VCS Letter Before Claim, Flora St.

sensai

As they have admitted their windscreen ticket is not a NTD, they are trying to justify using the ANPR process on a non-ANPR park?

I read somewhere that a brief summaryof points is useful at the hearing?

Coupon-mad

As they have admitted their windscreen ticket is not a NTD, they are trying to justify using the ANPR process on a non-ANPR park?

Yes, which they are (sort of) allowed to do but your weapons against that would be the IPC CoP which I think sets out just two routes (ANPR or not) and the claim number & details of the case I told you about.

You need to read that winning thread I told you about as it isn't that simple to explain to a Judge. I have no time to do searches that posters can and need to do themselves to find threads, and it's better practice for newer posters to see how good the search function is when you change the ADVANCED search to 'SHOW RESULTS AS POSTS'.

Edit: When reading another post I found this, with the link & the wording you need:

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/6003359/vcs-defence-advice

sensai

Coupon-mad- "Yes, which they are (sort of) allowed to do but your weapons against that would be the IPC CoP which I think sets out just two routes (ANPR or not) and the claim number & details of the case I told you about."

Ok, I've nailed that.

The Claimant claims he is the principal in the contract , not the agent for the landowners. How is this?

Snakes_Belly

Richie won in Sheffield against VCS. Keep Calm and Carry on won against Excel in a very similar scenario.

The Vine case is about contract but I don't get why they cite the case because Miss Vine won on appeal. She did not see the signs. VCS and Excel take a few words from this case and cite them but they are not in context.

Coupon-mad

sensai wrote: »

The Claimant claims he is the principal in the contract , not the agent for the landowners. How is this?

Because they are the principal in the contract offered by their sign.

sensai

I'm pleased to say I won the case, although not quite in the way I expected, but soley on the signs.


I'll post up more details in due course.

Redx

well done , signage always plays a crucial role in forming the contract (or not) , very few signs are up to the Beavis standard


another one bites the dust

sensai

There were 3 VCS cases that afternoon and I was the last; I think the judge had made up her mind already before we went in. She was impatient and a bit sharp at times, possibly because time was short and it had been a long day!

She set the scene by emphasizing that she just wanted the “facts”. My arguments on the windscreen ticket, CoP and VCS contract weren’t accepted, in fact she said it was just a warning note and PoFA para. 9 applied - rather surprising as one of the opening statements in VCS’s 80 paragraph W.S. said “It is the role of the Patrol Officers to issue a PCN to any vehicles identified in breach of the Terms and Conditions”, which to me says they must affix a NTD to the vehicle? I was at this stage checking I’d brought my wallet.

She then moved on to the signs/ground markings and turned her focus on VCS’s rep.
My argument on the ambiguous signage and absence of suitable ground markings were accepted. I find for the Defendant.

Job done, wallet returned to pocket.

As an aside, VCSs rep was some kind of travelling freelance operator who represents several parking companies, accident claims etc. He was quite a nice chap, I had a long chat with him during the hour and a half waiting time. He said it would cost VCS around £300 altogether if they lost.

Called to do some shopping at Flora St on the day after and noticed that a pole sign had been removed. I’ll check again next time I’m in.

Thank you for all your prompt and valuable assistance.

Jussy1603

Stick to the not parked in a restricted zone argument. I've literally just walked put of court having won due to this exact point.
Due to the area being next to a hatched zone but not actually marked as such was what won it.
Make sure you state everything you'd like to discuss on the day in your statement as they won't take any further evidence on the day.
Also signage is hung at 2300mm instead of the advised between 900mm-1500mm.
I'm happy to send you pictures of many other users parked in the same place that I've been collecting for months.
Good luck

Snakes_Belly

Well done.

From my limited experience CoP's are not worth the paper that they are written on. They are just platitudes and the judges do not seem to take much notice of them.