and is waffle, IMHO.

Surely you just want to say something more along the lines of:

''oi, show me all letters, all photos, all electronic records of 'case status' and DVLA look-up, and decision-making and sharing of my data''

Then end it saying (of course) that this is not only a SAR but is an objection to processing - which they must also answer - and that they must restrict the data processing and put any litigation on hold for a reasonable time for the data subject to read & digest the evidence and data they produce, and you suggest that 21 days after the DPO sends the data and replies to the objection, is a reasonable time to continue to restrict data.

And tell them to tell their solicitors to put the litigation on hold for the same period.

And attach proof of who the data subject is and their connection to the car (V5 document) so as not to delay the SAR, and do not write it on his behalf in your name!

A much simpler letter.

You have no idea how much I detest the current need for everyone to want a template!

clarem1984

I'm sorry I'm being a sheep! Ive just never seen a SAR before and its all making me rather nervous, but I'm massively appreciating your help and advice! it feels a little like firms like BW are hoping all the legal jargon will get the better of us and make us all bow down.



I think ill leave it tonight and look at it again tomorrow and just put it into my own words like you suggest and stop with the piffle! Ill post tomorrow a shorter and more direct SAR. but i 100% will put all the letters in my husbands name.



thank you.