Buying a flat with potential upstairs neighbour issues

sazzle0987

Hello all

I'm looking for advice/opinions on a flat purchase.

I have found a leasehold flat in a town with a good commute to where I work. It ticks all my "must-have" boxes and some of my "nice-to-have" boxes without any compromises. The price is ok-ish but I would definitely see if I could get a decent negotiation going.

It is in a development of about 80 flats, different sizes, with several 3 - 4 storey blocks with a little bit of lawn around. During my second viewing I had a good walk around the outside of the block and was happy with the look of the brickwork/windows on the flat I was viewing (1st floor with one floor above).

However I noticed that the flat above (same layout as far as I can tell) shows one very concerning thing: all of the windows has visible spots of black mould on the inside of the window panes. I could see this clearly as the white/cream coloured curtains were closed. The window frames of the upstairs flat are wooden rather than the uPVC double glazing on others in the block - I haven't checked them all but most already doubled glazed. It's a mid 80s or early 90s built block. I presume the upstairs neighbour has issues with damp and / or never opens their windows or cleans. No other flats in the block has such issues and generally it seems like a decent development, not massively posh but decent.

Less concerning but slightly odd was also that one of the windows of the upstairs flat had empty mineral water bottles stacked up on the windowsill up to about half way up the window.

I was preparing to make an offer for the flat but this has really put me off.

I don't care if my neighbours want to live in a dirty environment themselves (or indeed don't like taking out their recycling) but in a block of flats I really worry that this indicates that in future I would end up having problems caused by the upstairs neighbour - whether by mould issues somehow affecting my flat too, something horrid coming through the ceiling or by someone who doesn't seem to care the condition of the place that they live in making it less than pleasant to live there.

I have emailed the estate agent describing what I saw and to ask if they know of any issues with the neighbour or if they can find out same from the management company. The agent's letting team has been letting out the property I viewed for a number of years and the vendor lives abroad. When I viewed the flat the first time I asked the tenants whether the neighbours were nice and they said they didn't know them much but people are nice enough.

My questions are:
1) Am I being overly cautious in letting this put me off what would otherwise be a very good option to buy? Would this worry you to the same extent?
2) Does anyone know whether the management company or freeholder would have right to tell the leaseholder to sort out their windows and / or clean properly? I am not sure of the standard wording in a lease.
3) What is the agent likely to do in this case? I am assuming they will reply caveating heavily and saying they don't know of any issues but can't be sure or something similar. Am I likely to be put down as a problematic buyer?

Thanks so much in advance for any thoughts and for reading a lengthy post.

Sapphire

For myself, I would avoid the place and try to find a flat in a house, ideally with just a couple of flats in it and a nice long lease or share of freehold.

This seems to me to be a somewhat seedy development (but then I would never go for developments of modern flats), and the place you are looking at appears as though it could be especially vulnerable to actions of those above, particularly if the owner lives abroad an probably takes no interest in the place.

Crashy_Time

This must be the absolute price peak now for the market, although transactions are already well down, but if you have doubts already just think how bad it will be when the neighbour turns out to be a late night noise maker and the news is full of prices falling stories? Run away.

DaftyDuck

You would buy a flat without knocking on the door to chat to the neighbours? I wouldnt!

Go and see the neighbours, ask about the building, their neighbours, general news, just chat. Do it with the upstairs neighbour too...

robatwork

Upstairs neighbours can ruin your life.

Knock on their door and you will probably gauge what sort of people they are within about 5 seconds. They may invite you in for some tea. They may grunt at you as you spy the tap dancing shoes in the hallway.

Mojisola

sazzle0987 wrote: »

However I noticed that the flat above (same layout as far as I can tell) shows one very concerning thing: all of the windows has visible spots of black mould on the inside of the window panes. I could see this clearly as the white/cream coloured curtains were closed. The window frames of the upstairs flat are wooden rather than the uPVC double glazing on others in the block - I haven't checked them all but most already doubled glazed. It's a mid 80s or early 90s built block. I presume the upstairs neighbour has issues with damp and / or never opens their windows or cleans. No other flats in the block has such issues and generally it seems like a decent development, not massively posh but decent.

Less concerning but slightly odd was also that one of the windows of the upstairs flat had empty mineral water bottles stacked up on the windowsill up to about half way up the window.

robatwork wrote: »

Upstairs neighbours can ruin your life.

Knock on their door and you will probably gauge what sort of people they are within about 5 seconds. They may invite you in for some tea. They may grunt at you as you spy the tap dancing shoes in the hallway.

Or you may find you will be living below a hoarder.

BlackBird75

Crashy_Time wrote: »

This must be the absolute price peak now for the market, although transactions are already well down, but if you have doubts already just think how bad it will be when the neighbour turns out to be a late night noise maker and the news is full of prices falling stories? Run away.

Or even worse, a whole cohort of BTL landlords getting hit by a combination of:
rising interest rates
Reduced tax deductions on mortgage interest
Falling property prices
Rent control
More pro-tenant laws against eviction
More unemployment amongst tenants in a recession
Rising rent arrears

I'm guessing a few landlords would be tempted to post the keys back to their mortgage lender and try to hide...!

All a bit far fetched, but hey it's a lazy Sunday afternoon, so why not speculate..?!

PasturesNew

If you're an assertive person, who isn't afraid of others - and if you intended to live there for donkeys' years, then the chances are that you'd be able to nip any nonsense in the bud .... and then outlive the resident above (who has probably been there since it was built).

Most people wouldn't fall into these categories - and I bet you don't either.

As much as I hate to say it .... you have spotted something which could cause angst for the duration of your residency .... so leave it.

BlackBird75

PasturesNew wrote: »

If you're an assertive person, who isn't afraid of others - and if you intended to live there for donkeys' years, then the chances are that you'd be able to nip any nonsense in the bud ....

I doubt it.
There's often little that can be done about a nightmare neighbour, no matter how "assertive" someone is.
Just look at the other thread, same advice about keeping noise diaries etc. It's all clutching at straws (including my advice).

In reality, if you don't like the neighbours, the only thing you can do is move.

sazzle0987

Thanks very much everyone for your replies, much appreciated.

bouicca21

If I were a betting person I'd have maybe fiver on this being an elderly person who has been there for ever, has never refurbished the flat (doesn't see why it would be needed and grudges unnecessary expense), has allowed the lease to run down to below 80 years, and whose eyesight is too dim to notice the mould. Probably a bit cantankerous.

If I'm right this person (I am so resisting using the female pronoun) will be there until death, at which stage the place will be fully renovated by the heirs/probate buyers.

Go knock on the door. If I'm right then do a quick calculation about lifespan. If I'm wrong and it's a much younger person, run.